SF and People of Color

[DevilEyes]

"Blacks in Space"-an interesting article posted on the American Prospect website.

http://prospect.org/cs/articles?article=blacks_in_space

A rather stupid article, I'd say.


So what exactly is the author's point? That Uhura should not be in the movie? That Uhura should not be a communications officer, as she's always been? That Uhura being in the movie as a linguist and communications officer ("answering the phone" as the author would put it) is a sign of racism? That they should have gotten rid of her instead? Does the author actually have a point? Or at least one that makes any sense?

And really... it is common knowledge that Eko was killed off because Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje wanted to leave the show, so to name is as an example of the showrunner's racism is idiotic.

I believe the point is: Uhura is given a little more to do than answer hailing frequencies...

She has quite a lot of screentime and about as much to do as McCoy, a main character in TOS; we learned that she is a highly talented linguist, not a "phone operator in space"; she discovers a piece of information that turns out to be crucial for the plot; she has a romance, the lack of which in TOS is one of the author's main gripes about her role in TOS in this article (which is also an interracial/interspecies romance) - but the author decides to ignore all this and pretend that she's just sitting and saying "Hailing frequencies open, sir", which she's not. Uhura only doesn't get to beam to planets and fight hand-to-hand, but that would've been really far-fetched since there's no need or reason for a communications officer to do that. It seems like the author decided what to write beforehand, no matter what Uhura's actual role is.

And, I think it was only common knowledge for folks who actually followed the behind the scenes of 'Lost' (particularly online) and knew the reasons as to why Adewale left the show.

(...)
Again, I think it was a well-written article.

So the article was well-written because the author did not do their homework? How about a little basic online research as to the reason why an actor left the show?

And, as has already been pointed out, funny how the author chooses to ignore major black SF characters, like Benjamin Sisko, who can't possibly be denigrated as unimportant, killed off, etc. If the facts don't fit with your argument, just ignore the facts.

Again, we are supposed to be in a future with different skin tones, so onscreen or off-screen, the Andorians would have been in talks with humans from different ethnicities and hues.

Since when are racial prejudices grounded in reality ?

Exactly. Maybe the first humans Andorians met were white, and they picked "pink skin" as a most obvious physical feature of humans, and that's how the stereotype and the racial slur was created. Meeting humans of different skin colors would have changed the stereotype no more than meeting black Africans who don't have thick lips or a wide nose was able to change the common European stereotype about black people.

 

[Sci]

I think the article makes a good overall point -- American science fiction tends to postulate a future in which European-Americans or Europeans hold a disproportionately large percentage of the positions of power, prestige, and influence (as compared to their percentage of the entire human population), and in which African-Americans, Asian-Americans, or non-Europeans hold a disproportionately large percentage of positions of support, service, or subservience. The same thing is true of sex: Most U.S. science fiction postulates a future in which males hold the same disproportionately large percentage of positions of power and influence, and females hold the same disproportionately large percentage of positions of service and subservience, that they do today.

It's ethnocentrism, not racism per se.

I also think that the article at times takes its examples too far -- not recognizing the ways in which U.S. science fiction has improved (Sisko), or in which updates of classic sci-fi have tried to rectify the ethnocentrism of the past by, for instance, making nuUhura into a very strong, very assertive and competent individual who does more than just answer the space phone (even giving her more screen time than McCoy, who was a major character in TOS).

 

[Teelie]

I wouldn't go quite that far. Most of the subserviants are a mix. You don't see a white male in the command seat then a lot of minority or female subserviant members of the crew or society and fewer whites. There is a large number of white males in there too. I assume you are not meaning it that way, the phrasing still reminds me of those horrible stereotypes of a single white male on the top and a bunch of "inferior" people below him.

It is also true the majority of the man in charge is indeed male, though you can easily take the race or ethnicity and switch it depending on what part of the world you're in. It's hardly a USA/European exclusive. Though I guess we're talking predominately the US and Europe to a lesser extent since the majority of us are from one of the two.

Ironically, the very thing you are saying happens in science fiction is what we're doing in this thread right now; excluding those who are not apart of our culture or ethnicity.

 

[firehawk12]

I guess the question is whether or not racial normativity or ethnocentrism is as "damaging" as "real" racism.

I'm still not sure what I think about Firefly for example. Like, they actually tried when creating the world... but then kind of dropped the ball when it came to actually casting the characters.

But of course a lot of it is economics. You'll want to make a show that's primarily in English and features well known (ie, white or black) actors in order to sell a show that will hopefully make money.

 

[Harvey]

I'd say ethnocentrism is unimaginative. Science fiction that postulates a future where Indians and Chinese will not have a large influence strikes me as lazy and Amerocentric.

 

[Hoshi_Mayweather]

I think the article makes a good overall point -- American science fiction tends to postulate a future in which European-Americans or Europeans hold a disproportionately large percentage of the positions of power, prestige, and influence (as compared to their percentage of the entire human population), and in which African-Americans, Asian-Americans, or non-Europeans hold a disproportionately large percentage of positions of support, service, or subservience. The same thing is true of sex: Most U.S. science fiction postulates a future in which males hold the same disproportionately large percentage of positions of power and influence, and females hold the same disproportionately large percentage of positions of service and subservience, that they do today.

It's ethnocentrism, not racism per se.

I also think that the article at times takes its examples too far -- not recognizing the ways in which U.S. science fiction has improved (Sisko), or in which updates of classic sci-fi have tried to rectify the ethnocentrism of the past by, for instance, making nuUhura into a very strong, very assertive and competent individual who does more than just answer the space phone (even giving her more screen time than McCoy, who was a major character in TOS).

Good post...

I wouldn't go quite that far. Most of the subserviants are a mix. You don't see a white male in the command seat then a lot of minority or female subserviant members of the crew or society and fewer whites. There is a large number of white males in there too. I assume you are not meaning it that way, the phrasing still reminds me of those horrible stereotypes of a single white male on the top and a bunch of "inferior" people below him.

It is also true the majority of the man in charge is indeed male, though you can easily take the race or ethnicity and switch it depending on what part of the world you're in. It's hardly a USA/European exclusive. Though I guess we're talking predominately the US and Europe to a lesser extent since the majority of us are from one of the two.

Ironically, the very thing you are saying happens in science fiction is what we're doing in this thread right now; excluding those who are not apart of our culture or ethnicity.

Good post.

I guess the question is whether or not racial normativity or ethnocentrism is as "damaging" as "real" racism.

I'm still not sure what I think about Firefly for example. Like, they actually tried when creating the world... but then kind of dropped the ball when it came to actually casting the characters.

But of course a lot of it is economics. You'll want to make a show that's primarily in English and features well known (ie, white or black) actors in order to sell a show that will hopefully make money.

There are also Hispanic/Latino and Asian actors as well...

I'd say ethnocentrism is unimaginative. Science fiction that postulates a future where Indians and Chinese will not have a large influence strikes me as lazy and Amerocentric.

I came to the same conclusion when watching the opening of ENT. Too, I would think the Russians would be in there as well in regards to space travel.

 

[firehawk12]

Well, like I said, when the Hispanic population of the US becomes the "majority" in 2050 or whenever, casting only English speaking white actors will surely become a money-losing proposition.

At the very least SF/F content producers will be more ethnically diverse based simply on the numbers.

 

[Hoshi_Mayweather]

Well, like I said, when the Hispanic population of the US becomes the "majority" in 2050 or whenever, casting only English speaking white actors will surely become a money-losing proposition.

At the very least SF/F content producers will be more ethnically diverse based simply on the numbers.

In regards to SF/F: I would think it a a shame to wait about 40 years until Hispanics get recognized fully; I'm sure they're some (who are Hispanic/Latino) who want some change to happen now...or at least some effort to have some representation.

(As I mentioned in previous posts: As an Asian-American, I'm still waiting for Asians to come out on their own; I would like to see some effort towards proper representation, while those in my community try to put their own voices out there).

 

[StarTrek1701]

Well, like I said, when the Hispanic population of the US becomes the "majority" in 2050 or whenever,

Assuming I live that long, it'll be a harsh world then.