Spoilers Seeming contradiction between S2 finale and Season 1 (spoilers for S2 finale)

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Discovery' started by Yistaan, Apr 19, 2019.

  1. Yistaan

    Yistaan Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Fair enough, I guess it would only matter if Gorkon was Kol's brother or something.

    I'm actually more concerned now about the revelation in the interview http://trekcore.com/blog/2019/04/interview-star-trek-discovery-season-finale-michelle-paradise/ that Yeoman Colt was always meant to be an alien (and this is probably canonized in the credits?), as this completely messes up the plot of the Cage and the Talosian intentions of breeding her with Pike.
     
  2. Alan Roi

    Alan Roi Commodore Captain

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    Well, its been established that most humanoids can breed with each other in Trek, and hybrids often do have superior characteristics.
     
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  3. SolarisOne

    SolarisOne Captain Captain

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    Control abides. The future... is secure.
    Peter David takes this a step further. In New Frontier, most of his characters can interbreed without any intervention at all--Burgoyne 172 and Selar or Soleta and Calhoun, for instance. Thing is, both Burgy and Calhoun have iron-based blood and Vulcanoids have copper-based blood. I don't get how that is supposed to work.
     
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  4. Enterprise is Great

    Enterprise is Great Vice Admiral Admiral

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    ^^^ It's magic.
     
  5. Longinus

    Longinus Rear Admiral Commodore

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    Sounds disgusting, I'm glad they didn't copy that.
     
  6. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    Yes, rather than a secret Federation cyber-Stasi of dubious efficacy but terrifying power, we got a public Federation actual-Stasi in the retooled Section 31 that's just completely inept. So much better.

    Also, book!Control's pervasiveness meant people were actually careful about when and how they talked about discovering it and dealing with it, rather than speaking their plans aloud next to voice-controlled computers they knew TV!Control had infiltrated which they then used in an attempt to purge Control. "Spock, I'm going to tell the computer Control is in our plan and what we expect to see if it works, then tell the computer to do that. When the display says we're successful, I will blithely assume that's the case, and not that the computer, which is the thing working against us, is just showing me what I want to see."
     
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  7. gblews

    gblews Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    In 70 to 80 years or so, after a generation has died off, if Burnham and Disco have been historically buried, no one will remember her or Discovery. Any Vulcans who are still alive would certainly not tell, and even they will eventually die off.

    So, what's so hard to believe about erasing Burnham and Disco from history?
     
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  8. Yistaan

    Yistaan Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Picard mind melded with Sarek. Then demanded reopening Spore Drive research offscreen in TNG. :lol:
     
  9. Longinus

    Longinus Rear Admiral Commodore

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    It is not better, both are terrible. I don't want any sort of Federation Stasi. "What is the cost of paradise?" questioning is one thing that needs to stop. The 'cost' isn't having secret murder squads of leather-clad edgelords, it is trying to be decent people really hard.
     
  10. Agony_Boothb

    Agony_Boothb Commodore Commodore

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    Turns out there was never a Michael Burnham who started the Klingon War it was woman named Nicholas Singepastrami who was raised on Andoria by Shran and his human wife Angela. She had a half Human-half Andorian brother named Shrock.
     
  11. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    The Klingons also altered their records. According to General Martok, Klingons never considered a direct attack on Earth. Which would seem to contradict Klingons having a beachhead in the Sol system and a Klingon attack fleet making it all the way to Earth orbit before being called back. But if that's been wiped from the records, then Martok is telling the truth, as he knows it.
     
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  12. BillJ

    BillJ History’s Greatest Monster Premium Member

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    Then you're just diving into hardcore fantasy. Humanity will never be on the same page to that degree.
     
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  13. BillJ

    BillJ History’s Greatest Monster Premium Member

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    Which is silly, as they would have no reason to alter their records.
     
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  14. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    The whole change the records because canon is silly to begin with. But if we feel we need to find a logical reason for why would the Klingons would feel compelled to change their records, Tyler asked L'Rell and she can't say no to him. It makes about as much sense as this whole scenario anyway.
     
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  15. Kemaiku

    Kemaiku Admiral Admiral

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    Hemocyanin is found in animals on Earth so it can be manufactured naturally by mammals here. Vulcans have large amounts of it and hybrids with Humans have small amounts of hemoglobin. So oddly both species have each others main oxygen carrier in reversed amounts in cross breeding, implying a biological pathway exists to allow it without medical intervention.
     
  16. Yistaan

    Yistaan Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    What episode did Martok say this?
     
  17. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    The Changing Face of Evil, in response to the Breen's attack on Earth. Here's the line:
     
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  18. Yistaan

    Yistaan Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    It's definitely a contradiction. In-universe, the only thing I can think of is that the Klingons rewrote history to erase the fact that L'Rell became chancellor through Federation blackmail.

    Gowron rewrote history to erase Picard's involvement in his election.
     
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  19. David cgc

    David cgc Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    I agree, which is why I preferred the novel to DSC’s take on the idea. Something that started as a glorified tip-line just kept getting more and more ambitious without anyone ever knowing, and when it was discovered and stopped, people asked themselves if they’d been living a lie and would decide, by their future actions without a secret murder-computer watching their backs, if that was the case.

    Conversely, DSC blithely asserts that hard men doing hard things is a necessary foundation for any democracy, that decency is a lie the sheeple are told to keep them compliant, and that everybody in charge knows about it, and it’s probably not a well-considered critique of human nature, but an excuse to keep Michelle Yeoh on the payroll by having her play Space-Bourne, so they can’t repudiate Section 31 in any meaningful way, which the books have.
     
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  20. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, like I said the official record was changed.
     
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