Spoilers Section 31 General Discussion Thread

[Tuskin38]

the Son'a producing white is mentioned in both Insurrection and DS9 IIRC. (Edit, Memory-Alpha says yes, Insurrection and the DS9 episode 'Penumbra')

The Deep Space Nine Transcripts - Penumbra

DAMAR: The Defiant is returning to Federation space. I'm ordering our ships to pursue.
WEYOUN: No. Divert them to the So'na outpost on Devos Two.
DAMAR: Why?
WEYOUN: We need their to help protect the new Ketracel white facility. The Federation has been made aware of its location.
DAMAR: Can't the So'na protect it?

The Movie Transcripts - Star Trek: Insurrection

[Enterprise library]

RIKER: Half a century ago they conquered two primitive races, the Tarlac and the Ellora, and then integrated them into their culture as a labour class. ...Look at this. The Son'a are known to have produced vast quantities of the narcotic ketracel-white.

 

[F. King Daniel]

I would argue it's not the virus as much as it's Odo that brings them to the table.

They do set up the war's ending in season 6 even before the virus becomes a thing for the Changelings. In "Favor the Bold," the Female Founder tells Weyoun that Odo's return to the Great Link is more important than even the Alpha Quadrant. And if you rewatch the scene where she agrees to give the order to the Jem'Hadar to stand down in the series finale, I always get the vibe that she's not only satisfied the Changeling's will be healed. The Female Founder seems content with the deal, because she's also forcing Odo to go home.

If you go back through the series, it's their need to connect with Odo that is their ultimate undoing.

The Great Link's need to call Odo home in season 3's "The Search" reveals their existence as the Founders of the Dominion.

It's their failure to understand why Odo remains at DS9 with Kira and the crew, and why Odo defends them against other Changelings, that leads to them to punishing him in season 4's "Broken Link," and infecting the entire Great Link with the Section 31 virus.

And in the end, it's Odo going home that causes their surrender.

I shall defer to your knowledge.

 

[Agony_Boothb]

Because the Spock-Sarek relationship for decades has been about the issues of how Spock made a choice to join Starfleet in order to go his own way. That his rejection of the Vulcan Science Academy is a moment where Sarek has to project Vulcan stoicism and disdain for an “illogical” decision, but on some level you get the sense that he respects Spock for bucking what was expected. But all of that is left unsaid, implied through the acting, and remains a major relationship issue within the franchise for decades.

When you shoehorn Burnham into that, and basically have Sarek screw over her application to the Vulcan Science Academy in order to favor Spock, I think it robs all of what was left to nuance and ambiguity, and underlines a definitive perception on those issues in an awkward way.

Also, I think part of what makes Spock’s upbringing tragic is the idea he only had his mother as a touchstone for his humanity on a planet full of Vulcans. Inserting Burnham into their family dynamic diminishes that idea.

Except that Burnham's rejection of Spock to protect him, lead him to try and be more vulcan to his detriment instead of embracing his human side. It made him believe that even humans would reject him and just isolated Spock further. It didn't diminish the tragedy it added depth to it.

 

[StarMan]

No.

I would love to talk about the show. I love the idea of a "not what Trek fans want" type show because I'm tired of comfort food attitude towards Trek. For all the clamoring that Trek "pushed limits" or was "on the cutting edge" a lot of the content feels less of that and more comfortable inside a little box.

Trek fans are a dying breed. "Not what Trek fans want" has been the MO by and large for the past decade while that elusive modern audience just keeps missing the boat!

A combination of nothing really to new to say about it and going off topic is the very nature of Trekbbs posting.

Perhaps because the speculation about the show has run its course after 100 pages of discussion here, and folks are now waiting to actually watch it in a couple of weeks, before continuing on ...

Because aside from a couple of Promos, the streaming film hasn't released yet. This is no different than movie threads before the film it's talking about is released.

Well, yeah. It just helped with the segue into taking a potshot at the film.

 

[DaveyNY]

Which would have occurred whether any of us had answered or not.
So that particular meme really is silly at this point.
All you did was add to the continuation of the convo that you attempted to mock.

 

[fireproof78]

Trek fans are a dying breed. "Not what Trek fans want" has been the MO by and large for the past decade while that elusive modern audience just keeps missing the boat!

Yes.

Which is why I see all the younger people posting about watching TOS and TNG for the first time.




Regardless, Paramount is going to try unless no new content is the desired goal.

 

[FredH]

Still rooting for that already failed project? Did you notice how very little advertising is shown for a „movie“ with a best actress academy award winner in it? They already gave up on that project, even before it got first released.

Seriously now, what is wrong with you guys? Do you feel cozy in your little thought-jail bubble. Why the fuck aren’t you angry about the shitty degradation of our favorite franchise?

So many people around here willingly lapping up whatever they are given, using mental gymnastics in order to justify the constant lowering of their expectations. All you do is meme and point at „haters“.

You know what you are? You are nothing more than a bunch of shitty consumers…

Based on your random driveby of a bunch of people you don’t know who opinions you don’t agree with, you have chosen to be something far simpler to describe.

 

[Michael]

Based on your random driveby of a bunch of people you don’t know who opinions you don’t agree with, you have chosen to be something far simpler to describe.

Glad you got that off your chest, but this was dealt with days ago when it was first posted, so no need to drag it up again. The poster was warned and there doesn’t need to be any further discussion about this here. Thank you.

 

[FredH]

Not that I'm saying they're lying, but if I were in their position, I'd drop 1-3 spoilers from the movie, so people after release would see I really had inside info and wasn't just making an educated guess.

Though I’ve seen that go the other way — I remember some online poster claiming back in the very early 1990s to have already seen a big chunk of the then-unannounced next film, and providing details (which were, of course, bogus as it turned out). Sometimes people do that, and I honestly don’t get why, since it’s literally inevitable they’re going to be disproven. Yet it happens.

I’m not assuming that’s the case this time, automatically. I wouldn’t be shocked if the movie does stink, though of course I hope it won’t. (But that’s still not a reason to attack people who like it, whether or not it does.)

 

[FredH]

Glad you got that off your chest, but this was dealt with days ago when it was first posted, so no need to drag it up again. The poster was warned and there doesn’t need to be any further discussion about this here. Thank you.

Fair enough; apologies. For some reason I thought it had been posted earlier today.

 

[Michael]

Fair enough; apologies. For some reason I thought it had been posted earlier today.

No harm done. This thread has been pretty long-running and was just beamed over from Future of Trek, so that was an easy mistake to make. Carry on.

 

[The Old Mixer]

Pin it, Mike-o!

 

[Michael]

Pin it, Mike-o!

Done!