Onscreen evidence M'Ress is an alien?

[Therin of Andor]

If you look closely, throughout the different series, there are several different variations of were the antenna are on an Andorian.

Tracked in excruciating detail here, by moi:
http://andorfiles.blogspot.com.au/

Isn't there some mention (TAS or one of the comics), of Lt Uhura having a room mate in Starfleet Academy who was Orion?

Set in the prime reality, the "Legion of Superheroes"/TOS crossover comic mini-series (issue #3) referenced Uhura's roommate as being an Orion female. ie. a counterpart to Gaila.

 

[Therin of Andor]

And a feline from the planet Cait in the Lynx constellation is a particularly lazy example of that.

No, it's from the TAS Writers' Bible - and a salute to TOS tropes such as an alien librarian named Mr Atoz (A to Z), a love interest met at a Christmas party (Helen Noel), and a neutral planet called Neural.

 

[hux]

Technical point: cats form prides, not herds...

A group of cats are called a clowder.

A clutter and a glaring are also correct. A group of lions is called a pride.

You're quoting somebody else there honey pie. I never said that. In this day and age, how do people still manage to screw up the quote functions.

Hux is so sexy

Oops

There are no humans that look like M'Ress. Therefore she's alien.

But there are cats that look like her so being an Earth-based life-form (natural or engineered) is still a possibility, no?

 

[SonicRanger]

This is true of a lot of TAS, and even TOS, characters. I mean, really, half the aliens in TOS look identical to humans... how do we know that any of the human-looking Enterprise crew who weren't specifically identified as human, are?

I believe the old James Blish novelizations assumed that, especially that Star Trek was much farther into the future and that most of the human-looking "aliens" we saw, including Klingons (I believe), were actually that and that their worlds were old human colonies.

I admit to liking that kind of out-of-the-box thinking, offering a different take on common assumptions.

Things like this drive me crazy about fans.

You have two choices:

She's human
She's alien

There are no humans that look like M'Ress. Therefore she's alien.

And I'm suggesting that's a logical fallacy within the realm of sci fi.

Would you prefer we go back to debating whether the yellow shirts were really avocado colored?

 

[Marsden]

I don't see what the problem or resistance to the question is, though?

Q: Is there onscreen evidence that M'Ress is an alien?
A: No

It's that simple, but we like to hash and rehash things so much it takes five pages to be direct about it. And I'm sure someone will complain about this directness.

At first it seemed kind of extraneous to ask the question, what else could she possibly be, but in frame of reference of a discussion when someone says, "where does it actually say that?" then it's valid. It's not what a person wants, it's a precise question of what is.

Having said that, of course she's an alien, but there's really no proof of it.

And as far as what those two girls in that movie were, they didn't even look like aliens to me, how the hell are they supposed to be Caitians?

Just like we are assuming all of the crew aren't reanimated zombies because the transporter has killed them all and assembled a copy of them to walk around thinking they were the original.

Yes, I know that last bit is silly, but it's been brought up before. We assume that because no one does act that way it isn't so but there is no "proof"

 

[Timo]

Yes, it's still debated whether our favorite zombies really qualify as reanimated... Even if we count TAS.

But if I were to be genetically turned into a purring, articulated-tailed, digitigrade furball, why would I not qualify as an alien? I'm pretty certain I would not just physically but also mentally diverge so far from my (supposed but not proven) human origins that I would meet most of the usual or imaginable criteria of "alien".

Timo Saloniemi

 

[SonicRanger]

And as far as what those two girls in that movie were, they didn't even look like aliens to me, how the hell are they supposed to be Caitians?

Because of "behind the scenes" info and statements by the production staff, just like the TAS background information.

Just like we are assuming all of the crew aren't reanimated zombies because the transporter has killed them all and assembled a copy of them to walk around thinking they were the original. Yes, I know that last bit is silly, but it's been brought up before. We assume that because no one does act that way it isn't so but there is no "proof"

That was indeed a hotly debated topic in fandom back in the day. Wasn't that discussed in those "Best of Trek" books or the early novels like "Spock Must Die"?

But if I were to be genetically turned into a purring, articulated-tailed, digitigrade furball, why would I not qualify as an alien? I'm pretty certain I would not just physically but also mentally diverge so far from my (supposed but not proven) human origins that I would meet most of the usual or imaginable criteria of "alien".

Perhaps. But it wouldn't mean you're from a planet of cat people.

 

[Gov Kodos]

I don't see what the problem or resistance to the question is, though?

I imagine because it's ridiculously contrived.

 

[SonicRanger]

I don't see what the problem or resistance to the question is, though?

I imagine because it's ridiculously contrived.

I imagine because people have problems questioning their assumptions.

 

[Marsden]

I see your point, and I think trying to prove M'Ress isn't an alien would be contrived, but asking for a proof in response to when it was brought up in a conversation isn't.

 

[Shawnster]

Technical point: cats form prides, not herds...

A group of cats are called a clowder.

A clutter and a glaring are also correct. A group of lions is called a pride.

You're quoting somebody else there honey pie. I never said that. In this day and age, how do people still manage to screw up the quote functions.

Well, I, for one, have trouble when it comes to the nested quotes. It's hard to weed out the appropriate comment with the appropriate name when quoting a nested quote.

 

[BillJ]

Unless there's on screen evidence to the contrary, I don't see a problem with a person interpreting something on screen in a way they see fit.

I never gave M'Ress much thought because I thought her and the Kzinti were both pretty silly.

 

[Gov Kodos]

I don't see what the problem or resistance to the question is, though?

I imagine because it's ridiculously contrived.

I imagine because people have problems questioning their assumptions.

No.

 

[mos6507]

And a feline from the planet Cait in the Lynx constellation is a particularly lazy example of that.

No, it's from the TAS Writers' Bible - and a salute to TOS tropes such as an alien librarian named Mr Atoz (A to Z), a love interest met at a Christmas party (Helen Noel), and a neutral planet called Neural.

And Romulans based on Roman culture and Vulcans from a hot planet with (you guessed it) lots of volcanic activity.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

That's not really the strongest evidence. To another viewer, it could be so obvious that she's a genetically engineered cat (or whatever)

Why would they believe that so obvious, when up to that time, ST never said or even hinted that Starfleet has any genetically engineered personnel serving? That's just fanboys being too obsessed with trying to provide an answer to a question that no one felt important enough to ask...for obvious reasons.

that, if she were really an alien, they'd have mentioned her planet name, her species name, and so forth.

No, they would not, as everything did not need to spelled out to the audience...like later version of ST. It is a far future sci-fi series where ST--at the time--featured creatures from all over the universe. Most did not have some explanation of origin, but viewers accepted it, as it fit within the genre-natural frame of a populated universe.

If, after all of that--someone is still confused or not convinced, then they need to watch Enterprise (good luck) or Dragnet, where someone will spend half the running time telling you too much information about things that are apparent.

 

[Gov Kodos]

That's not really the strongest evidence. To another viewer, it could be so obvious that she's a genetically engineered cat (or whatever)

Why would they believe that so obvious, when up to that time, ST never said or even hinted that Starfleet has any genetically engineered personnel serving? That's just fanboys being too obsessed with trying to provide an answer to a question that no one felt important enough to ask...for obvious reasons.

that, if she were really an alien, they'd have mentioned her planet name, her species name, and so forth.

No, they would not, as everything did not need to spelled out to the audience...like later version of ST. It is a far future sci-fi series where ST--at the time--featured creatures from all over the universe. Most did not have some explanation of origin, but viewers accepted it, as it fit within the genre-natural frame of a populated universe.

If, after all of that--someone is still confused or not convinced, then they need to watch Enterprise (good luck) or Dragnet, where someone will spend half the running time telling you too much information about things that are apparent.

Indeed. A show about humanity 'seeking out new life, and new civilizations' has a cat person on board. Is the cat a genetically engineered Earth creature or an alien? Which is more likely given the premise of the show? Hmm?

 

[Ithekro]

Especially given that this came out in 1973. In a space drama setting, unless specifically pointed out, the usual option for someone that did not appear to be human was that they were an alien from some other planet. Even if they just appeared on another planet and looked human there was a likelihood they were considered aliens on live television. For a cartoon you could actually show aliens looking more alien than on live action TV. And even then a lot of aliens were simply humans with an exotic skin color (blue or green being the usual ones chosen).

 

[hux]

I don't see what the problem or resistance to the question is, though?

I imagine because it's ridiculously contrived.

If the question is contrived then how would you describe people getting annoyed because someone suggests a cartoon cat isn't an alien?

I was very much of the opinion that M'Ress was an alien but seeing people get irked by the suggestion that she isn't, is kinda hilarious.

I'm now voting NOT an alien. By the way everyone, the USS Millennium Falcon was the best ship Kirk ever captained.

 

[SonicRanger]

Especially given that this came out in 1973. In a space drama setting, unless specifically pointed out, the usual option for someone that did not appear to be human was that they were an alien from some other planet.

That certainly makes sense. And I don't doubt that M'Ress was intended in the early 1970s as an alien. I'm sure I accepted her as much when watching TAS reruns on Nickelodeon during the 1980s.

But a new, "modern" (say, post-"Guardians of the Galaxy") viewer might not make the same assumption. In fact, it seems that they could watch the whole series on DVD with the interpretation that M'Ress is a genetically engineered or evolved cat (or something else non-alien) without encountering anything in the episodes to contradict it. That is my point.

Arex is a much better alien because they just didn't make him a walking, talking dog or kangaroo.

 

[Marsden]

Arex is a much better alien because they just didn't make him a walking, talking dog or kangaroo.

You're not going to start picking on Ensign Joey now, are you?