Observations, rewatching Season 1 for first time in a while

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by JirinPanthosa, Sep 23, 2018.

  1. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Watching The Thaw now.

    Who is that actor? I know that voice...who is that voice...I know that...HOLY **** is that Michael McKean?! Well now The Clown is Chuck to me forever.
     
  2. Farscape One

    Farscape One Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2017
    You know, I have imagined The Clown singing "Big Bottom" once or twice...
     
    Sybok Was Wrong likes this.
  3. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    I must say I respect Tuvix for not taking the easy way out and having Tuvix sacrifice himself. I know it's the most controversial Voayger ep on this forum. But I think the best Ent episode is Similitude, and Sim in the end sacrificed himself. Tuvix is the one time in Voyager Janeway was forced to make a really hard moral choice. Maybe she made the wrong one, but the writers certainly weren't cowards for this episode.

    Maybe Tuvok and Neelix should have had some hard time adusting after this episode.
     
    Last edited: Jan 17, 2019
  4. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Does anyone else think it would have been more interesting if Seska's baby had been Chakotay's baby and ended up aboard Voyager?
     
    Athena28 likes this.
  5. chris of nine

    chris of nine Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    Rather, they use the other ending where the baby dies, Seska lives.

    She stays on the show, and by the last season she hooks up with Chakotay instead of S/C, and has his, instead.
     
  6. Finn

    Finn Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2006
    Location:
    Austin
    One thing I liked about the first two seasons were that the two major powers were recurring; The Kazon and Vidiians as Voyager was likely straddling their territories for about an year. I suspect the Kazon we saw in the earlier appearances in first season were quite far from their core territories, while the Vidiians we saw in season one were closer to home than their appearances in the second season.

    I kinda think we should have seen more of that. Several episodes showing them travelling through a territory home to a power, a couple or more, at times.
     
    Zander and sumbuddyx like this.
  7. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Remember is a much more powerful episode when you're an adult and understand that stuff like this actually IS going on in some parts of the world, as we speak. It's exactly how China treats Muslims.
     
    sumbuddyx likes this.
  8. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Future's End, this has to be the only time outside TOS a disruptor vaporizes a complete object that is not a person, without harming anything other than said object.
     
  9. chris of nine

    chris of nine Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    Rain’s pickup truck? Oh, sure, no debris, or nuthin.

    Yeah, I thought it bogus, too, like Savvik in the kitchen galley in Khan, did, vaporizing a stockpot, leaving a pile of doughy goo, with her phazor.

    I could never buy that in TOS, but they did it all the time.

    You’d think they would quit it by voyager days.
     
    sumbuddyx likes this.
  10. sumbuddyx

    sumbuddyx Captain Captain

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2014
    I haven't rewatched it but I remember really loving that episode. However when I first heard of the title I thought it was going to be about Tuvok shoving his katra in someone and having some dual personality hijinx happen.
     
  11. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Watching Unity.

    Something I noticed that’s the case for all Treks. All ships appear in the same orientation as the POV. Even Borg cubes are always squared with the view screen. But the disabled one here is not squared and that’s how you know it’s disabled.

    It’s space, relative angles of ships should be arbitrary whether it’s in control or not.
     
  12. gakelly

    gakelly Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2019
    Sorry if it seems like rambling...
    I just watched the entire series on Netflix for the first time. A lot of the season 1-3 episodes were not of high quality. Takotay was simply a wooden caricature. Kim was never developed. The Kazon were awful enemies...totally 1 dimensional. Janeway was completely unlikeable. Season 3 was just so bad...they had to bring in Seven of Nine just to try to salvage something. Jeri Ryan was basically the star of season 4.
    Then all the time travel episodes throughout the series. It was almost as if the writers had no idea what to do so they just relied on cliched time travel garbage. It starts in the first episode after the pilot and continues right up to the finale (which sucked majorly). And trash like the 37s...it's hard to develop a like for a show when the season premiere is something so bad.
    The writers never took any chances, they never developed much of a conflict between the Maquis and Starfleet personnel. It was just a big love fest, and everyone fell in line with Janeway without much dispute. If the writers weren't going to try that angle, then why not just make it a total Starfleet crew to begin with.
    I can't remember the episode, but when Takotay punches the one crewman and mentions it is the Maquis way, that was one of the highlights of the first few seasons.
    I guess if you don't compare it to the high points of TOS, TNG and DS9, it isn't that bad.
     
  13. chris of nine

    chris of nine Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2018
    .

    Love Unity. Riley is a great character.

    As for ship POV, yes. There is no up or down in space.
    It would be really disorienting for the audience to see that, though.
    It would be fascinating to see, say, ships in a nebula, cavorting at all pitches and angles, trying to destroy each other. Or inverting a ship during battle for a tactical advantage.

    In Wrath of Khan’s nebula scene, both ships maintained the same pitch.

    I guess TPTB expect the audience to assume it normal for SF ships to maintain the action of Naval vessels at sea, or aircraft relative to Earth. And birds in the air.

    For the audience, awkward pitch angle means damaged.

    I remember one time where a SF vessel went around to the other side of a planet to hide, and relative to the planet surface, should have been shown “upside down” on screen, but wasn’t. So, relative to the planet, it was.
     
  14. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Before & After is one of the early series gems. But watching it is bittersweet.

    They set up things that could have turned into B5 style closed circles but then Wang had to appear on his stupid sexiest man list and Berman had to have his catsuit hottie.

    What’s the in universe explanation? Did Kes’ knowledge of the future make her evolve faster? Did her knowledge cause the encounter with the Borg? How does this episode make any sense with Kes leaving and Seven not being in the start of this episode?

    In Year Of Hell, Kes tackling Janeway and B’elana out of the way at the last moment to save them could have been perfect.

    Wish there was some alternate canon to tell this story. A great setup episode completely wasted.
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2019
  15. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Now that I think about it if Kes hadn’t evolved Seven would have died. So ok, one less thing to justify.

    But then again her evolving sent them 10000ly. So maybe not. Just poor planning.
     
  16. Refuge

    Refuge Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2016
    ^ I envy you doing this re-watch. I've given myself a little break and then I'm going to do the same.
     
    cosmic mouse likes this.
  17. Finn

    Finn Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2006
    Location:
    Austin
    To be fair, if Kes hadn't been evolving, it would mean no Species 8472. They wouldn't have gotten into the predicament that got Seven on Voyager...
     
  18. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    That could work but then they still have to have found a way around Borg space with a 10000ly extra boost in the same time frame.

    If we are trying to make it all make sense, in the B&A timeline they would have had to find a wormhole that took them a few hundred ly from Krenim space that they just missed in the main one.

    Fun observation, my phone keeps autocorrecting Krenim to Krill.
     
  19. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Watched Worst Case Scenario last night.

    I can’t help but think this time around it would be a better episode with a different threat. That Seska left this program behind before she knew she would be caught isn’t plausible, and in rewatch it’s not that entertaining either.

    I’m not sure how they should have ended it, whether the program should have been a source of mortal danger at all. They could have gone further into Tuvok and Paris’ creative differences or maybe created a scenario where they have to win as the Maquis to survive.

    In retrospect seems like a missed opportunity to have a running thread of the creative culture of Voyager.
     
  20. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    I'm thinking about, given Voyager's knowledge at the time, how they could have handled Scorpion differently.

    Whether they could have talked to Species 8472, somehow realized before the end of the episode that the Borg attacked first, and convinced them that the Borg were their only organic enemy.

    On one hand, if they couldn't get that message through 8472 would be a bigger threat than the Borg, on the other hand if they could, 8472 wipe out the Borg and help everyone. It's hard to decide in retrospect if Janeway did the right thing or the selfish thing.