Miscast Starships - Discussion

[Richard Baker]

I actually liked the blank ships in the DS-9 fleets. I read somewhere the idea was that Starfleet was frantically trying to filed as many ships as possible and a lot of those ships were not complete. Some of the Galaxy classes were largely an empty spaceframe with just engines and weapon systems installed, run by a minimal crew instead of complete starships with a crew over a thousand. This makes sense to me- why even bother naming the ships, just have the friend or foe transponders identify them.

 

[Christopher]

I actually liked the blank ships in the DS-9 fleets. I read somewhere the idea was that Starfleet was frantically trying to filed as many ships as possible and a lot of those ships were not complete. Some of the Galaxy classes were largely an empty spaceframe with just engines and weapon systems installed, run by a minimal crew instead of complete starships with a crew over a thousand. This makes sense to me- why even bother naming the ships, just have the friend or foe transponders identify them.

I'll always feel that the complete Galaxy class was "miscast" in the Dominion War combat fleets, because it abandoned the original intent that the combat configuration left the saucer behind. And yes, yes, I know all the real-world reasons they didn't do it, and I've heard all the excuses for why the saucer could be beneficial in combat, but that's still the exact opposite of what the designers originally intended. And the Galaxy design, with its huge bloated saucer full of windows, is more a cruise ship than a battleship.

What might've been interesting to see, once they switched to digital models, was variant Galaxy ships that substituted a lighter, more combat-oriented saucer in place of the standard one. Though that still seems redundant given that the stardrive section was specifically designed to be a self-contained battleship when needed,

 

[publiusr]

Perhaps the saucers were laden with power generation equipment.... perhaps emitting a much larger shields so the older vessels have cover and can put more power into weapons.

 

[Christopher]

Perhaps the saucers were laden with power generation equipment.... perhaps emitting a much larger shields so the older vessels have cover and can put more power into weapons.

As I said, I've heard all the handwaves before, but no matter how one tries to rationalize it, it's still a change from what was originally intended. Andrew Probert and TNG's creators wanted a ship that could routinely separate, a slow, heavy university village of a ship being towed around by a sleeker, more powerful craft that was more formidable when it was set free of the burden of the saucer. That was an interesting new idea, and I regret that it ended up being abandoned due to the flaws in the construction of the original miniature. I would have preferred it if the idea of separation in battle had remained a standard practice, and if the battle fleets in DS9 had used Galaxy stardrive sections only.

Although I question the whole idea of a ship that can split into two ships (or three, like the Prometheus). I think something trying to be two things at once will never be as good at either as something fully dedicated to the role. I've often thought it would be interesting if TNG had had two ships, a large, possibly civilian research vessel captained by Picard and a smaller defensive Starfleet escort vessel captained by Riker.

 

[Richard Baker]

Perhaps the saucers were laden with power generation equipment.... perhaps emitting a much larger shields so the older vessels have cover and can put more power into weapons.

Only problem with that is during the Dominion War battles we saw on screen, most of the ships seemed to be operating without any shields at all. Each weapon strike did not splash against the TNH shield bubbles but tore directly into the hulls...

 

[josette_leonard]

The phased cloak angle is interesting - skunkworks testbeds would probably look pretty generic anyway, and the Oberth's already got that utilitarian vibe. Makes it feel less like budget cuts and more like the ship was just... not meant to impress.

 

[F. King Daniel]

There is something to be said for putting your ultra-secret illegal device on the most inconspicuous ship possible

 

[Dukhat]

The phased cloak angle is interesting - skunkworks testbeds would probably look pretty generic anyway, and the Oberth's already got that utilitarian vibe. Makes it feel less like budget cuts and more like the ship was just... not meant to impress.

There is something to be said for putting your ultra-secret illegal device on the most inconspicuous ship possible

The problem wasn’t that they put a cloaking device in an Oberth. The problem was that the ship was stated in dialogue to have been built only five years before the Enterprise-D, that it was an experimental ship, and that its systems were later used in the Galaxy class. That does not really describe an Oberth. That’s like saying that they put a 2020’s engine in a 1950’s car.

 

[137th Gebirg]

Yep. The Mirandized-Ambassador would have been a better choice, but any one of the Wolf 359 ships would have been perfect. Those actually looked like Galaxy class test beds, more appropriate to the dialogue.

 

[Dukhat]

Again, I think that if the producers of DS9 had built a new smaller starship model for the Saratoga in "Emissary," one that was contemporary to the TNG era like those BoBW kitbashes, then they could also have used it for the Raman and the Pegasus in TNG, and again for any guest starships in DS9 like the Prometheus.