i agree. which is amazing.. I guess you are missing my point
Marvel films, it's time for a Black female lead
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It would've been awesome if Lord of the Rings had an old hobo in the movie. Woulda jazzed up the story. He woulda taken care of that Gollum problem right at the start.
Why? Should opinions come with some sort of force field that prevents being judged for those opinions?
ALL MOVIES ARE MADE--certainly at the studio level--TO SUIT DEMOGRAPHIC NEEDS. THEY ALWAYS HAVE.
You didn't care then because you see White and Male as the default. And it's not. And studios are realizing there is money to be made by having a diverse roster of faces. Slowly, slowly things are changing. But, it's gonna keep changing.
I'm not certain about this. Every week Louie Anderson plays a woman and the character is brilliant. Also you forget what we gained. Stuff like Get Out,Atlanta and Crazy Ex-Girlfried. Also when Trump is gone you will see another shift in the type of stories being told. Jason
No. You're failing to express a coherent, evidence-based and substantial point. Your complaint has been offered on the basis of nothing more than your personal frustration and disappointment at seeing characters you're attached to cast in films in ways that disappoint and upset your expectations, and you've generalized that to Hollywood Is Creating A Problem.
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One thing that needs to happen (yesterday, the last century, whenever) is than end to the assumption--usually from strident white liberals--about what is "empowering" to black people regarding fiction, representation in filmed media, as they are almost always wrong to the point of pissing off the very people they believe they are "helping." Its an assumption that black people are so much "the other" (almost the implication that psychologically, they are another damn species), that there's no way they can identify / personalize the stories of fiction non-black characters. That is a false belief in the extreme.
Just looking at part of my own family and friends (across several generations and cultural experiences/influences), I can safely say that many never had any problem identifying with white characters; of the relatives who were alive in the early 20th century, they read the pulps, serialized newspaper stories, some the early superhero comics, watched films featuring white leads/heroes (and it is critical to point out that this was a time where social / institutionalized racism & racial violence was at a fever pitch in America, including in the arts), and did not claim they could not relate to, or for some, imagine themselves in the same situations as the white fictional characters.
They were among the same generation who watched (when available) the films of Micheaux, Spencer Williams and others and while they could relate to the (usually) all black films, that--in no way--meant it was due to being incapable of enjoying / identifying with white characters from mainstream films. Obviously, representation is important and expected, but it had/has its greatest impact when the story and/or casting is entirely organic and not the latest self-celebratory "charity" creations by those who often do not know who they are speaking to as an audience, but they sure as Hell believe they do.
Its that kind of white liberal opinion / treatment that is also fueling a rejection of this kind of entertainment pandering among the growing A.D.O.S. (American Descendants of Slaves) movement (that are not only focused on political/social matters and a redress of historic crimes/mistreatment), who see the ideological white left / entertainment industry's paternalism as not only part of an offensive tradition, but misguided, as once again, black people are being told what is "good" for them and "empowering" (speaking for them more that they ever listened) through their allegedly benevolent lens / pat on the head.
So, what the MCU (and other franchises) need to do is develop characters because its out of a natural outgrowth. not their prescription for "caring," chariitable stabs at diversity.
What the fuck?! Well, way to misinterpret my words, there. Don't put fucking words in my mouth, and I resent that kind assumption. How fucking stupid do you think I am that you assume I'd believe such a silly thing?
Even if that notion of black people somehow not being able to identify with characters of other ethnicities had somehow made it's way into my head, which I can assure you it hasn't until you brought it up, I would quickly have reasoned that that notion has to be wrong based on, if nothing else (and there's actually a lot else), the fact that for a very long time there were no black heroes in American popular fiction (not that there were any in European popular fiction, either).
But there is also something about seeing people like yourself onscreen, and not seeing people like yourself represented as heroes in fiction has an effect on you. And this is something I know from personal experience, not because of my ethnicity, but because of my nationality. It might surprise you, but there's not a lot of adventure films and/or TV shows from Germany suitable for kids. Even when there was, like the Karl May film adaptations from the 1960s, they were set in America and the hero only had an English nickname, Old Shatterhand, and was played by Lex Barker, an American. Or was actually American, like the main character in the Perry Rhodan novels. For a very long time as a child, I only wanted to go live in America and be an American, because everything seemed to happen there to Americans. It appeared like only Americans were cool enough to matter. I certainly didn't want to be German, as Germans were almost entirely presented as bad guys (and before anybody starts, yes, I know why, I had history in school).
So, when I got older and found out, hey, there's a German on the X-Men, and hey, the Captain of the TNG-Enterprise is from France, which is at least close to Germany, it actually meant something to me. That, maybe, I didn't need to be American to matter, that it was okay to be a German, living in Germany. And it's still something special to me when there's a positive German character in an international production, like Dr. Erskine in Captain America, or Max in Sense8.
So, excuse me for wishing such positive representation to other people, as well. Especially in movies that are watched by kids.
Even if that notion of black people somehow not being able to identify with characters of other ethnicities had somehow made it's way into my head, which I can assure you it hasn't until you brought it up, I would quickly have reasoned that that notion has to be wrong based on, if nothing else (and there's actually a lot else), the fact that for a very long time there were no black heroes in American popular fiction (not that there were any in European popular fiction, either).
But there is also something about seeing people like yourself onscreen, and not seeing people like yourself represented as heroes in fiction has an effect on you. And this is something I know from personal experience, not because of my ethnicity, but because of my nationality. It might surprise you, but there's not a lot of adventure films and/or TV shows from Germany suitable for kids. Even when there was, like the Karl May film adaptations from the 1960s, they were set in America and the hero only had an English nickname, Old Shatterhand, and was played by Lex Barker, an American. Or was actually American, like the main character in the Perry Rhodan novels. For a very long time as a child, I only wanted to go live in America and be an American, because everything seemed to happen there to Americans. It appeared like only Americans were cool enough to matter. I certainly didn't want to be German, as Germans were almost entirely presented as bad guys (and before anybody starts, yes, I know why, I had history in school).
So, when I got older and found out, hey, there's a German on the X-Men, and hey, the Captain of the TNG-Enterprise is from France, which is at least close to Germany, it actually meant something to me. That, maybe, I didn't need to be American to matter, that it was okay to be a German, living in Germany. And it's still something special to me when there's a positive German character in an international production, like Dr. Erskine in Captain America, or Max in Sense8.
So, excuse me for wishing such positive representation to other people, as well. Especially in movies that are watched by kids.
Calm the Hell down, kid. I am talking about the beliefs / actions of white liberals in entertainment and in the sociopolitical landscape. Your post served as the springboard for that in a thread where its relevant. If I wanted to accuse you of anything, I would have.
Hey, remember what a train wreck it was that time Marvel created a character with their race a starting point instead of letting it develop "organically" or "naturally"?
http://www.tcj.com/jack-kirby-interview/6/
Jack Kirby said:
http://www.tcj.com/jack-kirby-interview/6/
If I may, you are discussing your interpretation and opinion of the beliefs/actions of white liberals in entertainment. You are entitled to that interpretation and opinion, and while I may find them interesting, they are based on your viewpoint and not objective fact.
Looking at the New Warriors, a TV Show that has been in development for yonks...
Kate Comer as a female, black, Telekenetic. Second tier character, no word on her sexuality. She showed up in the 2005, if you're wondering why she seems unfamiliar.
Brenda Lee Perez might be Silk, but she's only listed on IMDB as "girl at bar". Silk is the black, handicapped (she's on crutches) superheroine, who controls "the dark dimension" (mostly for teleporting) which is the same power set as Cloak from Cloak and Dagger.
Oh...
The New Warriors was pulled a year ago.
Wikpedia says the Disney streaming service might air the 10 episode season, that's already been made.
There's a Cloak and Dagger vs. Runaways crossover coming up soon IRL.
If the lesbians on the Runaways are in a fight, they might try to seduce Dagger to hurt their girlfriend?
Kate Comer as a female, black, Telekenetic. Second tier character, no word on her sexuality. She showed up in the 2005, if you're wondering why she seems unfamiliar.
Brenda Lee Perez might be Silk, but she's only listed on IMDB as "girl at bar". Silk is the black, handicapped (she's on crutches) superheroine, who controls "the dark dimension" (mostly for teleporting) which is the same power set as Cloak from Cloak and Dagger.
Oh...
The New Warriors was pulled a year ago.
Wikpedia says the Disney streaming service might air the 10 episode season, that's already been made.
There's a Cloak and Dagger vs. Runaways crossover coming up soon IRL.
If the lesbians on the Runaways are in a fight, they might try to seduce Dagger to hurt their girlfriend?
Objective fact rests in the inarguable experiences of other black people I refer to, who are the best judge of how they are being treated by the entertainment industry. Its not a new complaint, but one that's been aggressively ignored for decades, hence so much resentment from black Americans regarding the how, why and when this industry decides how they are to be presented/recognized, among many other valid grievances.
I'm not arguing that at all. I would not argue against people's testimonials of how they have been treated. I am referring to the inferences you made about white/liberals intentions.
Ms America. Latina and... She has very dark skin. Lesbian. Female. Getting a Marvel Rising mini Movie. 8 minutes? (seen above). Shuri is also getting a mini movie. Black. Princess. Unknown sexuality.
https://www.cbr.com/ms-america-15-awesome-facts-about-america-chavez/
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What happens in TNZ,stays in TNZ. Please avoid this or next time it will be a warning
Black British woman speaking here to represent me not the whole Diaspora. Your social circle of nonwhite friends and family speaks for your social circle only.
I did not identify with any white character as a child, (A.Were they racially abused? No. B. Were they ignored by society's culture? No. C. Was the texture of their hair considered ugly? No. D. Did the hero consider someone who looked like me a romantic partner? Hell no! In the U.K experience you want to know why a lot of black men have partnerships with nonblack women...I give you exhibits C & D but that's a deeper topic for another day)
However, I enjoyed buying and reading D.C comic books despite not because of their whiteness, the stories entertained me. Why do you think most black homes were excited whenever there was a good black character on TV, (same for Asian homes) why do you think Uhura made such an impact for us watching Star Trek cos she was on T.V and not playing no friggin maid! We accepted that until things changed, we either never watch tv or a movie even if the story was entertaining, Or we watched what we got until things improved.
Now things are gradually improving some white folks are getting their TVFILMSMUSTSTAYSOWHITE knickers in a twist.
In the past, we, nonwhite people in a mainly white society put up with getting the symbolic stale bread and the occassional rancid butter on our entertainment plate until either we made our own three course menus (whatever you might think of Tyler Perry and Spike Lee projects, I salute them) or the menu changed to recognise our existence.
IOW we went to all your white movies, watched your T.V for generations but for a long time, 'you people' hardly, if ever went to ours!
Thankfully, some of the generation of white people who have gone to school with, work with, have romantic relationships with nonwhite people, especially those of us of African descent, (The Generation Xers and their offspring), going to see a movie like Black Panther etc, is not offputting for them, seeing black actors from the 90's with Wesley Snipes, Denzil Washington, Will Smith etc can and do put bums on seats and bring in the £££$$$€€€. For black women this will take a lot longer, since women have it harder in the business anyway.
If white women have an issue, imagine how it is for all the other females!
So I accept the white generation that thought 'Jim Crow' was as normal as drinking water were not going to watch Sidney Poitier or Harry Belafonte movies back in the day, and would be clutching their pearls at all this 'diversity/identity politics rubbish' but they are old grannies and grandads now, hopefully their grandchildren and great grandchildren will be less narrowminded....one can only hope.
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Dayna on the Liberator.
Who did you ship her with, if Blake's Seven was on when you were a kid?
Who did you ship her with, if Blake's Seven was on when you were a kid?
And i am talking about the black American experience with the entertainment industry / media, which is incredibly distinct from the black British experience, hence specific references and a nod to the related concerns from the aforementioned A.D.O.S. movement, as that paternalistic treatment from liberal whites in entertainment (and politics) thinking they either know what's best for us as the Grand Caring Benefactor is reaching the end of its sociopolitical shelf life.
That shelf life is fast approaching because black people have the sense of self to know who & what they identify with (or not) are empowered by (or not), which is not to be be dictated by / packaged from those who have spent decades making assumptions from the outside, instead of knowing what is natural, accepted, relatable and/or desired from the inside.
On the larger plane of such matters, is telling when members of the race being "helped"/"spoken for"/"empowered" end up being criticized for daring to do what is their right: shatter the feel-good, self-congratulatory actions and/or emotions of the white liberal entertainment business, who act as if their position of politicized do-gooder-ism should never be questioned or challenged by the very people they claim to empathize with.
Again, that shelf-life is fast approaching (in the national political dialogue / plans for our future as well, which is not represented by the news media's constructed version of that), and not a moment too soon.
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Well, you quoted my post and made no disclaimer, so why wouldn't I think you were talking about me?
I was too young to ship anyone, for me a ship sailed on the sea lol I recall a friend talking about she had a kissing scene but I don't remember it. Josette Simon is still a beautiful lady! (She had a brief role in Wonder Woman as the teacher)
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