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Spoilers Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

What grade would you give the Marvel Cinematic Universe? (Ever-Changing Question)


  • Total voters
    185
Jon Favreau defended the sexualization of "Natalie Rushman" as being part of Natasha's cover, which earned an eye roll from ScarJo.

He was right. In cases like this I feel the director and or writers tend to be more right than the actors because the actors can be overly protective of their characters at times and plus lots of these complaints came at a time when lots of people were conflating anything sexual as negative because of Metoo. One of the points of a character like this is their sexiness and them being a women is something they can use to manipulate weak willed men, who underestimate them by not treating them like a real threat.

In a sense she was doing that with Tony Stark. Furry knows Stark is going to look at her being super sexy and really not suspect anything like a ulterior motive because this is still early Stark. He is not to far from the guy who flies around in jets with stripper poles. It should be note we as the audience don't know what to really expect either because we don't see her go into kickass mode and don her black fighting outfit until towards the end of the movie.
 
Great show. Outside of the "usual suspects" I'm unaware of any people who didn't like her.

It wasn't that good IMO but was passable until the final episode then they went with all the magical spirit stuff which ruins the the whole thing. I do like the character in concept. Someone who can't hear and has a metal leg. No super powers so a street level character. It just didn't work for me, because they just made her boring. Liked the towns folk better though like her grandma and grandpa and her cousin and nephew I think they were. Heck remove MCU stuff and Echo and I kind of like the idea of a show just about the town folk living their everyday lives.
 
It wasn't that good IMO but was passable until the final episode then they went with all the magical spirit stuff which ruins the the whole thing. I do like the character in concept. Someone who can't hear and has a metal leg. No super powers so a street level character. It just didn't work for me, because they just made her boring. Liked the towns folk better though like her grandma and grandpa and her cousin and nephew I think they were. Heck remove MCU stuff and Echo and I kind of like the idea of a show just about the town folk living their everyday lives.
So more "you" than "we".
 
We as in your preconceived notions.
But I saw the show. I had preconceived notions, then a option and then a assumption based on ratings and most of the talk about the show afterwards. I know some people like the show. But I noticed more people seemed to dislike it than like it, so my assumption is that generally speaking it was not seen as a success. Thing is I have been on both ends of this stuff before. We all have I would imagine. We have stuff we like that most people seem to dislike. Then we sometimes dislike stuff most people seem to like.
 
So more "you" than "we".

We as in generally speaking more than we as in all people, would be more accurate I think. Which does include a me of course as well because my opinion seems to line up with the general consensus, this time. Though I am sure my opinion is still somewhat different from other people who disliked the show. No two opinions, even when they are somewhat the same are exactly the same.
 
Really? It seemed like most of the reactions I saw to Echo were at least semi-positive. I didn't any OMG!! Best thing ever!!!11 reviews, but most people seemed to at least think it was OK.
Personally, I really enjoyed it, and Echo was one of my favorite parts of Hawkeye. And it's also an incredibly important series for representation, since it's one of or possibly even the first series lead by a leady by a deaf, amputee, indigenous actress. If nothing else Marvel at least deserves some major props for being that authentic with the character.
And I liked Riri in Wakanda Forever, and I'm really looking forward to Ironheart. And just because people didn't love her in the movie doesn't necessarily doom the series, if it's good enough and enough people like it, word will get out and it could end up being a success.
 
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If I recall correctly the main issue with Black Widow in IM2 was that it was probably the most sexualised the character was presented as. I don't even recall her doing very much. At the time it felt like Johansson was really wasted.

That was part of the con in the movie though. Remember, this was pre-"me too" and people kind of expected businessmen to be assholes to their assistants. Tony was over the top, projecting major toxic masculinity vibes and drinking himself silly. He makes comments to Natasha that would get his ass sued today. However, she was actually spying on him. We didn't know she was Natasha until later in the movie, so that was a reveal that I thought was well done.
 
Great show. Outside of the "usual suspects" I'm unaware of any people who didn't like her.

I feel Echo was unfairly judged. It was definitely one of the highlights of the MCU so far. It doesn't hurt that it is chock full of some of my favorite actors.

It wasn't that good IMO but was passable until the final episode then they went with all the magical spirit stuff which ruins the the whole thing. I do like the character in concept. Someone who can't hear and has a metal leg. No super powers so a street level character. It just didn't work for me, because they just made her boring. Liked the towns folk better though like her grandma and grandpa and her cousin and nephew I think they were. Heck remove MCU stuff and Echo and I kind of like the idea of a show just about the town folk living their everyday lives.

The show's story was created in conjunction with the Cocktaw Nation and was approved by them. As I understand it, the ending is representative of their belief system.

Granted, I only know this character from the MCU so I can understand if people don't like changes from the comics character. That said, the ending holds well with the development and back story of the people and it meshes well with Echo's powers. It is one of my favorite MCU endings.
 
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We as in generally speaking more than we as in all people, would be more accurate I think. Which does include a me of course as well because my opinion seems to line up with the general consensus, this time. Though I am sure my opinion is still somewhat different from other people who disliked the show. No two opinions, even when they are somewhat the same are exactly the same.
The general consensus based on what? Looking the wiki it seems well liked enough. Not close to "hated" or even disliked.
 
All this talk made me think of something I think would be interesting. How would you rank each MCU vs how good you thought it would be vs how good you found it to be. I will start.


1 Wandavision

Expected= Had high hopes. I thought it was going to be great, from the premise alone.

Result= Lived up to my expectations. Great show. Final episode ends kind of wobbly but was very happy with the show.


2 Falcon and the Winter Solider

Expected=Also high hopes. Loved the idea of seeing both of the characters again and loved everything said about it, before it started

Results=Once again, the show was as good as expected. Ironically it to also did end though on a wobbly final episode


3 Loki

Expected=Another character I loved. I thought it was going to be a wild adventure with Loki causing all sorts of time travel havoc.

Results-First letdown. Show was okay but it was not as exciting and wild as I thought it would be. Not bad exactly but still not what I was wanting.



Hawkeye

Epected-Another show I felt was going to be great. Love the character and love the actors of Hailee Stenfeld,Tony Dalton and Vera Farmiga.

Results= Almost as good as expected. Only knock is I felt the Farmiga character was not as good as the actor.


She Hulk

Expected-Thought it would be good and different. I expected it to be a Ally McBeal meets the MCU show. I liked Ally McBeal so that wasn't a issue for me.

Results= It was okay. Not as good as I hoped. For sure not as good as Ally McBeal. First episode was the best, which had Hulk in it. Sort of letdown but only by a bit.



MoonKnight

Expected-Had high hopes from what I heard about the comic character and of course it had Oscar Isaac and Ethan Hawke in it.

Results=Letdown by everything except Isaac's performance. That made the show watchable still but out all the MCU shows it's one of those most hurt by having so few episodes.


Ms Marvel

Expected-Had high hopes. Loved the idea of a show focused on a teenage kid who is basically a superhero nerd.

Results-Good as expected. Very happy with the results. The villains sucked though.


What If

Expected-High hopes. Love the idea of elsworlds stories

Results- Good as expected. No real issues.


Secret Invasion

Expected-Hopes through the roof. Samuel Jackson and Olivia Coleman and Ben Mendelosohn and was also thinking Maria Hill would be a regular.

Results-Biggest letdown of them all. So not as good as I was expecting. Found myself so bored while watching. Also would people please stop giving Emilia Clarke good roles. She seems terrible in everything.

Echo

Expected-Didn't tihnk it would be good. The character wasn't all that great in Hawkeye.

Results-About as bad as expected. Well almost. It wasn't the letdown that Secret Invasion was but I see no reason why they thought their would be a big audience for this show.


Agatha All Along

Expected-Had doubts. Didn't know if the character would work outside of the gimmick in WandaVision even though was a big fan of Kathryn Hahn.


Results- I was so wrong about this show. One of the better MCU shows. Great surprise.



Daredevil:Born Again


Expected=High hopes once again for a show. It was great on Netflix and you had the actors and then they said they were going to connected to the canon of the Netflix version.


Results-Terrible. So letdown again much in the way I was for Secret Invasion. They replaced half of the good characters from Netflix with boring new versions. Daredevil is barely in it and the lawyer stuff was not compelling enough to replace it. Might be foolish but I do have some hopes for season 2 improving, at least.

I AM Groot


Expected-Bad kids show. Harmless and not to interested.


Results-It was what I expected but I don't mind. It was just for the kiddies after all.
 
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