Kurtzman Out?

[fireproof78]

As an aside, when did it become socially acceptable on TREKBBS to insult TNG?

Personally, I have not ever really liked TNG, so I'm not sure why it isn't acceptable to be critical and insult a show, regardless of which one it is. ENT gets it, VOY gets it, Kelvin Trek gets it in spades (!) and DSC gets treated with rather harsh and pointed critiques that are not leveled at other Treks.

I think TNG is remembered more fondly for nostalgia, rather than acknowledging it as what it actually is. And, what it is, is entertaining for some, and "not real Trek" for others, to borrow a common turn of phrase.

Mostly because Discovery isn't a character show, just Michael Burnham and some moody blue/orange (nothing else) lighting and OTT action scenes.

Captain Pike would like a word with you.

 

[eschaton]

I think TNG is remembered more fondly for nostalgia, rather than acknowledging it as what it actually is.

The exact same thing is true for TOS though of course. In both cases fans tend to forget about the unwatchably awful episodes and concentrate on the best of the best. In both cases people forgive the cheesy, dated effects, sometimes nonsensical storylines, and characterization which ranges between "winging it" and "cardboard cutout." And things which at the time meant basically nothing (like the first time the Federation was dropped as a name) seem to be very momentous in retrospect.

 

[Longinus]

The exact same thing is true for TOS though of course. In both cases fans tend to forget about the unwatchably awful episodes and concentrate on the best of the best.

And it is one of the strengths of episodic shows that you can easily do that. As much as I like certain aspects of Discovery or DS9, I pretty much hated the serialised main plots of both so I have little desire to rewatch them.

 

[Crewman6]

My favorite part of the "rumor" -

The rumor comes from Gary Buechler aka Nerdrotic. Buechler notes a Star Trek insider contacted him and told him, “Kurtzman has been fired. He is refusing to give up the title but there are 3 producers who have taken over as showrunners.”

"Refusing to give up the title"...? Clearly, this so-called "insider" has no friggin' idea how contracts work.

 

[pst]

yeah i don't know why i watch this shit, but i love how they continually give themselves trapdoors.

"kurtzman is fired, but in order to save face he's keeping his title, so it just looks like kurtzman isn't fired but really he's fired".

 

[Crewman6]

Of course remember, the last time Patrick Stewart had input of a Trek project was "ST: Insurrection", which was going to be more akin to Joseph Conrad's "Heart of Darkness" novel - until Patrick Stewart weighed in that after "ST: First Contact" he diodn't think another 'Dark' story was the way to go and he had the script 'lightened up' to the point we got this:

Read Michael Piller's book about the writing of Insurrection. There was NEVER a version of that movie that was going to be any good. Patrick Stewart's comments about the massive problems in the early drafts were spot on and actually apply directly to the finished film.

 

[fireproof78]

My favorite part of the "rumor" -

The rumor comes from Gary Buechler aka Nerdrotic. Buechler notes a Star Trek insider contacted him and told him, “Kurtzman has been fired. He is refusing to give up the title but there are 3 producers who have taken over as showrunners.”

"Refusing to give up the title"...? Clearly, this so-called "insider" has no friggin' idea how contracts work.

"You're fired!"

"I refuse!"

"Well, nothing we can do then..."

 

[Crewman6]

"You're fired!"

"I refuse!"

"Well, nothing we can do then..."

LOL!

What I meant was the "title" business. You don't "give up your title". If you're fired, you're just paid out, but you technically keep your title and even screen credit for usually at least the season.

 

[BillJ]

LOL!

What I meant was the "title" business. You don't "give up your title". If you're fired, you're just paid out, but you technically keep your title and even screen credit for usually at least the season.

I’m sure WGA and PGA rules would require him being given credit for whatever work he’s done on Picard and Discovery season three, but moving forward he would no longer be head of the Star Trek brand.

 

[fireproof78]

LOL!

What I meant was the "title" business. You don't "give up your title". If you're fired, you're just paid out, but you technically keep your title and even screen credit for usually at least the season.

Oh, I know, and Guild rules will definitely make sure he has it, but it's an absurd way to phrase it so I went total absurdity

 

[Campe]

My favorite part of the "rumor" -

The rumor comes from Gary Buechler aka Nerdrotic. Buechler notes a Star Trek insider contacted him and told him, “Kurtzman has been fired. He is refusing to give up the title but there are 3 producers who have taken over as showrunners.”

"Refusing to give up the title"...? Clearly, this so-called "insider" has no friggin' idea how contracts work.

It all sounds remarkably like the garbage a certain Facebook user who used to go by the name Para Mobius but has been known as Doug Fitz spews.

 

[BillJ]

It all sounds remarkably like the garbage a certain Facebook user who used to go by the name Para Mobius but has been known as Doug Fitz spews.

I remember when Beyond was cancelled and Abrams was going to prison for embezzling money from the Into Darkness budget.

 

[Campe]

I remember when Beyond was cancelled and Abrams was going to prison for embezzling money from the Into Darkness budget.

His buddy Fred Archer suggested that during the production of Beyond there was a lawsuit from Paramount against Bad Robot that was sealed when it was filed in a secret courtroom in Los Angeles. It was because JJ Abrams was so powerful, he even had control of the court system!



Seriously, I’ll be interested to see how BR’s recent signing with Warner will affect the narrative out of these BSers now.

 

[Nerys Myk]

As an aside, when did it become socially acceptable on TREKBBS to insult TNG?

Why should it be unacceptable? TNG isn't some sacred cow.

 

[DaveyNY]

I'm reposting this here....
I stupidly put it in the wrong thread earlier...

I think these paragraphs from the interview kinda-sorta blows any "Kurtzman Fired" headline waaaay outta the water...

"Star Trek: Discovery is now just the first of many Trek projects in the works for CBS and CBS All Access — as the header image of this news update illustrates! — but it also served to (hopefully) stimulate new growth as the franchise continues to expand — and in an interesting set of remarks, Kurtzman notes that this seems to be working… and that he’s got potential plans to keep things growing for the next “five or ten years.”

KURTZMAN: I went to CBS and I said, “I think you have a universe here that is very under-utilized, and a fan base that I think is hungry for a lot more.” And I walked them through the plan of what I saw for the next five to ten years of ‘Trek.’

Part of it was, kind of, premised on the idea that it was going to take time. What I said was, “Don’t expect us to put the first thing out, and suddenly, you know, you’re have 100 million new fans. That’s not gonna happen.” ‘Trek’ has been around for too long for that to happen — but but what we do have is new generations, and what I can tell you is that ‘Trek,’ in general, finds people when they’re about between nine and twelve.

It’s never reached younger than that; it’s never tried to, and to me that’s a hugely missed opportunity, especially because what you’re really trying to do is influence hearts and minds with really positive messages — messages about who we can be as a species and as people and what our future is. So why not start young, you know? And not for a cynical reason. Not because you know, hey, let some more toys, but because if you really want ‘Star Trek’ to reach people, then you’ve got to start young.

And this is where I guess the ‘Star Wars’ influence on me really mattered, because as a kid at four years old, I could imagine myself starting up with a twin suns of Tattooine and wondering what my life was. ‘Trek’ didn’t give me that same thing — it gave me Wesley Crusher, it gave me different characters, but again, those are older characters.

But we are definitely seeing just metric proof that the fan base is growing, and it’s growing younger — and yet, we’re keeping our current fans, and that’s great."

 

[Crewman6]

I remember when Beyond was cancelled and Abrams was going to prison for embezzling money from the Into Darkness budget.

Well, the second part of that is totally true.

 

[Crewman6]

Oh, I know, and Guild rules will definitely make sure he has it, but it's an absurd way to phrase it so I went total absurdity

And that was the right choice.

 

[Dukhat]

Well, the second part of that is totally true.

Let me know what jail he’s in so I can send him a cake with a file in it.

 

[donners22]

As an aside, when did it become socially acceptable on TREKBBS to insult TNG?

I see people dismissing it as sort of "old guff" all the time these days?

Just seems odd especially when any critique of discovery, no matter how mild, raises heckles like you wouldn't belive.

Can't we just let people enjoy why they enjoy

Negativity here is nothing new - I stopped visiting for years because I was sick of Voyager and Enterprise being trashed.

Why would TNG be immune from being disliked? Every Trek series has its flaws and its detractors.

I prefer to avoid negativity just because I find it boring and unenjoyable, but I don't see that one show should be immune from it.

 

[Crewman6]

Let me know what jail he’s in so I can send him a cake with a file in it.

Should have clarified. He did embezzle, he just wasn't caught. But, man, what a treat it would be if the guy was actually in jail. I'd even settle for director jail.