Jake Sisko - Completely Unlikeable

[Oddish]

I find Jake an eminently useful character, though. He provides a perspective of civilian and teenage life on the station. He helps to make Captain Sisko one of the most well rounded characters in Trekdom. And, he was the primary character in one of the most beautiful and heart wrenching Trek episodes ever filmed.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

What point are you trying to make?

I would also like to know where this is going.

 

[kkt]

You raised an interesting question for me - do we think Wesley might have worked better if we'd seen more of him interacting with people his own age versus typically just interacting with the senior staff?

To flip that around, would our opinions of Jake be as favorable if Nog hadn't also been part of the picture?

You're right. Kids naturally interact with other kids. How often do kids in their early teens hang around with their parents' friends and co-workers if they have a choice? The Enterprise was supposed to have lots of kids aboard. In a few episodes we saw them - but only a few, and we saw Wesley a whole lot. If the Enterprise was an 18th century sailing ship of the Navy there would be a group of midshipmen or ship's boys, aging from their early teens, often in a group studying navigation and seamanship under one of the officers. But there's no regular group of kids on the Enterprise, just Wesley. I think it would have been neat if there was a little friendly competition over who would plot the best impulse maneuver or score higher on Starfleet entrance exams or something.

Yes, Nog as a playmate about the same age helped Jake's character a lot.

 

[STEPhon IT]

Yes, but when it came to Jake's profession, it wasn't relevant to the remaining part of the series. There should've been more for him to do. He seemed intrigue about engineering when he was a student, gearing him that would have been fruitful than a writer who has no real importance to the series. If the producers could've somehow relate Benny Russel to Jake's writing talent in some way? Could've had potential.

 

[Oddish]

I agree with you there.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

it wasn't relevant to the remaining part of the series.

From the first episode to the last, DS9 was about the people forced to live together on the station. It was not primarily about a war.

 

[kkt]

I see the variety of occupations on DS9 as one of its strengths. Restauranteurs, tailors, dressmakers, refugees, they're all welcome at DS9. They all have potential importance to the story.

Being a kid is an occupation. He's presumably a student, even when Keiko is away from the station either she or someone else is guiding his studies. There's no reason he has to pick a profession when he's 17 or 18.

He wasn't in the show much in seasons 6 and 7, but that's more due to Cirroc's schedule than running out of plot lines for Jake.

 

[AntonyF]

I didn't mind Jake. What I appreciated is that they didn't force him into the story because he had a quota to fill. He was largely used when the time was right, even if that wasn't to the level of the other main characters. He provided a civvy angle to things.

Also personally he's mighty hot in seasons six and seven, which I appreciate. Trek lacks eye candy.

 

[kkt]

I didn't mind Jake. What I appreciated is that they didn't force him into the story because he had a quota to fill. He was largely used when the time was right, even if that wasn't to the level of the other main characters. He provided a civvy angle to things.

Also personally he's mighty hot in seasons six and seven, which I appreciate. Trek lacks eye candy.

Did you not notice Nana? And Terry? And Nicole? Or do you mean just boy eye candy?

 

[Oddish]

Did you not notice Nana? And Terry? And Nicole? Or do you mean just boy eye candy?

Actually... DS9 doesn't regularly feature eye candy. Terry Farrell and Nana Visitor are both very attractive women, but they're dressed in Starfleet and Bajoran militia uniform, just like their male counterparts. Yes, Kira has her kinky MU counterpart and Dax shows up in a swimsuit (they DO go all the way down!) but usually, they're presented as officers first and women second. I actually liked that.

 

[STEPhon IT]

From the first episode to the last, DS9 was about the people forced to live together on the station. It was not primarily about a war.

Well, I definitely liked the parts that wasn't primarily about the war. There could've been a story where Jake was writing a visual journal to the war in the holosuite and somehow the DS9 staff gets word of it. Jake, somehow has plotted events in his stories has somehow is now happening during the war. Odo gets word Jake is getting some inspiration for what he's writing but Jake is not revealing sources now there's some suspicion there's more going on with this holo-writing. Jake is now in a conflict. Using his skills to be more involved in the saga which the writers were not interested in the character anymore.

 

[Herbert]

I'm on season seven now and I wish when the war finally started they did more war stories. I couldn't give a rat's ass about more ferengi stories or Vic Fontaine or genetically engineered misfits, etc, etc.
I'm not saying that it should have been all war all the time but fewer filler episodes that had nothing to do with the war would have been more interesting. And just for a minute, think of how unique it would have been in the history of Trek TV shows had one season been entirely about the war. Yes, I know that wasn't likely to happen but maybe it should have.

 

[Herbert]

Getting back to Jake, it's interesting that Jake got more annoying (to me) as he got older.
Nog, on the other hand, got far less annoying when he became Starfleet. I couldn't stand Nog before he goes to the academy.

Looking at it from the early seasons, it looked like Jake would be a more central character and he got less important. Nog on the other hand went in the opposite direction.

 

[Oddish]

No way to avoid that without having Jake join Starfleet.

 

[STEPhon IT]

But he doesn't have to join Starfleet, there's other organizations out there where Jake could find a career and also be involved with the plot driven by his father. He could've been an engineer on Bajor or a Medical professional - non- Starfleet, there's so many opportunities Jake could've been saddled with and be relevant than a writer who had nothing to do.

 

[Herbert]

No way to avoid that without having Jake join Starfleet.

The only way to make Jake relevant is to have him join Starfleet? I don't buy that. They could have done something with the character other than making him a writer.

 

[kkt]

I'm on season seven now and I wish when the war finally started they did more war stories. I couldn't give a rat's ass about more ferengi stories or Vic Fontaine or genetically engineered misfits, etc, etc.
I'm not saying that it should have been all war all the time but fewer filler episodes that had nothing to do with the war would have been more interesting. And just for a minute, think of how unique it would have been in the history of Trek TV shows had one season been entirely about the war. Yes, I know that wasn't likely to happen but maybe it should have.

I don't know. I would have gotten pretty sick of war stories if seasons 6 and 7 were nothing but war stories. I liked many of the Ferengi stories, Vic, and some aspects of the genetically engineered misfits stories (and that was only two episode's worth). It would have been way too easy for the series to become a shoot-em-up, some starships fighting some Dominion ships, ooooh explosions, the Defiant snatches victory from the jaws of defeat in the nick of time (again)!

 

[Herbert]

I don't know. I would have gotten pretty sick of war stories if seasons 6 and 7 were nothing but war stories. I liked many of the Ferengi stories, Vic, and some aspects of the genetically engineered misfits stories (and that was only two episode's worth). It would have been way too easy for the series to become a shoot-em-up, some starships fighting some Dominion ships, ooooh explosions, the Defiant snatches victory from the jaws of defeat in the nick of time (again)!

I'm not talking all combat all the time. That would get boring. You can do war stories without having shit blowing up left and right. There are many other ways to do it. The episode with Julian, Garak, Work, and Martok in the prison camp is one such example. I do agree that two seasons would have been too much but then again I was only talking one season. Think of how awesome the Voyager Year of Hell two-parter would have been if they had done an entire season based on that.

 

[Phily B]

I think he was one of the best child characters in sci-fi, they're generally very annoying.

 

[AntonyF]

Did you not notice Nana? And Terry? And Nicole? Or do you mean just boy eye candy?

Jake's a guy, so I think you can work it out.