Jake Sisko - Completely Unlikeable

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Deep Space Nine' started by spinagogue, Aug 22, 2017.

  1. Peach Wookiee

    Peach Wookiee Cuddly Mod of Doom Moderator

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    DonIago, I felt like Wesley in "Journey's End" was actually something that made sense. He'd spent a lot of his life pleasing others. He went to the Academy because that was expected. And then something horrible happened which changed his path. I didn't like Wesley's decision much at the time I saw the episode (I was 14 at the time), but a few years later, I understood him.
     
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  2. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I'm okay with the decision. I'm less okay with the way he mouths off at everyone in the process.
     
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  3. mlbach

    mlbach Captain Captain

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    Ah, well, he was very young. And once he found his true path, he cleaned up his attitude, and his language.
    Which I think was the point.
     
  4. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That may have been what they were going for, but I didn't find the execution very effective.
     
  5. UnknownSample

    UnknownSample Commodore Commodore

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    I thought Jake was a teenage character done right, for a change. I like him.
     
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  6. drt

    drt Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    It's been years since you posted, but since no one else answered...

    I bet you're right that the reason was Lofton was simply super cheap. Unlike Wil Whedon, he was an unknown when they cast him, so I doubt his salary was particularly high.
     
  7. STEPhon IT

    STEPhon IT Commodore Commodore

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    While I thought Jake was a man done wrong, while Nog appeared to had a more relevant future in Star Trek. Jake was irrelevant making him a writer instead of an engineer or scientist.
     
  8. Herbert

    Herbert Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    He's still human and sometimes humans spout off when stress comes into play.
    Actually, it was kind of refreshing to see that. It made him more real instead of Super Wesley, Boy Wonder that we see before that.
     
  9. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I thought Wesley was plenty real in "The Game" and "The First Duty", while "Journey's End" just made him an obnoxious jackass, then tried to write it off as "Traveler Growing Pains".
     
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  10. kkt

    kkt Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I don't see engineers and scientists as the only valid career choices in Star Trek. Making him a writer/reporter could have been a good choice. As a reporter he could go anywhere there was fighting or anything else interesting going on, stay for long enough to do a story, and if needed by the plot then move on. Or he could have pursued fiction writing or history writing or any other form.

    I see it as too bad that they didn't use him much, but that seems like Lofton's limitations rather than Jake's.
     
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  11. The ABehrration

    The ABehrration Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    There may well have been better career choices for Jake (wouldn't it have been cool if he decided to become a professional chef like Joseph?). However, I think that making him a writer/reporter was a good choice:
    • It allowed the show's writers to draw upon their own experiences
    • It kept Jake as part of the action, though as an outsider and observer rather than a participant
    • It allowed Jake to play a more directly interrogative role, allowing there to be more interpersonal conflict rather than the normal info dumping.
    • It worked as a good counterpoint to Nog's journey, becoming different types of men but still remain friends.
    • It allowed him to be useful to the story without inventing ways to keep him involved in the crisis of the week.
    Of course, the last few months has shown how important reporters are in revealing critical truths, something that they obtain at personal cost.
     
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  12. HugeLobes

    HugeLobes Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Comments like this always remind me of a satirical article I read about someone who had finally worked out what their career in Starfleet would be, despite having a really crummy job in the real world.

    Not everyone needs to be an engineer or a scientist, and making that the case kinda makes the world seem smaller instead of larger. And it certainly doesn’t make a character irrelevant. This is DS9! Was Quark irrelevant because he owned a bar? Was Garak because he was a tailor (albeit with a cool past)? Making Jake a writer was perfect because it allowed him to work in storylines where other characters wouldn’t and give him a reason to be interested in the war. If he was just another cadet then there wouldn’t be much to do with him you could also do with another character, especially with Nog entering the academy. One reason DS9 worked so well was that it included lots of characters from outside the normal Starfleet set to show wider repercussions and address new viewpoints.

    Most importantly, Jake’s relevance is not so much centred around his career as the fact that he’s Ben Sisko’s son. Really more than anything what set Sisko apart from the other captains was that he was a family man. He didn’t need to be made relevant in some new way, and it works better to keep Sisko’s family life separate from his work.
     
  13. STEPhon IT

    STEPhon IT Commodore Commodore

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    I would've preferred Jake to have a significant role in the plots and for me he was far more interesting when he was a boy than he was a man. Being a writer didn't have much weight in the whole scheme of things and it could've they did "Far Beyond the Stars" which could've been a Jake tale in some form but doesn't go anywhere IMO when it dealt with the whole course of things to come. Jake's role didn't pose as an opposition to the war which could've had some conflict between father and son on the ethics of war, there's nothing there as it were to grow Jake as a character. Ok, he's a writer but what will the producers do which will elevate his character??? The answer was unfortunately, nothing.
     
  14. DonIago

    DonIago Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Not everyone is destined to become an elevated person.
     
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  15. The ABehrration

    The ABehrration Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I'm glad they didn't go with this. Jake fighting his dad not only would have undone a lot of the positive work that the series had done protraying family life, it probably would have relied on a lot of tired tropes.
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2020
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  16. Jirin Actin Kinda Sus

    Jirin Actin Kinda Sus Admiral Admiral

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    I don't mind Jake Sisko, he's one of the more normal characters on the show and he served the purpose of showing us that not everybody on the show is focused on Starfleet and can have other kinds of careers or aspirations.
     
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  17. Oddish

    Oddish Fleet Captain Red Shirt

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    I didn't mind Jake at all. While I didn't hate Wesley the way some seem to, he seemed a little out of place. A 15 year old kid with 0 hours of Academy training should not have been flying the ship. And saving the ship every couple of episodes... :rolleyes:

    Jake seemed like a real teen, by comparison. Just like Naomi on Voyager seemed like a real kid.
     
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  18. Gelnon

    Gelnon Lieutenant Red Shirt

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    It seems OP like you're in a minority of one there
     
  19. Agony_Boothb

    Agony_Boothb Commodore Commodore

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    Sorry but a son choosing to step out of his fathers shadow by pursuing a career that he is passionate about and having said father be supportive of that decision, is much more thematically and dramatically interesting than seeing yet another wesley crusher-type following his father into starfleet.

    Jake's relevance as a character was his relationship with Sisko and not whether he could ham-fistedly be jammed into scenes involving reading out shield percentages or reciting techno babble.
     
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  20. Valin

    Valin Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The Siege of AR-558 and It's Only a Paper Moon are among my favorite episodes. It would have been even more dramatically interesting if Jake had joined Starfleet and been the one that lost his leg. How would Sisko have reacted? (Which is something that Quark suggests during the Siege .)
     
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