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Is Titan-A a refit of original Titan?

Eh, I just split the difference and prefer to think the Titan-A features some components of the original (some salvaged internal spaceframe members, external hull plates, and computer core files), but otherwise is a new ship. Maybe she contains 15% or less recycled parts of the original, but is still very much Neo-Constitution in design.
Same. I imagine they took the computer core (based on Shaw's comments) and several other core components and built a new frame around it. Called it a refit because it sounds cool and is a good marketing spin.

Ship looks cool and is the legacy of Captain Riker. Sounds very PR to me.
 
In the case of the Stargazer refit we saw in Pic s2... that actually works as a Constellation refit.
It would also explain lack of additional letter (such as 'A')... but for some reason, the ship isn't sporting the original Stargazer NCC number.
It would make more sense if SF retained the original NCC numbers and stated the Constellation underwent a massive design overhaul for the 25th century because of changes in technology that occurred in the late 24th century and integration of Borg tech too... plus, enough time passed for this to have happened.

I don't think it does work - the primary hull, for one, is an entirely different shape. It would have to be the broom analogy Matalas gave to justify his insistence that the Stargazer WAS a refit and not, as all other evidence suggests (and Memory Alpha agrees) an entirely new ship.

The Titan-A is a Neo Constitution class (a new design and new) starship.

Is it, though? It seems pretty clearly a plausible 'refit' of the Shangri-La class, see the gold ship models. That would better explain a 25th century makeover for the now-canon Shangri-La than either a totally new ship or an impossible refit of the Luna class Titan. It looks basically *nothing* like the Constitution II class. The only design feature in common is the front portion of the saucer section, which is shared with the Miranda and, rather obviously given said ship models, the Shangri-La. There is no way this design should be anything but the Shangri-La II class. It's only 'Neo-Constitution' or 'Constitution III' class because Matalas thinks it looks like his favourite Trek ship.
 
Saw this on FB ...
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According to some of the people on the show, it used parts from the original ship but is essentially a new ship. Hence the "A" and new class designation.
 
According to some of the people on the show, it used parts from the original ship but is essentially a new ship. Hence the "A" and new class designation.

Huh? None of the Enterprises used parts from a previous Enterprise, and they all had letter suffixes and new class designations. Their rationale sounds completely arbitrary to me.

The issue here is that statements made by the characters on the show either imply or downright state that this Titan is the same ship Riker got at the end of Nemesis, after some nebulous ‘refit.’ But simply using some parts from the Luna class would technically not make this ship ‘the same ship Riker got at the end of Nemesis,’ hence the confusion about said ‘refit.’

Now, if Lower Decks (and their depiction of the Titan and its previous iterations) are not in continuity with PIC, then there really isn’t a problem. But then why make a gold model of the Luna class and shoehorn it right between two ships that look 90% identical? (answer: they still wanted to acknowledge Torangeau’s design even though their new backstory for it doesn’t make logical sense.)
 
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I don't think it does work - the primary hull, for one, is an entirely different shape. It would have to be the broom analogy Matalas gave to justify his insistence that the Stargazer WAS a refit and not, as all other evidence suggests (and Memory Alpha agrees) an entirely new ship.

Actally, the 25th century Stargazer seems like a relatively modern upgrade on the 23rd century Stargazer (constellation class).
The basic design is there. It has a saucer and 4 nacelles which connect at the back. Personally, I find the 25th century Stargazer to be a bit too fat on the behind and a bit too blocky for my taste... I would have preferred something similar to the Prometheus (design wise) to be the modern take of the Stargazer.

Its possible that SF harvested the original Stargazer for its raw materials and used them to remake it into the modern Constellation class. Replicators and transporters could do it in tandem.

Similarly, SF could have done the same when they refitted the original TOS Enterprise into the one saw in the movie.
Same ship, but it WAS restructured in many aspects.
In effect, it turned out (probably) to be a largely new ship for that massive refit.
I wouldn't be surprised if the same thing happened here. Only in the case of the Stargazer, the change was more extreme due to larger passage of time and more advances in technology.

ST: DISCO implied the USS Thikov may have been the same Thikov that existed since the 23rd century... just heavily upgraded/refit over time.
And given the fact it was a seed vault ship meant to protect seed samples from the galaxy, it would make sense it would be at a (usually) undisclosed positions in space and getting refitted over time.

Once a vessel reaches say the first 40 or 50 years or active service, its design structure probably starts undergoing visible changes to keep it on par with modern ships (naturally internal hw would be upgraded as well).

And the actual frame and underlying superstructure of the ship could be 'refreshed' with repliactors and transporters every 50 odd years if the stress accummulated enough to the point to warrant it. So in that case, you wouldn't really touch the rest of the ship (or it could be done simultaneously, if its time for the hw to be upgraded), just disaseemble bits of the old frame in the matter stream, reform it into same thing, but brand new, and beam it back into place.

Is it, though? It seems pretty clearly a plausible 'refit' of the Shangri-La class, see the gold ship models. That would better explain a 25th century makeover for the now-canon Shangri-La than either a totally new ship or an impossible refit of the Luna class Titan. It looks basically *nothing* like the Constitution II class. The only design feature in common is the front portion of the saucer section, which is shared with the Miranda and, rather obviously given said ship models, the Shangri-La. There is no way this design should be anything but the Shangri-La II class. It's only 'Neo-Constitution' or 'Constitution III' class because Matalas thinks it looks like his favourite Trek ship.

The dialogue between Picard, Riker and new captain of the Titan-A describes the ship as Neo Constitution in the first episode of Picard S3.
I agree that it works better as a 25th century refit of the Shangri-La class, but in fairness, the only thing that's mostly different are the nacelles and some changes to the secondary hull in addition to some phaser strips to the saucer?

23rd century design theme would have likely been phased out entirely by this point in time and the saucer would end up being more in Sovereign style or Stargazer (25th century version) like.
This would mean, no ball turrets, full phaser strips across the saucer, and various other 23rd century identifiable hallmarks.

Unless more radical design changes came about in the later part of the 25th century that would completely change the look of the ship but keep overall design philosophy (I say this because in early Season 3 of DISCO, captain Nyonte suggested that Disco, due to its mettalurty, may have been from a period of 23rd to 25th century - suggesting that if same ship designs persisted past that point, more radical changes to the hull geometry would have taken place in the 26th century to those designs to keep them on par with other ships (in the meantime, ships made and designed in the 23rd century would receive some changes to overall external look of the ship, which could be more extreme depending on which design they focused more efforts on - perhaps the 25th century Stargazer version)?

I'm just speculating here obviously, but the Neo Constitution line comes from on-screen dialogue.
 
I agree that it works better as a 25th century refit of the Shangri-La class, but in fairness, the only thing that's mostly different are the nacelles and some changes to the secondary hull in addition to some phaser strips to the saucer?
it's also 270 meters longer than the original, if Paramount doesn't decide to scale up the Shangri-La Mark II
 
it's also 270 meters longer than the original, if Paramount doesn't decide to scale up the Shangri-La Mark II

Scaling up existing classes as part of their refits while not changing the class of the ship is doable.
You can argue that the ship is longer because the 25th century engineers deemed that change to be necessary and as part of the refit - depending on what type of mission profile this class of ship was supposed to have.

Its possible other copies of this ship flying about may have a lot more powerful shields and weapons because of different mission profiles?
 
Maybe it is just the original Titan but reshaped using technology we don't understand. Even Doug Drexler surmised the Enterprise hull might've been grown vs welded on. And the programmable matter from Discovery has to come into play at some point. Maybe it started with starship construction.
 
Its possible other copies of this ship flying about may have a lot more powerful shields and weapons because of different mission profiles?
Yup.

Shaw strikes me as being fairly by the book, so he requested a loadout, and no more, based on their mission. If he was going to a border conflict he would have been requested to be equipped as such.

This whole encounter with the Shrike is not in his plans.
 
Or just not go to a hostile area in a ship not designed to go to said hostile area...
You wouldn't seed an Oberth in, thats basically all a Neo Connie is, a bigger survey ship with minimal weapons. Its like going into a modern air combat with a P51. Yes the P51 has guns, but thats about it.

Could you reequip to make it a warship? Maybe?? Oberth had a variant with a Miranda torpedo pod instead of the science pod, so anything is possible.

If Picard and Riker thought they were going to go into combat, they would have taken a Defiant or Sovereign or akira.. not a fancy science ship.
 
Huh? None of the Enterprises used parts from a previous Enterprise, and they all had letter suffixes and new class designations. Their rationale sounds completely arbitrary to me.

The issue here is that statements made by the characters on the show either imply or downright state that this Titan is the same ship Riker got at the end of Nemesis, after some nebulous ‘refit.’ But simply using some parts from the Luna class would technically not make this ship ‘the same ship Riker got at the end of Nemesis,’ hence the confusion about said ‘refit.’

Now, if Lower Decks (and their depiction of the Titan and its previous iterations) are not in continuity with PIC, then there really isn’t a problem. But then why make a gold model of the Luna class and shoehorn it right between two ships that look 90% identical? (answer: they still wanted to acknowledge Torangeau’s design even though their new backstory for it doesn’t make logical sense.)
It could be just some random replicator they took from the original Titan for all we know. :)
 
Could you reequip to make it a warship? Maybe?? Oberth had a variant with a Miranda torpedo pod instead of the science pod, so anything is possible.

Not necessarily turn it into a warship.... but equip it to be able to stand up to a warship perhaps.
Plus, there are plethora of dangeorus anomalies out there that can batter ship's shields. Having more powerful defensive and offensive systems would come in hand either way.

If Picard and Riker thought they were going to go into combat, they would have taken a Defiant or Sovereign or akira.. not a fancy science ship.

But they knew they were going into a potentially dangerous situation based on Beverly's message. The very tone of her voice and her warning kinda predicated this eventuality... so, combat was a very real possibility.

Given what happened in episode 1, I'd surmise that neither Riker or Picard could actually secure any other ship because they needed to get to Beverly... and the Titan-A was the one where Seven was serving on - that was basically their 'way in'.
 
Maybe it is just the original Titan but reshaped using technology we don't understand. Even Doug Drexler surmised the Enterprise hull might've been grown vs welded on. And the programmable matter from Discovery has to come into play at some point. Maybe it started with starship construction.

You can reshape the existing ships using sufficiently large replicator and transporter systems.
A drydock for example could effectively be outfitted for just that purpose (house very large industrial grade replicators, transporters and large pattern buffers... take sections of the ship by beaming them out and placing a forcefield in their place, and then reshape the old sections in the matter stream into state of the art bits and beam them back into place.
You don't need unknown tech to do this.. existing tech (only scaled up a bit) would work just fine.

Programmable tech doesn't seem like it will be entering the scene anytime soon... I'd say this would come into play in the 29th and 30th century probably.

Doug Drexler proposed that the Enterprise-J (as seen in ST: Enterprise alternate timeline) was grown in the 26th century... so this era (At least according to Doug) would have focused on more organic based ships and means of construction, and he envisioned it as a century in which all of the crew were networked cybernetically to augment the ship's processing capabilities... but it was a cooperative scenario in which obviously no one was harmed in the process and their individualities remained intact.

Though, that's not canon.
 
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