I think it's more this than the male dominated staff. As many male writers have portrayed women well throughout film and tv.
Is Janeway a bad Captain?
- Thread starter Garren
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I think it's more this than the male dominated staff. As many male writers have portrayed women well throughout film and tv.
I concur. I was beginning to suspect when we start our journey with a misogynists the Kazon and then jabs by Q "That's what we get for having a woman in the Captain's seat."
Later in the series I don't think she's questioned again. It all seemed to be stuffed into the first two seasons. So I began to wonder did they write it to ease their own selves into it? Or were they afraid of us?
Later in the series I don't think she's questioned again. It all seemed to be stuffed into the first two seasons. So I began to wonder did they write it to ease their own selves into it? Or were they afraid of us?
I'm sometimes as sexist as the next guy, simply because I'm from an older generation than most people here. I do my best to curb it, but it occasionally slips out. I don't read the books, don't know anything about her death in the books (so thanks for spoiling that for me), so don't lump me in that camp. I wasn't online during Voyager's run, so I don't know what has been bandied about for the last 20 years.
My conclusions are based on considering myself a Star Trek fan, having watched every series since first tuning in TOS in 1966, and what I see just from being online here over the last two years, which is the longest amount of time I've been at any Star Trek site. Some people though, would say I'm not a fan, because I haven't been actively participating online all this time.
I want to make it clear I am a Janeway fan but I don't intend to assume one is sexist for not agreeing or flat out disliking Janeway. I admit I was a little bothered by themes in the show I felt I had to question . (Just showing where I stand. I am not assuming anyone is accusing me of anything at this time)
Well said book came out seven years ago so I figured it was common knowledge by this point especially since some Janeway fans had a meltdown over it.
Sorry to do that.
It's just I've become a little suspicious about that complaint after the afore mentioned meltdown in which the at the time female head editor of Pocket Books was accused of sexism for okaying it, the considerable roster of trek lit female starship captains were either ignored or considered irrelevant to as part of these accusation, and that this lasted a half a fraking decade.
Instead we got the lite version of Helana Cain.
Of course then we got a way more interesting and also female new captain and everyone left on Voyager got needed character development
And then that got flushed when Pocket Books lost their fraking spines and ressurected Janeway, got rid of the new captain, and ushered in the age of trek lit copying the worst parts of the comic book industry.
My favorite WTF Janeway moment was when she chose to play moral majority w the Ferengi over getting Voyager through a wormhole and home.
Yeah, that was pretty much a terrible episode.
You can't even play the 'Sticking to Federation principals' card there because interfering was a clear PD violation.
You can't even play the 'Sticking to Federation principals' card there because interfering was a clear PD violation.
Oh but she tried to make it sound didn't she? I happened to watch that episode two nights ago. All this forum typing had me wanting to watch early years. I am with Tuvok and even her "We're technically responsible.". Mmm no. Say it Captain, "call me a principal upholding hypocrite today because truthfully I hate ferengi. These people need help and I'll take ownership if we get home. now let's go!"
Actually, I enjoy the episode in a laugh and shake my head sort of way.
The Ferengi probably did this with every prewarp planet anywhere near Ferenginar, and the Federation doesn't feel the need to interfere in all those cases. They didn't interfere in Bajor until Cardassians voluntarily left and they were actively murdering people, not just exploiting them for profit. Why is this case different from all the cases the Federation leaves it alone?
It is in no way the Federation's fault either. The Federation were a bidding party to gain control of a resource belonging to a neutral planet, and so were the Ferengi. They crossed through the wormhole on their own, then refused Geordi's advice to go back through when he explicitly told them it was collapsing.
There are more problems with that episode though. The planet's entire population portrayed as abject morons, the financial capital never having more than six people present at a time, the Ferengi escaping due to incompetent security.
This episode nearly made me quit the series the first time around. I actually did for a few episodes, just decided to give it another chance later in the season and luckily there was a good run of episodes at the time.
It is in no way the Federation's fault either. The Federation were a bidding party to gain control of a resource belonging to a neutral planet, and so were the Ferengi. They crossed through the wormhole on their own, then refused Geordi's advice to go back through when he explicitly told them it was collapsing.
There are more problems with that episode though. The planet's entire population portrayed as abject morons, the financial capital never having more than six people present at a time, the Ferengi escaping due to incompetent security.
This episode nearly made me quit the series the first time around. I actually did for a few episodes, just decided to give it another chance later in the season and luckily there was a good run of episodes at the time.
Yeah, no doubt both TNG and Voyager feature many examples of "white man's burden" colonialism condescension on the part of The Fed.
If I were to answer the question asked by the title of this thread: Is Janeway a bad Captain?
My answer would be: Yes, she is a terrible captain.
I think I agree with many people here and would place the blame on the inconsistent writing of the character and not necessarily on Mulgrew's shoulders, but this isn't a question about writing or acting, its about Janeway's captaincy - which I think was terrible and one of the things that made me enjoy this show a lot less than TNG or DS9.
My answer would be: Yes, she is a terrible captain.
I think I agree with many people here and would place the blame on the inconsistent writing of the character and not necessarily on Mulgrew's shoulders, but this isn't a question about writing or acting, its about Janeway's captaincy - which I think was terrible and one of the things that made me enjoy this show a lot less than TNG or DS9.
If she was such a terrible captain why did everyone love her?
Yah, go in universe for your explanation.
Yah, go in universe for your explanation.
Battered spouses?
That works.
OR we could go with Twilight. Janeway as Team Janeway creeping into your window to woo and fuck you and you're in the Delta Quadrant and this is the most exciting pony you can ride out on. You want her. Why wouldn't you. Are you SESKA do you want the KAZON?! Those fuckwits, no you don't want that they are too much work and unlike Janeway there are no cookies.
OR we could go with Twilight. Janeway as Team Janeway creeping into your window to woo and fuck you and you're in the Delta Quadrant and this is the most exciting pony you can ride out on. You want her. Why wouldn't you. Are you SESKA do you want the KAZON?! Those fuckwits, no you don't want that they are too much work and unlike Janeway there are no cookies.
I'm getting a little weepy thinking about it.
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