Hey, I never noticed that before....
- Thread starter Warped9
- Start date
Yeah, Ensign Haines. With Chekov on the planet she was the Designated Sulu.
We only saw one clear example of a female first officer, and Pike did say that in some way his female first officer was "different."
It takes gymnastics to make the Pike bridge scene work
I'm going with "It was a joke"
A joke would take wits. And the point here is that Pike is out of his...
The whole team is battle-fatigued from Rigel VII. Pike has just lost a boy who was close to him. Instead of the boy, he now has a girl on the bridge in the usual behind-his-left-shoulder position. He isn't used to seeing her when he expects to see the face (or, given the relative physical positions, the chest) of the now-dead boy.
-> Pike's comment.
-> Frantic backpedaling and digging-a-deeper-hole when he realizes what he said.
The scene works fine when we consider the fatigue. And in-universe and in-writing, it's definitely supposed to represent our would-be heroes at their worst, even though the failure to subsequently shoot a TV show with the characters may leave us thinking that Pike is actually a cowardly, violent and sexist drunkard 24/7/365. (And that Spock has a permanent limp...)
But thinking that what we saw is what was supposed to be an ordinary day in the lives of the characters would be odd indeed. Why does Pike withdraw to his bunk to brood and drink? The immediate reason is that he just made an ass of himself on the bridge!
Timo Saloniemi
The whole team is battle-fatigued from Rigel VII. Pike has just lost a boy who was close to him. Instead of the boy, he now has a girl on the bridge in the usual behind-his-left-shoulder position. He isn't used to seeing her when he expects to see the face (or, given the relative physical positions, the chest) of the now-dead boy.
-> Pike's comment.
-> Frantic backpedaling and digging-a-deeper-hole when he realizes what he said.
The scene works fine when we consider the fatigue. And in-universe and in-writing, it's definitely supposed to represent our would-be heroes at their worst, even though the failure to subsequently shoot a TV show with the characters may leave us thinking that Pike is actually a cowardly, violent and sexist drunkard 24/7/365. (And that Spock has a permanent limp...)
But thinking that what we saw is what was supposed to be an ordinary day in the lives of the characters would be odd indeed. Why does Pike withdraw to his bunk to brood and drink? The immediate reason is that he just made an ass of himself on the bridge!
Timo Saloniemi
"The Cloud Minders"
There's a great shot in the Transporter Room where I always thought they built a ceiling, just for this episode:
http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/3x21hd/thecloudmindershd0836.jpg
http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/3x21hd/thecloudmindershd0837.jpg
But if you A/B these images, you can see that Spock's head actually goes behind the "ceiling," revealing that it is a panel placed in front of the set. Nimoy must have been a quarter-inch taller than his stand-in, who would have been on that mark when the shot was set up. But otherwise, what a great illusion for the two-dimensional screen. It looks as if the Transporter Room has a complicated, structured ceiling to accommodate the ship's machinery. It's visually interesting in itself, for the techno fan.
The same trick was arranged, less convincingly, in "The Mark of Gideon":
http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/3x16hd/themarkofgideonhd0061.jpg
But this overhead panel isn't much to look at, and it doesn't line up with anything behind it. The bridge is still gorgeous.
There's a great shot in the Transporter Room where I always thought they built a ceiling, just for this episode:
http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/3x21hd/thecloudmindershd0836.jpg
http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/3x21hd/thecloudmindershd0837.jpg
But if you A/B these images, you can see that Spock's head actually goes behind the "ceiling," revealing that it is a panel placed in front of the set. Nimoy must have been a quarter-inch taller than his stand-in, who would have been on that mark when the shot was set up. But otherwise, what a great illusion for the two-dimensional screen. It looks as if the Transporter Room has a complicated, structured ceiling to accommodate the ship's machinery. It's visually interesting in itself, for the techno fan.
The same trick was arranged, less convincingly, in "The Mark of Gideon":
http://tos.trekcore.com/hd/albums/3x16hd/themarkofgideonhd0061.jpg
But this overhead panel isn't much to look at, and it doesn't line up with anything behind it. The bridge is still gorgeous.
My quote was in direct reply to Janice Lester’s line about Kirk’s “world of starship captains doesn’t admit women.” The Pike line, though, is just as sexist.
The lily white casting and openly sexist writing in the pilot shows a significantly less progressive concept than what people give the series credit for. Even with adjustments, it was never as revolutionary as other shows of the time.
Fortunately, I loved it for A variety of unrelated reasons.
Aren't we looking from underneath a panel in the Gideon shot?
That’s what I always assumed. The camera was under the camera was under the panel where the crewmen’s feet would be
I wondered that too but I can't get the height and centre angle to match up
Spock does have a permanent limp. It can be seen from at least Balance of Terror to TUC in the main productions. Any time Leonard Nimoy can be seen walking from head to toe. I have no idea how Nimoy got it.
I don't think the camera is dead on centre, which is why the top doesn't directly align with the bridge, the turbo door etc
That would make even less sense than a blanket prohibition. If some women are seen as eligible to be assigned as first officer and next in line to starship command, what then would be the argument against all women being eligible?
...Number One not being a woman?
She looks like one, and the Talosians mistake her for one all right. Other options abound, though, technically. And perhaps she herself went for a technicality in order to get to practice her profession of choice, perhaps undergoing surgery or something?
Timo Saloniemi
She looks like one, and the Talosians mistake her for one all right. Other options abound, though, technically. And perhaps she herself went for a technicality in order to get to practice her profession of choice, perhaps undergoing surgery or something?
Timo Saloniemi
If Number One were really a dude down there, then "The Cage" would be more sexist than anybody ever dreamed.
the talosian are telepaths, if N.O. consistantly thought of him/her-self as female, while not being such genetically, how would the talosians "see" N.O. ?
The bridge wedges from Spock's station to and including the main viewer were routinely pulled out. In the shot in question they've rolled some of the platforms back in but they've not put them in their actual places—notice the railings don't line up. That's why the chair is there: to hide the gap and the misalignment.
Ah ha! Thanks for that!
You know....I never gave that much thought into what happened on Rigel in The Cage.
Pike must have really thought the situation was safe to have a young yeoman* down there. So to get fooled that badly and get him killed...yeah, I can see how that really shook him up
*Rand aside. Who they seem to have ditched the yeoman thing because she's incredibly talented and smart. She can helm the damn starship.
You know the real sexism of The Cage is the Talosians saying how Colt and Number One harbor fantasies of Pike without at least giving *Number One* a chance to address it to Pike. TODAY, on DISC or their own show, I can totally see Rebecca Romain owning it. "And?? So?? He's handsome. We're both adults. It's not like I'm pining for you or scheming to drag you to the alter.....whats your excuse Colt??"
Pike must have really thought the situation was safe to have a young yeoman* down there. So to get fooled that badly and get him killed...yeah, I can see how that really shook him up
*Rand aside. Who they seem to have ditched the yeoman thing because she's incredibly talented and smart. She can helm the damn starship.
You know the real sexism of The Cage is the Talosians saying how Colt and Number One harbor fantasies of Pike without at least giving *Number One* a chance to address it to Pike. TODAY, on DISC or their own show, I can totally see Rebecca Romain owning it. "And?? So?? He's handsome. We're both adults. It's not like I'm pining for you or scheming to drag you to the alter.....whats your excuse Colt??"
Is that sexism, or more a violation of privacy by pointing it out?
People have fantasies about people they work with, from passing thoughts to detailed scenarios. Maybe a bit surprising is that the Talosian didn't indicate whether Pike had any reciprocal fantasies about either woman.
