Founders and Solids living in Peace?

[Kilana2]

Is it - after the the Dominion War, and given that the Founders are xenophobic - possible that changelings and solids can live in peace?

Odo as part of the Great Link may have a positive influence.

On the other hand there was Laas - he never related to Odo's friendship to many of the solids.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Is there evidence that societies shift away from racism? It happens, often slowly, but more rapidly in the face of a crushing defeat and with the help of thoughtful leaders. I could not myself imagine the shift in German attitudes without Adenauer directly seeking alliances with Israel and support from Jewish organizations, something which helped to reconstruct German identity.

 

[hux]

I'm not sure what the litverse says about it but I honestly don't see it. As much influence as Odo might have, I think the countless other changelings will influence him more.

It always seemed like they would be nervously on guard as long as that wormhole was accessible.

I see the Dominion staying in the Gamma quadrant but building for war. Always building.

 

[Kilana2]

As to the litverse it is a `we leave you alone and you leave us alone´situation between the AQ and the Dominion.

Spoiler: Odo Litverse

in the Litverse Odo and Laas become the leaders of the Dominion and the Great Link dissolves.In the novels after What you leave behand the Dominion is still expansionist.

I'm wondering if and how many shapeshifters are still at large in the AQ, disguised as Lieutenant Whoever or so....

Here is at least one shapeshifter in the forum...

 

[kkt]

I expect the Dominion launched an invasion force going the long way back around season 4, and it should reach the Alpha Quadrant in 90 years or so.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

In the long long term, sure. In the short term, the Dominion probably went dark and consolidated GQ power.

I agree the Founders would want to keep spies in the Federation. But, to do that, it would have to be spies who never had contact with the Link after Broken Link. Or else they'd be dead, or they wouldn't have been able to get through the sensor net that the Fed undoubtedly installed at the entrance to the wormhole after the war.

 

[Kilana2]

There must still be changelings around in the AQ, even after the end of the war. The question remains: what are they up to?

 

[kkt]

Keeping an eye on everything to smooth the way for the battle fleet. I'm sure some Founders were in the AQ from season 2 if not earlier.

Was it ever established that the Founders were ignorant of the wormhole until Dax and Sisko discovered it?

 

[TheVortaKeevan]

I expect the Dominion launched an invasion force going the long way back around season 4, and it should reach the Alpha Quadrant in 90 years or so.

.

I'm sure when the fleet arrive in the Alpha Quadrant they are nothing more then an Armanda.

 

[Shada Dukal]

Solids and Changelings can learn not to invade each other’s space. This is enough. The Changelings can expand as much as they want within their quadrant if they don’t threaten the borders of the solids in the AQ and BQ. No need to be best friends, a grudging peace will do. The question is whether the solids will stop their incursions through the wormhole and their expansion into the Gama Quadrant? They may call it exploration but from a Changeling’s point of view, it is a downright invasion.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

I don't buy that there is a Dominion fleet heading toward the AQ. You need a base of operations and supply lines. If the Dominion fleet is heading toward the AQ they're doing it slowly conquering and establishing power bases as they go. So maybe 200 years.

I think the solids will stop making incursions into the GQ. At least for a while. The Federation is perched at the only access point and if they went 75 years without making a cloaking device they'll sure as hell uphold a treaty that is actually a good idea. But they'll probably occasionally sent out communications to try to start up diplomatic relations, because the Federation.

Given the logic of the Trek universe, I think a couple centuries in the future the Federation and Dominion do coexist peacefully.

 

[wulfio]

I doubt it. The founders were basically mustache twirling villains. Ironically, the Vorta, and Jem'Hadar(who were bread for singular purpose) were written much more sympathetically, and dynamically, than those who are ultimately their leaders/gods.

 

[kkt]

That brings up an interesting question. The Female Changeling was out of touch with the Great Link for most of the Dominion War and acting on her own. Maybe she was especially harsh during the war and the rest of the Link would have been willing to coexist with the other AQ powers?

 

[Kilana2]

It all depends on Odo's influence. I guess a grudging tolerance, nothing more, is possible. The Founders are still xenophobic. Laas didn't get along with the solids after all.

 

[Hando]

Could they live in peace? As people of course they could. After all we have already seen and met several shifter species and there has been no great anti-shifter crusade.

It may be that we see this from the point of the Federation, an open multi-species society, which is less fearful of others. While single-species nations and autocratic empires would have more issues with the Changelings.

There are however also some other issues. The Dominion itself, it is set up as an absentee absolute bureaucratic monarchy. There appears only a handful active Founders, while the rest is embroiled in an never-ending orgy. So only those active Founders could find out that not all solids are bad, however it is these active Founders who are waging the war. Also remember that the Dominion is is constantly at war or participates in a conflict - after all the average life expectancy of a Jem'Hadar is 15 years, even if they are able to live at least by 30.
Even with Odo as part-ruler, or later co-ruler, we have not seen any significant changes in policy in the Dominium.

 

[Chen]

There appears only a handful active Founders, while the rest is embroiled in an never-ending orgy. So only those active Founders could find out that not all solids are bad, however it is these active Founders who are waging the war.

Yes, but those active founders go back to the never-ending orgy and share all their thoughts with the others, two ways. That means all of the other founders get to share their experiences. I think that's the point of the link!

 

[Shada Dukal]

The Dominion has a unique system of government, most of the Dominion species have never seen a Founder, the majority of changelings have no actual participation in the day-to-day administrative matters which are left to the Vorta and Jem’Hadar. Odo succeeds in maintaining the internal stability of the Dominion and keeps its borders closed, this is explained in the novels.

In this sense, the changelings have to negotiate the exact borders of the Dominion in GQ and its future direction of expansion. As long as they realize that attacking solids from AQ and BQ will result in more complications, they will have to confine their activities to their present territories in the Gama Quadrant. Respectively, any exploration attempts in the GQ should not infringe their territory and AQ and BQ species should not colonize planets that belong to the Dominion or are in their sphere of influence. In this sense, a kind of buffer zone or DMZ seems to be a good idea.

By the way, Jankata Accords signed by the Federation and the Cardassian Union postulated that “no species shall enter another quadrant for the purpose of territorial expansion.” However, the Federation continued to visit the Gamma Quadrant so Ronald D. Moore stated:

"The Dominion does not own the entire Gamma Quadrant. We had explored the GQ for two years before encountering the Dominion, so it's not as though the wormhole opens up in their living room. There are other races in the GQ that are not part of the Dominion and the Ferengi at least have established trade with some of them. When the Dominion told us to stay out of the GQ, it was as if China told the US to stay out of the Yellow Sea. China is the big boy in this neck of the woods, and you better take their warning seriously, but at the same time we have trading partners and allies there and hey, freedom of the seas and all that." (AOL chat, 1997)

 

[JirinPanthosa]

I doubt it. The founders were basically mustache twirling villains. Ironically, the Vorta, and Jem'Hadar(who were bread for singular purpose) were written much more sympathetically, and dynamically, than those who are ultimately their leaders/gods.

The Founders' actions were certainly not sympathetic but it always seemed to me like the only reason they tried to dominate solids is that they spent a long time living in fear of being hunted by solids. Before the Dominion was established the changelings were treated by solids as badly as they treated solids, so they were unable to conceive that any solid left to their own devices would not treat them that way.

But, Odo was able to convince the female Changeling at least that the Federation would not attempt to attack them after the war was over, and then he went to the link to convince them of the same thing. If they really can be convinced that the Federation would not hunt them as they did thousands of years ago, sure they can eventually live in peace.

 

[Chen]

By the way, Jankata Accords signed by the Federation and the Cardassian Union postulated that “no species shall enter another quadrant for the purpose of territorial expansion.” However, the Federation continued to visit the Gamma Quadrant

Right, but they didn't expand their territory by establishing outposts out there, did they? (Am I remembering that right?)

 

[Inactive-Shapeshifter]

As to the litverse it is a `we leave you alone and you leave us alone´situation between the AQ and the Dominion.

Spoiler: Odo Litverse

in the Litverse Odo and Laas become the leaders of the Dominion and the Great Link dissolves.In the novels after What you leave behand the Dominion is still expansionist.

I'm wondering if and how many shapeshifters are still at large in the AQ, disguised as Lieutenant Whoever or so....

Here is at least one shapeshifter in the forum...

And what makes you say that?