First-Timer's Impressions of Deep Space Nine

[TheGodBen]

The Nagus

Hmm. Hmm indeed. Interesting. So this is DS9, huh?

Yes, this is DS9's first Ferengi comedy episode! There will be many more. They're very hit and miss, some of them are genuinely funny and some of them are godsawful, I'll leave you to decide which is which.

The following just screams 90's sitcom. It's like a Full House episode.

That's because Ira Behr tried to make a career as a comedy writer before settling as a dramatic writer, and this is one of the reasons why DS9 had about two or three comedic episodes per season. In fact, Ira Behr's only two solo episodes on TNG were Captain's Holiday and Qpid.

"The people of 1993 played around with the idea of having *real* holographic sexual simulations. This shows that in they're world sex was associated with bad consequences - whether a punishment from God or an unwanted disease - and all their mental capacities where used to dream of means to experience "real" sex without the consequences.

I fail to see how things have changed since then.

One thing you should do after watching The Nagus is to completely ignore the way Rom was portrayed as it is nothing like the Rom of the rest of the show. In fact, the idea that Rom would ever try to kill Quark makes no sense given everything that comes later, it's just so... un-Rom.

 

[Jimmy Bob]

] I fail to see how things have changed since then.

Jimmy Bob, the amateur anthropologist, is completely oblivious to and detached from his contemporary times and reality.

 

[Jimmy Bob]

Also, in the end of Nagus, when Nog and Jake were checking up a passing vulcan woman, I bet they were really glad that they didn't get a boner because in those clothes.... mucho embarassing.

 

[Jimmy Bob]

Vortex

Hmm...

I don't get Quark's implied plan at all. What did he try to accomplish in this episode?

It's an average episode itself. The tale of a bounty hunter or security officer bonding with his captive has been done so many times. And they're all nice tales. Even this one. And I quite enjoyed Cliff DeYoung's performance. But... it's like fast food. Safe and nice, but predictable.

God I hate when I use cliche sayings like that. But there just isn't a different way to express that. It's like mother's love - safe and nice, but predictable? No, doesn't work. *sigh* I'm a collection of cliches that pre-program my thinking. It makes me sad. I'm a lie. Go away now, I'm having an existential crisis.

Is Morn going to become a recurring joke?

So far Odo and Quark seem to be the writer's favorites. They're the most developed.

It's nice to see all those Enterprise cameos. If it weren't for those I would not be watching this crap .

Oh, next episode Kai Opaka - finally!

 

[TheGodBen]

It's an average episode itself. The tale of a bounty hunter or security officer bonding with his captive has been done so many times. And they're all nice tales. Even this one. And I quite enjoyed Cliff DeYoung's performance. But... it's like fast food. Safe and nice, but predictable.

Yes, it's not a great episode, but it's pleasant to watch and should you ever rewatch the show you'll go "Oh right, I didn't realise they were planning that this early." Of course, they weren't planning it, someone probably just rewatched this episode years later when they actually were planning it and incorporated elements presented here, but it's still nice that it fits together.

Is Morn going to become a recurring joke?

. . .

 

[apenpaap]

I quite like Vortex myself. It's not great, but pretty nice.

Spoiler: The change in the cast in "Meridian"

 

[Jimmy Bob]

Battle Lines

It seems I got too excited too soon. I thought that since there was a Kai Opaka in it, I might get a great insight into bajoran religion and society... instead I got a random Gamma-planet-of-the-week episode. I tell you, there is just so many ways this show could have gone really wrong. Right now I'm just taking your word guys that it turned out to be an awesome show.

But try to imagine it from my side - every day they go through the portal to go on a yet another planet and have adventures and learn important lessons - scary, isn't it?

Don't you just hate sudden deaths? They're just embarassing. I mean, it's like you have this really great girlfriend and you're really in love and happy and you're out with your friends and sharing that happiness and then your girlfriend gets hit by a bus... where did all that happiness go? Wouldn't you feel embarassed then? Like whoops. No?

Spoiler: me

I'm a sick sick person.

The idea of having this eternal war with eternal soldiers is a really great idea. But when O'Brien started talking nonsense I realized what this episode did wrong. This could have used a more visceral sadness approach. But instead there was just talk and technobabble and lot of meh.

The only good moment was Kira's confession to Kai. How did the bajoran religious leaders approach Cardassian Occupation anyway? I think that was a real "grey" moment. Just striked me as very honest for Kira to have that guilt.

Also.

"You might want to warn Kira before she sees her file."
(Walking in) "Warn me? About what?"
"Oh, uh, Dax and Mr. O'Brien discovered some of the last Prefect's personal files. There's a file on you, but you may find it disappointing."
"I'm a big girl, Commander."
(Later, storming out) " 'A minor operative whose activities are limited to running errands for the terrorist leaders' ?!"
"Major, when you're through feeling under-appreciated, perhaps you'd join me in welcoming the Kai aboard."

 

[Jimmy Bob]

Yes, it's not a great episode, but it's pleasant to watch and should you ever rewatch the show you'll go "Oh right, I didn't realise they were planning that this early." Of course, they weren't planning it, someone probably just rewatched this episode years later when they actually were planning it and incorporated elements presented here, but it's still nice that it fits together.

Like what? Hmm... something to do with the changelings? That they're hiding, gone, persecuted? That they have colonies?

It's great when writers try to create a unified tapestry. Really adds a lot.

 

[DevilEyes]

Yes, it's not a great episode, but it's pleasant to watch and should you ever rewatch the show you'll go "Oh right, I didn't realise they were planning that this early." Of course, they weren't planning it, someone probably just rewatched this episode years later when they actually were planning it and incorporated elements presented here, but it's still nice that it fits together.

Like what? Hmm... something to do with the changelings? That they're hiding, gone, persecuted? That they have colonies?

It's great when writers try to create a unified tapestry. Really adds a lot.

Oh man, you have no idea. It's too good to spoil.

 

[TheGodBen]

Battle Lines

It seems I got too excited too soon.

Yeah, I thought you'd feel that way, the episode has nothing to do with the Prophets and just doesn't live up to the potential that an episode involving the Kai should have. But the issue of Opaka "dying" isn't forgotten and by the end of the season they will begin to explore the interesting political situation this creates on Bajor, and that will be exploited further in season 2. So while the episode itself isn't that good, its consequences will last right up until the series finale.

Right now I'm just taking your word guys that it turned out to be an awesome show.

I wish I could say that you're about to enter to promised land, but there's still a few episodes you will have to endure as opposed to enjoy. But you are getting close.

Don't you just hate sudden deaths? They're just embarassing. I mean, it's like you have this really great girlfriend and you're really in love and happy and you're out with your friends and sharing that happiness and then your girlfriend gets hit by a bus... where did all that happiness go?

You can usually find it at the bottom of a half-dozen drinks.

Spoiler: me

I'm a sick sick person.

Spoiler: you

Yes. Yes, you are. That's why I don't dislike you. (And that's the closest I'll ever get to complimenting you.)

Like what? Hmm... something to do with the changelings? That they're hiding, gone, persecuted? That they have colonies?

It's great when writers try to create a unified tapestry. Really adds a lot.

I'm just curious, how much of this show has been spoiled for you? You've been on the board now for almost a year, so surely some parts of the various stories have been spoiled for you. It's just that there are certain plot elements I tend to assume everybody here knows so I'm curious about just how unspoiled you have stayed.

 

[Jimmy Bob]

I'm pretty unspoiled. I know that 7th season has a different Dax. That's about it.

And I read an article which said that DS9 handling of religion was remarkable.

I haven't really roamed freely around the boards. Some places in these forums are just downright scary and end any desire to explore. So, except for reading Voyager parts in Sykonee's DS9 viewing thread, I haven't really been in DS9 section before. Mostly sticked to what I was currently viewing.

 

[TheGodBen]

Then you should be in for a treat, there's some really great twists coming.

 

[Sykonee]

Then you should be in for a treat, there's some really great twists coming.

Like Quark's nefarious pretzel plan!


...sorry, couldn't resist.

 

[Eyes]

I would actually say that Vortex and Battle Lines, Vortex especially are the highs of mid-season 1. They're a bit dry, but almost all of season 1 is.

It will get better once you clear the next few, from then on there should be only occasional blips, I hope.

 

[apenpaap]

I'm pretty unspoiled. I know that 7th season has a different Dax. That's about it.

And I read an article which said that DS9 handling of religion was remarkable.

I haven't really roamed freely around the boards. Some places in these forums are just downright scary and end any desire to explore. So, except for reading Voyager parts in Sykonee's DS9 viewing thread, I haven't really been in DS9 section before. Mostly sticked to what I was currently viewing.

I'm really jealous. When I first watched DS9, I was already spoiled on

Spoiler: Really, DON'T click this one if you're Jimmy Bob

Spoiler: I said don't!

The structure of the Dominion, including the identity of the Founders, the Klingon War, Worf joining the crew, Sisko growing a beard, Dukat betraying everyone, Jadzia getting replaced (Though I didn't know how it would happen), all the 'ships except Leeta/Bashir, Rom becoming Grand Nagus, Damar turning good, Sisko and Dukat's endings, Odo going to the Founders, Worf becoming an ambassador, and the existance of Section 31.

 

[DevilEyes]

^ I was also spoiled on quite a few things, although not nearly as much as apenpaap was.

(And for once, it is not a joke - you REALLY should not open apenpaap's spoiler tag, he spoils pretty much the entire series right up to the finale!)

 

[RyuRoots]

I had the good luck to have simply never come across much in the way of spoilers when I first watched DS9. I didn't even know about the S7 Dax or anything. Definitely one hell of a ride!

Definitely best to stay that way. The more the show has to surprise you with, the more you'll enjoy it, I think.

 

[TheGodBen]

I guess I was one of the lucky few that watched the show first-run. Sky One aired the show 6 months to a year after it aired in the US so I was still spoiled on a few things such as...

Spoiler: actual spoilers

This is your last chance not to read them. Turn back now.

...the Dominion capturing the station and Jadzia dying. I suppose I was spoiled about the Founders as well, but I was 9 at the time so it didn't really register. Luckily, I wasn't spoiled on most of the bigger twists such as Dukat joining the Dominion or the conflict with the Klingons. I still remember watching that Dominion fleet come through the wormhole expecting a huge battle like the one in WotW, and then Dukat said what he had to say and I sat there thinking "Wow. (Because I was 11 and hadn't learned to say "Holy shit!" yet.) Everything is different now."

 

[Jimmy Bob]

The Storyteller



I loved it.

I've noticed that DS9 works best when it focuses more on the daily life on the station. Quark talking to Morn, Odo coming in to make a snide remark, Sisko trying to find those small moments to share with his son, Bashir... I'm really starting to like Bashir. I'm starting to enjoy his sunny oblivious personality. When he is saying something stupid and has that big innocent smile on his face.

One of my favorite moments were actually the little insights given into Nog's relationship with his father. The Misadventures of Jake, Nog and...and can't remember the name of that girl... was otherwise like something out of a typical family film. But those insights were great.

I just checked out that girl's IMDB - she was 23 when she played that role! Wow... she looked so 14.

I thought it was kinda scary to see how easy it was for Sisko to take advantage of that girl and "guide" her to a more politically comfortable position.

Speaking of which. I always find it interesting how sometimes when a occupying force leaves, the occupied people descend into quarreling tribal-states. People are crazy. I guess it was an analogy with those artificial african nation-states whose borders were created by their colonizers. And that's why they have to kill each other.

Anyway. Bashir's and O'Brien's misadventures on some remote village of Bajor = .

I found it to be a pretty honest portrayal of religion. The guy get's to have free women and food as long as he keeps up the great narrative of social control.

It was just what I read from Popol Vuh, where one tribe discovers fire and other tribes are suffering from cold and hunger and ask for aid, and then that tribe says that they will discuss it with their "gods". And then after discussing they come back and say, that we will give you the secrets of fire, if you start worshipping our "gods" and are willing to let us practice human sacrifice on you. To which they say yes of course. Ah religion, you're always the same.

This episode was great fun.

 

[TheGodBen]

The Storyteller



I loved it.

Oh dear, this doesn't bode well at all. First you enjoyed Move Along Home, and now this? If you like the Ferengi sex-change episode too then there will be no doubt that you have poor taste.

I've noticed that DS9 works best when it focuses more on the daily life on the station. Quark talking to Morn, Odo coming in to make a snide remark, Sisko trying to find those small moments to share with his son, Bashir... I'm really starting to like Bashir. I'm starting to enjoy his sunny oblivious personality. When he is saying something stupid and has that big innocent smile on his face.

It's scenes like these that make me enjoy DS9 over the other shows, just a group of people sitting around having a chat as ordinary people do. The other shows would have moments like this too, but I rarely felt it worked as well as it did on DS9. For example, there's a big event episode in the second half of the show where a large enemy fleet is approaching the station and, while waiting for the impending battle, Odo and Garak have a conversation about how useless they feel. Scenes like that not only helped to keep the show grounded on the characters, but it also ramped up the tension far more effectively than pyrotechnics and sound effects ever could.

Anyway. Bashir's and O'Brien's misadventures on some remote village of Bajor = .

Personally, I never liked this plot, I only enjoy the O'Brien/Bashir moments. This was the first time the two of them really spend time with each other but luckily not the last.