Fear the Walking Dead - Season 5 discussion and spoilers.

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by TREK_GOD_1, Jun 2, 2019.

  1. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2001
    This one sort of felt like filler to me. Not much happened to advance the story and while there are okay character moments, they didn't really contribute anything meaningful. I sure hope Grace's story line is something a bit more than self-sacrifice to prevent a nuclear meltdown, otherwise I don't get why they added her to the main cast for this season. Given how excited and upbeat Dwight is getting about finding Sherry, and John is staying quiet about the letter from her he found, I have a feeling this is going to end in Walker Sherry turning up, messing Dwight up completely. And at this point I will actually be surprised if Annie and her brothers don't eventually end up joining the gang anyway.

    It is kind of amusing how they try to provide details to Dwight's backstory without making any kind of direct reference to Walking Dead's Negan storyline. I mean, I get it, it's for the benefit of those who didn't watch Walking Dead and not confusing them, but it's amusing all the same.
    Not a credible in-universe reason, but I wonder if the storyline reason for Charlie going along is so she can form a bond with Annie or one of her brothers to convince them to join the gang. While that might work as a reason in the writer's room, yeah, in-universe one has to wonder why anyone would think it a good idea to bring a child along in a hot-air balloon flight into an area in danger of facing a nuclear meltdown.

    Actually, going further down storyline related reasons, since Sarah and Wendel aren't in the main cast, this now means everyone in the main cast aside from Daniel are now congregated in the same area. So, I wonder if they may be planning to write Sarah and Wendel out of the show and have Daniel randomly meet up with the gang at some point wherever their mutual adventures next take them? It would mean the whole Logan occupying their factory storyline is abandoned, but then that hasn't really been touched on since the premiere anyway.
     
  2. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2003
    Location:
    RJDiogenes of Boston
    Oh, a giant hot air beer bottle. :rommie: Didn't see that coming. Well, I did see it coming, but I didn't see it coming. You know. Nice going, Strand and Charlie.

    So we finally got the backstory for the kids, which held no real surprises. Survivors find a perfect place and it all comes crashing down, which is par for the Zombie Apocalypse course. We now know explicitly, though, that getting radioactive Zombie blood on you is deadly, although I question if that would necessarily be true. I'll be sure to test it if there's ever a real Zombie Apocalypse. Anyway, both Strand and Charlie, as well as Alicia, may be testing it themselves, since they're all in the midst of the Atomic Horde of the Dead.

    Meanwhile, Karen David is trying to stave off another meltdown at the power plant and still has custody of poor Morgan's stick. Something tells me that there's got to be a twist coming that will somehow allow Karen to live and Morgan to get his stick back. It's just too sad watching him trying to find a substitute stick. He's like Captain America without his shield.

    And thanks to John, Dwight is closer than ever before to finding his wife. But now his wife doesn't want to be found. John has, ironically, decided to keep Dwight's Dear John letter a secret, so he won't give up hope-- but how will they keep searching with no more clues? Well, John used to be a cop, so maybe he'll find some new clues anyway....
     
    TREK_GOD_1 likes this.
  3. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2001
    Going off on a tangent for a moment, but a real zombie apocalypse could never happen. Even if everyone became a reanimated corpse when they died and being bit by one were instantly fatal, there's no way anyone's going to stand around and let a slow moving person get close enough to bite them. And in the early days of a zombie outbreak where there's still the full resources of society at hand, taking care of zombie herds wouldn't be much of an effort. Realistically there'd likely only be a death toll in the hundreds, maybe low thousands before the authorities got a handle on the matter. A definite tragedy to be sure, but not the end of the world.

    Not that I allow that to get in the way of enjoying zombie shows or movies, of course.
     
  4. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2003
    Location:
    RJDiogenes of Boston
    ^^ That would be true if it was just a matter of the recently deceased getting up, like in the original Night of the Living Dead. But in Walking Dead, the Zombie virus was more like the superflu in The Stand. Half the population got sick and died pretty quickly, and became the initial Zombie horde. Those that survived the virus have some immunity, but will still rise up after death and are still susceptible to Zombie bites. Presumably there is an even smaller percentage of people who are immune to the bites, but it hasn't come up yet because of the general high mortality rate (unless that's the real reason that Herschel survived).
     
  5. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 24, 2006
    Location:
    Escaped from Delta Vega
    Yes I thought it was interesting to show how a potential disaster such as a nuclear reactor would be handled when the world fell. I give the series some credit for exploring what the parent series avoided. If anything, it would have been addressed when Darabont was the showrunner, but I'm guessing that creating real world solutions were going to be avoided as much as possible, thanks to Kirkman, much like his running away from a cause of the ZA (and his apparent dislike of TWD's season one finale for even trying to provide any explanation for the zombie virus).

    But that's a dead end plot--Sherry being found as a walker after a long search is Sophia 2.0, In the case of Sophia, audiences cared for her (with limited screen time) through the development/reactions of Carol, who was sympathetic. In Dwight's case, he's searching for hi wife, but we do not know much about the two as people, other than being victimized by Negan. The writers need to build up Dwight's pre-Negan backstory in order for Shery's fate to have an impact, but at present, that's not happening.

    I would like to see characters stick around, instead of being the shock death of the season. I'm not especially fond of Sarah and Wendel, but for the sake of the FTWD group finally presented as competent survivors, the main and supporting characters should reach the end of this series almost as one piece. That's a major change of from the parent series.

    The one flaw in zombie films is how fast the grid would fail and global communications lose functionality. No matter the size of the outbreak, that will not have any effect on satellites, while important security systems are already designed with security and contingency plans to deal with disasters. The WD franchise makes it appear as if everything fell in a couple of weeks, and on a show dealing with reanimated corpses, that's the most unrealistic plot device.
     
    The Wormhole likes this.
  6. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2003
    Location:
    RJDiogenes of Boston
    Or the week. That's one thing I never liked about Walking Dead. The frustration of losing a character that you've grown attached to is not entertaining.
     
    TREK_GOD_1 likes this.
  7. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 24, 2006
    Location:
    Escaped from Delta Vega
    Fear the Walking Dead
    Season 5 / Episode 7 "Still Standing"


    Morgan / Grace: Morgan may be determined, but he's not living in reality to think he (or his group) will be able to convince everyone that their "helping" ways are what's best for them. Of all people, he should know that in the ZA, there's no longer a "right" way to survive (within a moral framework), and his neverending refusal to accept the survival choices of others places him on the edge of going insane. By that, I mean he's invested so much of himself into this new world view, that if this fails in some horrifically spectacular manner, psychologically, in a defeated state, he may not have anywhere to go than back to his "clear" mode to just end everyone/thing.

    Going after Grace? Don't tell me he (and Alicia) will end up contaminated and that's going to be the mid-season cliffhanger--or as the reactor goes critical, and ultimately, they are trapped by the new group while in the danger zone...

    Alicia/The kids: For a kid, Annie was wise--she quickly concluded that Alicia was--essentially--operating on guilt over her past, and that makes Alicia's every decision irrational.

    Her decision to chase after the kids has now endangered her life (splashed by the blood). Despite Annie telling Alicia that she "made up" for whatever she did in the past, that seems like a convenient chapter end--a door for actress Alycia Debnam-Carey to (possibly) leave the show? The problem is that the showrunners are painting her as haunted by violence on Morgan-like levels, and she has not really committed any acts that would justify her guilt.

    Of course, her staying behind as a sacrifice was a tease of sorts, and is supposed to mirror Madison's final episode--some sort of mother/daughter "heroic symmetry," but it did not play that way, and since she will be in the next episode, they cannot explore any Madison-like journey. At least not for now.

    Strand / Charlie: When we last left the fearless...well, sort of foolish duo, they were surrounded by the contaminated walkers they could not touch. At least their danger was short-lived.

    Dwight / June / John Dorie: Awkward and sort of sad that Dwight finally read the letter. Still, still believe Sherry's story is not finished, otherwise, this is a pretty poor way to get a "name" character from TWD on the show.

    Althea: Once again, the show is creating a false depth with her feelings for Isabelle. They did not spend much time together at all, and the majority of their "relationship" was one of captor and captive, yet the showrunners are trying to make entirely false parallels between the longing June had for John (after a year apart) with Althea and Isabelle.

    NOTES:
    The one carryover from the parent series (especially a few seasons ago) that makes no sense at all is having the heroes split up on utterly dangerous missions that are unnecessary. In this case, Alicia chasing after the kids was unnecessary and since they are on the clock to escape before the worst happens with the reactor. who would continue to spread themselves so thin, particularly when transportation is dodgy at best?

    GRADE: C+
     
  8. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2001
    I feel Hopeless Causes would have been a far more appropriate title for this episode, since it basically is everyone clinging to a hopeless cause.
    Grace trying to prevent the meltdown
    Morgan trying to convince Grace to leave.
    The kids trying to defend their tree fort.
    Alicia trying to convince the kids to leave.
    Dwight searching for Sherry.
    Everyone and the damn airplane.
    Granted, some of these do get resolved in a positive manner, but it still felt as though this episode was all about the characters fighting an uphill battle against all the various obstacles in their particular character arcs this season.

    Really not sure what I think about Alicia apparently getting drenched in the blood of a Nuclear Walker. Given all the stuff they've set up regarding the Nuclear Walkers and "Don't let them touch you!" it's pretty clear this can only end one way. Certainly they do seem to be building an end of character arc with Alicia gaining Annie's trust and so on. And while I get that a show like this can't really have "safe characters" who won't ever be killed to maintain drama, it still feels like a mistake to kill Alicia, especially at this stage, given she's the only one from the pilot episode still on the show. On the other hand, those circumstances can lead to one hella dramatic departure. Definitely wait and see where this is going next week.
     
    TREK_GOD_1 likes this.
  9. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 24, 2006
    Location:
    Escaped from Delta Vega
    If all of this wandering around actually leads to something beyond the "we gotta help people" thing, then this directionless arc for the heroes will pay off, and that applies to Dwight as well, since he really has no purpose if he's truly dropped the idea of finding Sherry.

    Unless the masked group has the facilities to treat radiation contamination. That would force the heroes into a necessary relationship--but it has to come with a price...what doesn't in the WD world?).

    Sure, the "danger"/"no safe characters" method of writing can keep a series interesting/unpredictable, only if its not merely another "shock" death, or the world did not know in advance of an actor or actress planning to leave the show. In Alicia's case, it would sort of toss aside the arc of the Clark family, in that one of a once-unprepared group makes it until the series finale, in other words, that their entire family line were not consumed by the ZA. The series needed to give Alicia more than just walking around with survivor's guilt--like reach back to her pilot days and give her that basic hope of forging her own life, Yes, its in the ZA, but being more than a walking state of depression is (obviously) necessary to build a long term, appealing character.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2019
    The Wormhole likes this.
  10. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2001
    Ooh, that is an interesting idea.
     
  11. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 24, 2006
    Location:
    Escaped from Delta Vega
    I would prefer that to another run-up to a character dying and on this series, their memory ends up tossed over the collective shoulders of characters. Gone are the days when the deaths of characters such as TWD's Lori, Shane, the Samuels sisters or Hershel had a lingering effect on survivors. With FTWD, Madison was the main character and she's barely mentioned or referenced at all. I understand that in-universe, time flies by, but losing her should have carried more weight going forward.
     
    The Wormhole likes this.
  12. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2003
    Location:
    RJDiogenes of Boston
    Well, things are getting pretty much down to the wire with the nuclear plant. Meltdown seems imminent. Grace gave it twelve hours, but it might be even less than that. I wonder if Morgan will be able to save his real stick from the holocaust. That was a cool shot of the collapsed nuclear dome, by the way.

    I got a kick out of how Strand and Charlie kept the Walkers at bay with the balloon. Stretchy material may be a better defense than rigid material. Maybe they can find a parachute warehouse at some point. But they managed to survive and get the propellers back to the truck stop, and Al and June got some more fuel from the mesa or whatever that is up there, so it seems like they are close to being ready to fly. Meanwhile, Al spilled the beans about her romantic interlude, although she did leave out the part about her girlfriend being one of the black-clad mystery figures. I wonder if this will come back to bite her, or if we'll ever even see Helicopter Girl again. The Helicopter People must know about the imminent nuclear meltdown-- but then again, if they do, why are they not doing something to prevent it?

    I'm still not sure what to make of Dwight's part in all of this. John finally spilled the beans about the letter, so he and Dwight are headed back to rejoin the group. Dwight still hasn't given up hope of finding his wife, despite her message, but-- even if she's alive, won't she be killed in the upcoming cloud of nuclear death? She can't have gotten that far.

    So once John and Dwight get back, the gang will all be together again, plus Dwight and Grace and a gaggle of kids-- has anyone given any thought to the weight limit on that plane?
     
  13. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2001
    Presumably their base of operations is far enough away that the meltdown won't be a threat to them.
    I doubt it.
     
  14. crookeddy

    crookeddy Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2006
    Last two episodes were new series lows in terms of ratings, so it doesn't look like the new tone of the show has helped stopped the bleeding.
     
  15. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2003
    Location:
    RJDiogenes of Boston
    ^^ That's unfortunate, and strange.

    Yeah, me too.
     
    The Wormhole likes this.
  16. Enterprise is Great

    Enterprise is Great Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Oct 24, 2004
  17. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    Joined:
    May 24, 2006
    Location:
    Escaped from Delta Vega
    ^ So much for the idea of "low" ratings. That said, if the showrunners were smart, they will push this season's conflict toward the heroes leaving the southwest, with Morgan finally leading them to Virginia. Yes, that means merging the shows, so no more FTWD.
     
    The Wormhole and publiusr like this.
  18. crookeddy

    crookeddy Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2006
    Ratings are still on par with other AMC shows, so no shock that it's going to get at least one more season. They will need to make sure it's a good season though, as the ratings will need to stabilize at some point during the season in order to get a season 7.

    I absolutely support merging the shows, but that just does not seem to be the direction they are interested in going in. AMC seems dead set on expanding the Walking Dead universe, not shrinking it.
     
  19. RJDiogenes

    RJDiogenes Idealistic Cynic and Canon Champion Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2003
    Location:
    RJDiogenes of Boston
    I don't want the shows to merge-- on the contrary, I'd rather see what's happening in the ZA in more and different places. That's the best creative direction, anyway, but it may not be the best business decision, given that the ZA may be running out of steam.
     
  20. The Wormhole

    The Wormhole Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2001
    I understand the desire to keep the shows separate from a real world perspective. Unfortunately, in-universe it really would make a lot more sense for Morgan to just toss in the towel and return to Alexandria with his friends. Especially taking into account the preview clip for this week's episode.
    In a flashback set back in the factory just before contact was made with Logan, the gang isn't in the best of moods on account of the fact they haven't been able to find anyone to help. Alicia starts to question if there's even anyone else in the world besides themselves, which Morgan states he knows there is. And of course he does, he left a thriving community. Then Logan contacts them and gets the ball rolling for the storyline up to now.
    Logically speaking, in-universe, when they finish up in the region they are at now, Morgan and gang should just go off back to Alexandria. Since helping out is their whole motivation, best to head to where you know there's people rather than kick around a region where the only person seeking help is a douche who tricked you into giving up your base. If they want to keep the two shows separate, have reaching Alexandria be some long term goal that may or may not be reached, and have gang get sidetracked along the way by things that pop up on their path, including people seeking help which can help Morgan fulfill his noble purpose.
     
    TREK_GOD_1 likes this.