Favorite and Least Favorite Character

[Kilana2]

I´m glad that there was never a meeting of Kai Winn, the Dalai Lama and the Pope.

 

[Orphalesion]

That sounds like the setup to a joke...Kai Winn, Pope Francis and the Dalai Lama walk into a bar...

Or a bad reality show "We put them into a house inhabited by a starved grizzly bear, let's see if any of them notices."
The bear was later admitted into a trauma centre after having a bad run-in with Kai Winn...

 

[Bad Thoughts]

That sounds like the setup to a joke...Kai Winn, Pope Francis and the Dalai Lama walk into a bar...

Or a bad reality show "We put them into a house inhabited by a starved grizzly bear, let's see if any of them notices."
The bear was later admitted into a trauma centre after having a bad run-in with Kai Winn...

THe Kai, the clone of Kahless, and the Surak-possessed body of Archer walk into a bar ...

 

[Kilana2]

What would happen, if the metioned dignitaries are joined by the Grand Nagus?

Maybe the Grand Nagus would ask the Pope: can I pay for absolution? If so, how much?

 

[Orphalesion]

^ I can't remember how the rest of that joke goes, but the punchline is "No offense, madam, but not even the Prophets would tap that!"

Buying absolution? Is that still a thing?

 

[Orphalesion]

^ Okay...calm down... I think you misunderstood me. I was happy that eligion was there at all, but unhappy at how it was handled. I wasn't commenting on your opinion.

And I was not trying to put Ireland down or the Irish people just the talk about folk songs made me think of that song (because I happen to like it). I didn't even notice you were from Ireland. I could have just as easily said "Germans just won't shut up about how sorry they are about WW2" or "Us Australians think we such mellow freedom loving individualists, when our laws and social norms are often more restrictive than those in Europe."
I personally have no national feelings at all in my bones, comes with moving countries a lot as a child (among them both Germany and Ireland), so I sometimes have trouble understanding things like "national pride". I wasn't intending to offend yours.

But as for their Bajorans what makes their one-dimensional obsession with religion any worse than the Vulcan obession with "logic" or Klingon one with "honour"

 

[Bad Thoughts]

A Nation once again,
A Nation once again,
And lreland, long a province, be
A Nation once again!

It is true nearly every group has something they get hung up on and can't seem to be able to shut up about.

To be fair to the Bajorans, the genocidal occupation had just ended, naturally it was still fresh on their minds.
In relation to the religion on DS9. On one hand I'm happy they finally did aknowledge the existence of religion in a Star Trek show.
On the other hand I'm rather unhappy with how clumsily it was utilized a lot of the time, like in that abysmal episode where Kai (back then Vedek) Winn kicked up a shit storm about basically "evolution vs creationism" with every character neatly sorted into either "Richard Dawkins fanboi/girl" or "Subscriber to the Creationist Museum"
You get the feeling the writers have heard about this "ree-lee-djon" thing but never experienced much of it first hand.

again you are not grasping my point, yes they can have their beliefs, stupid religion etc, but when that belief starts to dictate everything it becomes annoying.

how many episodes have we heard kira whine on as if the wormhole and what goes on with it was the sole property of bajor, or how the wormhole aliens mattered more that the security of the alpha quadrant when starfleet decided to mine it.

When your personal beliefs start impacting on people who do not share your beliefs it then becomes a problem.

As for Irish people singing Irish rebel songs in pubs, I think you will find only those wanting to be proper Irish act like that, no full blooded paddy would need to promote his nationalism

The problem is that this is more of a matter of your taste than the actual abnormality of the people depicted in the show. Rebel songs are indeed an important part of Irish folk music. Holocaust often forms an important part of Jewish remembrances and scholarship. Native Americans and the peoples of the First Nations talk about the dispossession of their land. There are countless other examples. It is not unsual, not some sort of bellyaching. It is a normal part of cultural and historical memory

 

[Dobian]

Bajorans always kind of bugged me because aside from the resistance fighters like Kira, they were all portrayed with the same old, simple peasant sheep herders out of the Bible trope.

 

[Brie]

I sometimes don't care much for Sisko actually. He doesn't cause me to skip an eisode centered around him like Jadzia does, but....he's a tiny bit to military for me if that makes sense.
Specifically I don't like those full stops in the middle of sentences he makes when slipping into military/speech mode i.e. "It is easy to be a saint (full stop) in paradise." reminds me a bit of Kirk's odd pauses between words.
And the other thing I don't like about him is his worship of the Starfleet uniform "You betrayed the uniform!" Uh....Mr. Sisko, it's just a stupid garment.
It all just strikes me too much like a modern day general or some such.

There are times when Sisko does go full-on military, that's true. Like the time he chewed Worf out for abandoning his mission and losing the double agent to save Jadzia's life. Well, that's why you don't send a husband and wife on a covert mission, same reason you don't send a mother and son or a dad and daughter. What happens if they get captured? The blame fell on Sisko for that one, not Worf. Expecting someone to deliberately allow their spouse to die so their mission can be a success is unrealistic. Sisko should have taken the hit on that one in his report to Starfleet and not dumped it on Worf.

I'm military and living that life gives you a different outlook on things. Just as you said "it's only a piece of clothing" when you're in the military, that outfit you're wearing isn't "just a piece of clothing" it represents everything we stand for and everything we fight for. That piece of clothing defines who we are and when in ST a character betrayed that uniform by abandoning post or leaving Star Fleet or any other circumstance, they weren't just betraying a pice of clothing, they were beraying what that clothing stands for. Just like our U.S flag represents all of our history of wars and lives lost, it's not just a flag it's our past, our history, our tragedy. It's the same thing for uniforms. That's why the writers did that, as a character so gung ho Star Fleet he said things like that.

And I agree if he was so military he should have known not to send a husband and wife on an away mission together, that's not a good choice and in real life military, also not allowed.

 

[kkt]

Sisko should have taken the hit on that one in his report to Starfleet and not dumped it on Worf.

And it's quite possible that Sisko did take equal responsibility with Worf in his report to Star Fleet. Maybe that's why Sisko didn't make Admiral even when he was coordinating a whole front of the Dominion War.

 

[Brie]

Agreed

 

[Cyke101]

Until the last sub-arc of the show, I really thought Kai Winn was one of the best written villains in all of Trek, and so naturally I tried to imagine her going up against other captains. I imagine Picard would, at best, stalemate her because of her sheer blind stubbornness, and Kirk would just give up debating her because he'd rather do something more productive.

On to the topic...

Favorites: Garak and O'Brien. I also have a soft spot for Rom.

Least Favorite: it's probably going to be some one shot character, most likely. Even that weaselly Cardassian at the end of the war who tried to talk his way out of execution was the right balance of snively but not annoying. However, I reserve the right to nominate a couple of Kira's Bajoran love interests -- they were just so boring and unengaging overall, threatening to bring down the otherwise excellent Kira down a couple notches if she stayed with either of them.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Sisko should have taken the hit on that one in his report to Starfleet and not dumped it on Worf.

And it's quite possible that Sisko did take equal responsibility with Worf in his report to Star Fleet. Maybe that's why Sisko didn't make Admiral even when he was coordinating a whole front of the Dominion War.

It was actually Kira who assigned them, and it may not necessarily been clear what was entailed. Lasaran didn't indicate directly that he wanted to be extracted immediately until Worf and DAx were already in the Badlands. Indeed, Lasaran was unwilling to wait until a proper extraction mission could be organized--he gave Jadzia and Worf 15 minutes to agree.

I sometimes don't care much for Sisko actually. He doesn't cause me to skip an eisode centered around him like Jadzia does, but....he's a tiny bit to military for me if that makes sense.
Specifically I don't like those full stops in the middle of sentences he makes when slipping into military/speech mode i.e. "It is easy to be a saint (full stop) in paradise." reminds me a bit of Kirk's odd pauses between words.
And the other thing I don't like about him is his worship of the Starfleet uniform "You betrayed the uniform!" Uh....Mr. Sisko, it's just a stupid garment.
It all just strikes me too much like a modern day general or some such.

There are times when Sisko does go full-on military, that's true. Like the time he chewed Worf out for abandoning his mission and losing the double agent to save Jadzia's life. Well, that's why you don't send a husband and wife on a covert mission, same reason you don't send a mother and son or a dad and daughter. What happens if they get captured? The blame fell on Sisko for that one, not Worf. Expecting someone to deliberately allow their spouse to die so their mission can be a success is unrealistic. Sisko should have taken the hit on that one in his report to Starfleet and not dumped it on Worf.

I'm military and living that life gives you a different outlook on things. Just as you said "it's only a piece of clothing" when you're in the military, that outfit you're wearing isn't "just a piece of clothing" it represents everything we stand for and everything we fight for. That piece of clothing defines who we are and when in ST a character betrayed that uniform by abandoning post or leaving Star Fleet or any other circumstance, they weren't just betraying a pice of clothing, they were beraying what that clothing stands for. Just like our U.S flag represents all of our history of wars and lives lost, it's not just a flag it's our past, our history, our tragedy. It's the same thing for uniforms. That's why the writers did that, as a character so gung ho Star Fleet he said things like that.

And I agree if he was so military he should have known not to send a husband and wife on an away mission together, that's not a good choice and in real life military, also not allowed.

It's unfortunate that the symbology of the uniform does ring through after TNG was hammered for Picard's "costume" comment in Encounter at Farpoint.

 

[maneth]

Favorite character: This one's really difficult because most of them are really great. For me it's a tie between Kira (easily the best developed female character in any Trek show), Gul Dukat and Garak. All three characters were superbly written IMO.
Least favorite character: Keiko O'Brien. She's better on DS9 than she was on TNG, but still comes across as whiny most of the time.
Character I love to hate: Kai Winn. Superbly played by probably the best actress to have been involved in Trek (Patrick Stewart has that honor for the men), but Winn was pure evil.

 

[JirinPanthosa]

I'm not sure I'd describe Winn as 'Pure evil'. So much as 'Absolutely selfish'.

 

[Brie]

But the thing is those uniforms aren't JUST costumes. The writers are trying to portray how actual military would act, I being military felt more connected to Sisko than any other captain because he was one of the only captains who actually acted military.

 

[Cyke101]

But the thing is those uniforms aren't JUST costumes. The writers are trying to portray how actual military would act, I being military felt more connected to Sisko than any other captain because he was one of the only captains who actually acted military.

I'm in the camp that firmly believes that Starfleet is military, but it could be that the concept of military has changed by the time of Star Trek. Indeed, we see them do more than standard combat, like exploration, science experimentation, observation, and humanitarian aid. And while that's certainly true of today's military, when one actually says the word military today, the first thing that comes to mind is combat and defense. It could be that in the Federation, military has taken on a broader meaning.

But it could also be that Sisko acts more military because he's the only captain we've seen in a present war setting. The other captains may have fought in wars, but that was part of their backstory with only occasional references to that experience.

 

[Kirby]

Favorite Character: I still like O'Brien. A working man who gets things done.

Least Favorite Character: Ezri Dax - I just don't think they needed to shoe-horn this character in during the final season as a regular character. I think her visiting the station as part of a B story during a couple of episodes would have been fine. They had a lot of characters and story lines to wrap up, and they wasted a couple of episodes featuring her to develop the character. The Prodigal Daughter is one of my least favorite DS9 episodes.

 

[Kilana2]

Least Favorite Character: Ezri Dax

The Prodigal Daughter is one of my least favorite DS9 episodes.

Nothing against Ezri, I really like her, but I can´t stand her mother. No surprise, that Ezri keeps staying away from home.

 

[Dobian]

I like Ezri. I can understand the argument that she should only have been featured in a couple of episodes to answer the question, "what happened to the Dax symbiont?".

Jake vs. Nog. It started out as the cool kid with his dorky friend. but as is often true in real life, the cool kid turned out to be bland and boring while the dorky sidekick turned out to be something special. Jake as a character was always "meh", and the actor so-so. But Nog turned out so good I looked forward to any episode he was in, he was a kick.