Farscape or Babylon 5?

[kirk55555]

Watch this clip and this clip, and then you can see why people love WGFA so much. IMO if you don't like these clips then you should just stop watch Farscape right now.

I was not a fan of that first clip. I don't like seeing weird stuff like that, where the characters are used in a weird dream/hallucination scenes acting in ways that they never would normally, atleast not in more serious shows. Scrubs did stuff like that very well, but its a much different show than Farscape. In Farscape, it just ticks me off. Although, to be fair, Rygel was pretty funny, but the first 50 seconds with just Aeryn, Jar jar and Zhaan was painful.

That second clip was just stupid to be stupid. It was about as funny as a stick in the eye. That just reinforces my opinion on the episode.I don't like bat s@$& crazy "humor" like that, stuff without context. Why is Crais wearing women's shoes while in a cop uniform funny? Why is he in a cop uniform in the first place? I need context with humor, even the wackiest Scrubs daydreams had some kind of context, or made some kind of sense. Having watched over a season and a half of farscape, stuff like that has actually never happened before (even Cracker's Don't matter made some kind of sense), so I don't think it represents the series at all. The show has made me laugh, but I need more than uncomfortable, unfunny sexual humor and crais in high heels when it comes to comedy.

Now, for the episode I watched earlier today.

Liars, Guns and Money Part 1 (Farscape) - I liked this episode (which means people can stop telling me to quit the series, right ). It had some flaws, but overall was enjoyable. It does make me wonder, yet again, what Scorpius's motivation is. He hasn't been given any real reason why he's doing all these weird things to John, why he's taking so much time and using so many resources to capture him. Why would he put a chip in John's head? Is this all because John resisted his stupid chair the first time he was captured? His actions just make no sense at all, atleast Crais had a reason to hunt John, even if it was kind of stupid. Scorpius just seems to have nothing better to do than to chase John. Besides that, this was a solid episode, and I think this will be a good group of episodes.

 

[Lindley]

It does make me wonder, yet again, what Scorpius's motivation is. He hasn't been given any real reason why he's doing all these weird things to John, why he's taking so much time and using so many resources to capture him. Why would he put a chip in John's head? Is this all because John resisted his stupid chair the first time he was captured? His actions just make no sense at all, atleast Crais had a reason to hunt John, even if it was kind of stupid. Scorpius just seems to have nothing better to do than to chase John. Besides that, this was a solid episode, and I think this will be a good group of episodes.

You would know the answers to those questions, at least to a degree, if you hadn't chosen to skip key episodes.

 

[kirk55555]

Well, a little confusion is worth skipping the Princess trilogy (I'm assuming thats what you're talking about, I don't think the other episodes I skipped even had scorpius). I'm sure it will be mentioned eventually. I tried looking on wikipedia and googling "why does Scorpius want to capture John Crichton?" and got no info, but its not a huge deal. His motivation is bound to come up again eventually.

 

[Lindley]

Again, you're wrong. You should simply accept that we know what we are talking about when we say which episodes are important and which are not.

 

[kirk55555]

Again, you're wrong. You should simply accept that we know what we are talking about when we say which episodes are important and which are not.

I'm wrong about what? That Scorpius's motivation was told in the Princess Trilogy? That his motivation will be brought up again? Of the episodes I've skipped, his motivation could probably only have been talked about in the Princess trilogy or WGFA (unless I really misjudged Taking the stone or beware of dog). Reguadless of what episode it was discussed in, I'm sure it will be brought up again.

I've never said that the people who have posted in this thread don't know what they're talking about. I never said the Princess trilogy couldn't be important, just that I could get the info elsewhere without suffering through the episodes. For all I know WGFA may be important (although I seriously doubt it). I can't really argue an episodes importance, especially not with people who have seen the whole series. I can say whether I liked an episode or not, and thats not really debateable because its my opinion. That doesn't mean others can't like the episodes, or that they can't be important. I don't believe that there is any episode that can't be skipped if you read a summary of what happened, and I'm not lost when it comes to the overall plot at all, I'm just not clear on Scorpius's motivation, and its not that important, he's the bad guy, thats all the motivation he needs, really.

 

[Professor Zoom]

Farscape's second season has been a bit rough, but its picking up now,

How can you say that when you haven't WATCHED... oh, never mind....

I just can't do this thread anymore.

 

[Lindley]

You have chosen to skip some of the strongest and best storytelling this season already. In so doing, you missed several key introductions and at least one key reveal. Is it survivable? Sure. Any series that didn't build in information-redundancy for those who miss an episode wouldn't last very long. But you aren't getting the information the way the creators intended you to get it.

Let me warn you: from this point forward, there will be few episodes without important arc elements. Those elements may not be the focus of the episode or even mentioned in a two-sentence synopsis, but they will be there. If you skip an episode, you will miss things, sometimes very important things. Because Farscape is pretty much done with the reset button. Things won't be put back neatly on the shelf at the end of every episode anymore. That isn't how Farscape works, and it's not how B5 works either for that matter once you get past season 1. Most stories affects the broader tapestry in some way.

You've already missed things. Try not to miss any more.

 

[HighteeHeller]

Farscape's second season has been a bit rough, but its picking up now,

How can you say that when you haven't WATCHED... oh, never mind....

I just can't do this thread anymore.

Lol.

 

[Jan]

I don't like seeing weird stuff like that, where the characters are used in a weird dream/hallucination scenes acting in ways that they never would normally, atleast not in more serious shows.

Granted, I've only just started watching Farscape (due in large part to this thread) but isn't one of the key aspects of Farscape that it never, ever takes itself too seriously? B5 - yeah that's one *serious* show. But from what little I've seen of Farscape, it seems like they weren't afraid to play around and sometimes look at things kind of sideways.

Of course, I could be completely wrong, too.

Jan

 

[Sindatur]

I don't like seeing weird stuff like that, where the characters are used in a weird dream/hallucination scenes acting in ways that they never would normally, atleast not in more serious shows.

Granted, I've only just started watching Farscape (due in large part to this thread) but isn't one of the key aspects of Farscape that it never, ever takes itself too seriously? B5 - yeah that's one *serious* show. But from what little I've seen of Farscape, it seems like they weren't afraid to play around and sometimes look at things kind of sideways.

Of course, I could be completely wrong, too.

Jan

Yes, the shows handles serious stuff, but, you are absolutely right that the show doesn't take itself too seriously in a stuffy way, as Babylon 5 does, and yes, there was a fair amount of Goofy through the years. But, never make the mistake of assuming there isn't serious stuffed tucked away inside the goofy stuff, and that all the goofy stuff can be just ignored. Some of the biggest stuff came out from behind something goofy.

 

[JD]

^Exactly, and that is part of why I love Farscape so much. On the surface a lot of it is goofy and crazy, but once you really dug beneath those elements there was quite a bit of quality serious storytelling in there. And really, if you skip out on all of the crazy weirdness you're kind of missing half of what makes Farscape so great. Honesty, the two scenes I posted are the reason why I love Farscape so much. They are goofy, and weird and kinda crazy, but they are part of a bigger whole that is a really good story.

 

[Reverend]

Granted, I've only just started watching Farscape (due in large part to this thread) but isn't one of the key aspects of Farscape that it never, ever takes itself too seriously? B5 - yeah that's one *serious* show. But from what little I've seen of Farscape, it seems like they weren't afraid to play around and sometimes look at things kind of sideways.

Of course, I could be completely wrong, too.

Jan

No, you're correct, Farscape is a totally different animal than most sci-fi shows (with the possible exception of Lexx) in that's it's often very tongue-in-cheek and sometimes as mad as a sack full of orangutans. Indeed, it was such a crazy show that it was downright contagious. That doesn't mean it couldn't do serious drama, because it did and very well at times.

The difference is really in the general tone and vocabulary of the show. To put it in musical terms; if B5 is an opera, then Farscape is a rock album...with a few punk tracks on the b-side.

P.S. If you start skipping episodes too, I shall disown you. I sat though all of Jeremiah based on your recommendation, even the bit with the cross dresser and the elephant damnit!

 

[Jan]

P.S. If you start skipping episodes too, I shall disown you. I sat though all of Jeremiah based on your recommendation, even the bit with the cross dresser and the elephant damnit!

Okay...fine! But don't try to tell me that the second season wasn't worth every cross dressed, mushroom intoxicated minute.

And I've only barely begun and may do a B5 re-watch for now. First season, anyway.

Jan

 

[kirk55555]

Farscape's second season has been a bit rough, but its picking up now,

How can you say that when you haven't WATCHED... oh, never mind....

I just can't do this thread anymore.

Of season 2, I completely skipped Taking the Stone, the Princess Trilogy, Beware of Dog, Won't get Fooled Again and A Clockwork Nebari. If you count Cracker's Dont Matter (where I didn't skip but heavily fast forwarded) thats 7 episodes out of 22. Thats more than I would prefer, and more than season 1, but I will still end up watching about 2/3 of the season.

When I was talking about farscape being serious and not liking the dreamlike stuff, I think I need to clarify. I'm ok with some goofy stuff, and humor. But, it needs to actually be a story, with context. Those clips from Won't get Fooled Again seemed to be from some mediocre episode of scrubs. Seeing hallucination stuff like that is just annoying. Not neccessarily because its goofy, but because it just doesn't fit. Its like if an episode of Scrubs (I know I keep mentioning Scrubs, but its the best example I can think of) was just 22 minutes of JD's daydreams, with nothing actually happening. Thats what my problem with those clips were (that and the fact that they weren't very funny), they weren't a story. They were unfunny skits, like the stuff you'd see from Saturday Night Live, but even less humorous. When I said Farscape was serious, I didn't mean in the way that B5 or DS9 is serious. I just meant that the stories are usually stories, not a bunch of random scenes that have nothing to do with anything.

Now, for the episode I just watched:

Liars, Guns and Money Part 2 (Farscape) - Another good episode. Scorpius getting D'Argo's son was something I assumed was going to happen, why else would he be in the story. I was surprised to see that the spiders from the Lost in Space movie are alive and well. I wonder if spider Dr. Smith will make an appearance I'm starting to wonder if Stark is just more trouble than he's worth, he always seems to get them into trouble, and not really help at all. Kind of like Chiana, but he's not super annoying like her. Seeing what happened to Rygel's torturer was creepy. At first it was kind of funny that Rygel got the other pirate to betray the guy. It was less funny after seeing them bring the head back to Moya Setting the fire off in Moya was intense, and the special effects of seeing it from outside the ship was pretty cool. It was a bit lame to have John just give himself to Scorpius, but now I know that scorpius wants him for his knowledge of wormholes, which I probably should have guessed, but whatever. I do wonder why he would want a wormhole, but I'm sure they'll bring that up. Overall, I enjoyed this episode.

 

[Lindley]

Those clips from Won't get Fooled Again seemed to be from some mediocre episode of scrubs. Seeing hallucination stuff like that is just annoying. Not neccessarily because its goofy, but because it just doesn't fit. Its like if an episode of Scrubs (I know I keep mentioning Scrubs, but its the best example I can think of) was just 22 minutes of JD's daydreams, with nothing actually happening. Thats what my problem with those clips were (that and the fact that they weren't very funny), they weren't a story. They were unfunny skits, like the stuff you'd see from Saturday Night Live, but even less humorous. When I said Farscape was serious, I didn't mean in the way that B5 or DS9 is serious. I just meant that the stories are usually stories, not a bunch of random scenes that have nothing to do with anything.

WGFA does tell a story. It's just that the story happens to be about mental torture, that's all. In fact, one review I read calls it the most pivotal episode of the entire second season.

Those crazy scenes posted earlier are from the portion of the episode after its cohesion has begun to degrade but prior to when it reaches a point of outright cruelty. It's a progression which works very well in context but can leave one cold in isolation.

 

[DS9Continuing]

Fly-by with a tangent because I have recently been having my own rewatch.

This will mean nothing to kirk55555 (and not just because he didn't watch the episode, I'm not getting into that argument), but should be interesting for long-time fans.

"Won't Get Fooled Again." John is in the office, trying his best to shoot everyone but the bullets have no effect. He goes along the line of the shelf, looking at all the pictures in their frames. Scorpius with his golden record, D'Argo riding a space shuttle...

Oh and what's that? is that a Bird of Paradise flower right next to the pictures? I believe it is.



EDIT to add: Here's the screencap. http://www.farscapecaps.com/215/images/215_cap321.jpg

.

 

[kirk55555]

Liars, Guns and Money Part 3 (Farscape) - A good ending to this three part story. It had good action, and interesting moments. It was a bit annoying when it teased Jar Jar getting shot. I knew she wasn't the one who got shot (someone already mentioned in this thread that she doesn't die in the series), but I wish the show wouldn't keep teasing something so awesome and then not follow through Hopefully John gets that chip out of his head soon. While I wouldn't say this trilogy has been my favorite episodes, they were pretty good, and I enjoyed them.

 

[kirk55555]

Die Me, Dichotomy (Farscape) - This was an ok episode. I liked several parts of it, but I am sick of crazy John, and I seriously can't wait for the chip to be removed and this particular sub plot to be over with. I also know that there is no way Aeryn is really dead, I wish that the show hadn't decided to waste time pretending she is actually gone. One thing that is starting to grow on me is Crais. He's become a pretty entertaining character, and I actually think he cared that Aeryn "died". The storyline with him and Talyn is getting interesting. Season 3 looks cool (just based off some episode synopsis), and I'm betting it will be better than season 2.

 

[Lindley]

Season 3 is better in most respects. Some say it's the show's best year.

 

[Reverend]

I am sick of crazy John, and I seriously can't wait for the chip to be removed and this particular sub plot to be over with.

....uh, yeah. Good luck with that!