Dune Part 2 2023 (24, 25, 26...)

[Asbo Zaprudder]

That could be true. I did read the six BH&KJA novels (Prelude and Legends) including The Battle of Corrin, so my compartmentalisation of what is FH's work and what is not might well have been corrupted. I didn't read any more of their novels as it became obvious that the stories being related probably bore no relation to what FH intended.

 

[wayoung]

Yeah sometimes stuff gets confused. Irrelevant anyway, Villeneuve will do what he wants with the character, Mentat or no.

 

[FPAlpha]

Tim Blake Nelson has been announced as playing an unknown character in the movie. He'd be an interesting Fenring. Or Korba.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/movies/movie-news/dune-part-2-casts-time-blake-nelson-1235292182/

My money is on Fenring, he has that haggard, hawkish look to him and with the right clothes and makeup would make a good Fenring.

I doubt he'd play a Fremen, especially Korba. I think we might have already seen him during the Paul/Jamis fight, possibly the one dark skinned actor who speaks out in surprise when Paul demands Jamis to yield.

Still can't wait, it's my most anticipated movie of the year.

 

[Mage]

It still bugs me that basically no adaption so far has gone into the fact that Paul was unknowingly receiving the beginnings of Mentat training.

 

[FPAlpha]

It still bugs me that basically no adaption so far has gone into the fact that Paul was unknowingly receiving the beginnings of Mentat training.

Is it story relevant though? One could assume being their heir of House Atreides he receives first class education, Mentat training is just a more advanced form of mental training in a specific direction but it doesn't add a key plot point to the story.

 

[Mage]

Is it story relevant though? One could assume being their heir of House Atreides he receives first class education, Mentat training is just a more advanced form of mental training in a specific direction but it doesn't add a key plot point to the story.

Fair point. But I always found that it was one of the reasons Paul was able to manage his visions. His ability to have reason and logically compile input helped him sort through his prescient sight. That was always my take on it.

 

[FPAlpha]

Fair point. But I always found that it was one of the reasons Paul was able to manage his visions. His ability to have reason and logically compile input helped him sort through his prescient sight. That was always my take on it.

I understand and with the book it's no problem to include this and make it a plot point as he had the pages and time to explore it. I am more curious if Villeneuve will include Other Memory in the second part as that is a huge plot point in the books and the main reason why the BG even started the Kwisatz Haderach program to begin with.

The Lynch movie tried and the first part of the Villeneuve movie has laid some groundwork but i wonder how that will happen both visually and from a story point.

 

[Mage]

I understand and with the book it's no problem to include this and make it a plot point as he had the pages and time to explore it. I am more curious if Villeneuve will include Other Memory in the second part as that is a huge plot point in the books and the main reason why the BG even started the Kwisatz Haderach program to begin with.

The Lynch movie tried and the first part of the Villeneuve movie has laid some groundwork but i wonder how that will happen both visually and from a story point.

The Other Memory really is a must if you ask me.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

Other memory - some key scenes from the history of the Dune universe with morphing between key ancestral characters and Paul or Alia perhaps. More likely, Duke Leto will return in Paul's memory to advise him - much like the ghost of Hamlet's father. Some background history of

Spoiler: Another main character

Baron Harkonnen

could appear in Alia's memory, which would set up Dune Messiah should that ever get made.

 

[wayoung]

Other memory has to be included, it's integral to the series.

Paul being a Mentat - well, it is important to his character, but it's understandable that that is one element that gets cut. Ultimately, that's something that can be shifted into other aspects of his personality, skills, and abilities.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

Paul had training from Thufir Hawat in mental skills as he did from Gurney Halleck and Duncan Idaho in fighting skills and his mother in Bene Gesserit skills, but he was never near being a full-on mentat. Like a medieval prince, perhaps fighting skills seem to have been considered the highest priority.

 

[wayoung]

Paul had training from Thufir Hawat in mental skills as he did from Gurney Halleck and Duncan Idaho in fighting skills and his mother in Bene Gesserit skills, but he was never near being a full-on mentat. Like a medieval prince, perhaps fighting skills seem to have been considered the highest priority.

He didn't complete the schooling no, but he advanced far enough that apparently when his other abilities clicked in he became a full fledged Mentat. Hence his often being called a Mentat, his making Mentat projections, and one of his common titles being "The Mentat Emperor".

How that works, who knows, hand wavy kwisatz haderach spice eugenics program goobly gook.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

All without having to stain his lips with Sapho. I don't think he took the exams though.

 

[Mage]

Paul had training from Thufir Hawat in mental skills as he did from Gurney Halleck and Duncan Idaho in fighting skills and his mother in Bene Gesserit skills, but he was never near being a full-on mentat. Like a medieval prince, perhaps fighting skills seem to have been considered the highest priority.

All without having to stain his lips with Sapho. I don't think he took the exams though.

Paul never finished Mentat training, obviously. But in the novels, his early training in Mentat capabilities without him being aware of that training, was integral in him being able to use logic and reason to seperate his prescient power from what was actually happening and made him capable of seeing both as absolute truths depending on what would happen next.

Ofcourse he never took the exam. The novel literally states one can only start the Mentat training without being aware and than make a conscious choice to follow up on it.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

It was an implied joke about academic pomposity towards those who are self-taught. Never mind...

I never felt the mentat-training aspect was that important in the books, although it would have helped Paul deal with all the weird stuff that was happening to him and his need to consider dispassionately what morally questionable actions were necessary to ensure the long-term survival of humanity. I can't remember if Paul in the book ever emotionally snapped at his mother about creating him as a monster. It makes sense to inform the viewers of the movie that it is not just some white saviour trope. Paul didn't succeed in his endeavour, despite his abilities. Leto II's solution was to become a god and eventually let himself be sacrificed.

 

[wayoung]

I got the joke

He did have the blow up at her, and afterwards had the "My mother is my enemy" belief which I hope they keep in the movie.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

When Paul gained access to other memories, he had an exhaustive knowledge of the Bene Gesserit breeding program from both male and female aspects of its implementation. He should have realised that Jessica was just as manipulated as he was. Perhaps her parentage was more the problem given what happened to Leto. I don't recall the details, however. Probably time for me to reread the first four books - I'll pass on Heretics and Chapterhouse.

 

[Mage]

It was an implied joke about academic pomposity towards those who are self-taught. Never mind...

Ah, sorry. I didn't get it. My bad.

 

[Reverend]

It was an implied joke about academic pomposity towards those who are self-taught. Never mind...

I never felt the mentat-training aspect was that important in the books, although it would have helped Paul deal with all the weird stuff that was happening to him and his need to consider dispassionately what morally questionable actions were necessary to ensure the long-term survival of humanity. I can't remember if Paul in the book ever emotionally snapped at his mother about creating him as a monster. It makes sense to inform the viewers of the movie that it is not just some white saviour trope. Paul didn't succeed in his endeavour, despite his abilities. Leto II's solution was to become a god and eventually let himself be sacrificed.

I think the real value in his mentat training was in raw data processing abilities. Being able to actually *see* the 4th dimension all at once would be an effectively infinite amount of information. Being a mentat is probably what allowed him to parse it into usable data for analysis. Anyone else would have been driven insane, or simply lost themselves in the visions, unable to tell one possible reality from another.

 

[wayoung]

HBO revamping The Sisterhood, entire project is on hiatus with recasting and behind the scenes changes, including the departure of yet another showrunner:

https://deadline.com/2023/02/dune-t...ley-henderson-exit-hbo-max-series-1235273486/