DS9 Versus: A viewing experient

[Pemmer Harge]

Well, I liked The Search, Part II!

Homefront is pretty good. Nice to have an episode set on Earth. As beginnings to two-parters go I don't think it's as exciting as Improbable Cause or Past Tense, but it's a pretty strong episode.

 

[Sykonee]

Week 15: (Ending 01.08.96)
DS9 - Paradise Lost (Airdate 01.08.96)

Yet another in the fine Trek tradition of "the second part isn't nearly as good as the first". Still, for an episode that takes a completely unexpected-but-interesting turn, this is effectively handled. Yeah, we've all read the stories about how this wasn't exactly what the producers had in mind when they first conceived of a 'coup within the Federation' way back in S3, but taken as-is without that hindsight-knowledge, Paradise Lost manages to make do. It's more of a character story around Sisko and Leyton, and Leyton making the realization that his patriotism has gotten out of hand. Additionally, Leyton probably makes for the most sympathetic 'evil Admiral' we've seen since... um, hmm, maybe ever. We can believe his concerns over the protection of Earth because we can relate to those circumstances (er, especially so in a post-9/11 world).

DS9 takes a break now while VOY gets a little solo time. Does the show have something up its sleeve of the same level as this two-parter?

Weekly Winner
DS9

Next:
VOY - Prototype

 

[Pemmer Harge]

Yet another in the fine Trek tradition of "the second part isn't nearly as good as the first".

I disagree with this. Personally I thought Paradise Lost was better than Homefront. This tradition probably does exist, but it's not that prominent in DS9 - I didn't notice any difference in quality between the two halves of Past Tense and I liked The Die is Cast better than Improbable Cause. Even where the second part was less good (The Search, In Purgatory's Shadow/By Inferno's Light), I'd say DS9 usually maintains a good standard in these episodes.

Anyway, I have mixed feelings about this two-parter. It's good, but it felt a bit lacking in "oomph" compared to some of DS9's event episodes and while it's an interesting part of the Dominion plotline, it didn't seem to really advance it like Improbable Cause/The Die is Cast or The Adversary did. I did like the conspiracy stuff and I loved the way Sisko handled that cadet. And General Ha... erm... Admiral Leyton was a memorable villain.

 

[Sykonee]

I disagree with this. Personally I thought Paradise Lost was better than Homefront. This tradition probably does exist, but it's not that prominent in DS9 - I didn't notice any difference in quality between the two halves of Past Tense and I liked The Die is Cast better than Improbable Cause. Even where the second part was less good (The Search, In Purgatory's Shadow/By Inferno's Light), I'd say DS9 usually maintains a good standard in these episodes.

Yeah, I'll agree that DS9's second-parters weren't that bad, but typically Trek was much better at the set-up, and that trend was mostly maintained throughout the franchise's run.

However, if they had more than just a two-parter, that's when things would get much better.

 

[mattyhugh]

Yet another in the fine Trek tradition of "the second part isn't nearly as good as the first".

And General Ha... erm... Admiral Leyton was a memorable villain.

 

[Sykonee]

Week 16: (Ending 01.15.96)
VOY - Prototype (Airdate 01.15.95)

Flux capacitator? You're... kidding. Not bad enough you're coming up with your own technobabble, but now you're stealing from other shows? Mind, it's not like Trek hasn't done that before, positronic brains and all.

Okay, ribs aside, this was... eh. The First-Person view in the teaser was a pretty cool set-up, and the twist at the end has decent enough, but Prototype was just average at best. Far too exposition heavy for even Biggs-Dawson's enthusiasm can't quite lift, and the space battle at the end wasn't much to get fussed over. Even the rather skimpy one in Paradise Lost was better handled; mind, that one did have more at stake.

Meh. Not the greatest way to come back from a break, especially with DS9 having just done some Major Eventing the two weeks prior. Looks like there'll be something more significant next week though. Will it be enough to get some momentum going?

Weekly Winner
VOY

Next:
VOY - Alliances

 

[Pemmer Harge]

I quite like Prototype. B'Elanna's a pretty decent character to build an episode around and the robots were quite cool in a retro sort of way - they seem like the sort of thing you'd see in Doctor Who.

Looks like there'll be something more significant next week though. Will it be enough to get some momentum going?

Ooh, considering what comes after Alliances, that's just cruel!

 

[Kegg]

I quite like Prototype. B'Elanna's a pretty decent character to build an episode around and the robots were quite cool in a retro sort of way

I agree, and the robot designs have a decidedly 30-40s pulp sort of feel. Supposedly Frakes (as episode director) was pretty unhappy with them, but I thought they were neat.

 

[Sykonee]

It felt like they were paying homage to a lot of sci-fi stuff in this episode, now that I think about it. Robots wiping out their masters, flux capacitors, positronic brains.

Even Janeway's line of "We've stumbled into a robotic war!" had me instantly humming the Transformers theme song.

 

[Sykonee]

Week 17: (Ending 01.22.96)
VOY - Alliances (Airdate 01.22.96)

Poor VOY. The show comes up with a solid episode that could have it standing toe-to-toe with many of DS9's and B5's, but does so in a solo week. It could have been an interesting battle if the other two showed up. Ah well.

Still, it's great to see VOY do a proper Event Episode. This one's got it all! Action, backstory, tough looks at Federation principles, intrigue, twists! My only complaint is Janeway's final speech -boy, but did that ever come across sanctimoniously. Plus, there almost seems to be too much going on here -Alliances probably could have been stretched over a two-parter, but I guess the show-runners had other episodes they wanted to air around this time. If they're as good as this one, I'm looking forward to it! ()

Weekly Winner:
VOY

Next:
DS9 - Crossfire
VOY - Threshold

 

[Pemmer Harge]

Yeah, I like Alliances too. This was actually quite impressive for Voyager and it's always good to see Seska. I do wish they'd done more with the ideas in this episode, though. OK, it's a bit Battlestar Galactica, but it was interesting. It's my first time seeing these early seasons since they originally aired in Britain and although they do have a certain "annoyance factor" that's less prominent in the later seasons I do like how they took greater advantage of the premise at this stage, e.g. asking the question how Voyager should proceed in the Delta Quadrant. I'm not sure they got the answer correct, but still.

 

[Seven of Five]

This was one of the more solid episodes from Voyager's second season. I appreciate that an effort was made to at least pretend that the Voyager crew were going to be a little less 'Federation' in their approach to getting home for an episode. I think the answer at the end was naive though, and ultimately quite harmful.

Having Federation rules and morals being the absolute right thing to do set the show on its slow but steady path of status quo, with risk being a very isolated element.

 

[Kegg]

I sort of hate "Alliances", to break the surprising love it gets here. And this is, yes, because of the final speech, which isn't just a weak way to end the episode - the negates the whole point of the episode. At the start, they're in a situation where the reality is grim and desperate and they need to forge an alliance out of necessity. They don't have a choice.

By the end, they choose not to, and, of course, that's it. When Janeway says their principles as the best allies they can have, she's deadly serious and also right - they literally wish away their problems. It's a cop-out of staggering proportions.

 

[Pemmer Harge]

I sort of hate "Alliances", to break the surprising love it gets here. And this is, yes, because of the final speech, which isn't just a weak way to end the episode - the negates the whole point of the episode. At the start, they're in a situation where the reality is grim and desperate and they need to forge an alliance out of necessity. They don't have a choice.

By the end, they choose not to, and, of course, that's it. When Janeway says their principles as the best allies they can have, she's deadly serious and also right - they literally wish away their problems. It's a cop-out of staggering proportions.

You know, I pretty much agree with this. The thing is, I'm just not that keen on Voyager so I probably don't expect that much from it. If Alliances had been an episode of Babylon 5 or Deep Space Nine I'd be a lot more critical. However, compared to something like Cathexis, Elogium or what Sykonee's going to review next, I think this one is pretty decent.

 

[TheGodBen]

I sort of hate "Alliances", to break the surprising love it gets here. And this is, yes, because of the final speech, which isn't just a weak way to end the episode - the negates the whole point of the episode. At the start, they're in a situation where the reality is grim and desperate and they need to forge an alliance out of necessity. They don't have a choice.

By the end, they choose not to, and, of course, that's it. When Janeway says their principles as the best allies they can have, she's deadly serious and also right - they literally wish away their problems. It's a cop-out of staggering proportions.

Not only that, but her speech doesn't even make sense given what happened in the episode. She never abandoned her principles, she stuck by them and tried to forge a grand alliance between the Trabe and Kazon factions, and that nearly got a whole bunch of people killed. If she had swallowed her principles, and her pride, and sided with one of the Kazon factions she wouldn't have created the big mess that they had to cut and run from.

And was the fact that they were on the run and rationing resources mentioned the following week? Well the following week probably never happened, but it wasn't mentioned the week after that either.

 

[Kai Winn]

as bad as treshold is, vs crossfire, it might even win the week.

 

[Sykonee]

I sort of hate "Alliances", to break the surprising love it gets here. And this is, yes, because of the final speech, which isn't just a weak way to end the episode - the negates the whole point of the episode. At the start, they're in a situation where the reality is grim and desperate and they need to forge an alliance out of necessity. They don't have a choice.

By the end, they choose not to, and, of course, that's it. When Janeway says their principles as the best allies they can have, she's deadly serious and also right - they literally wish away their problems. It's a cop-out of staggering proportions.

It definitely needlessly nosedived a good episode. I can even buy into the intent of The Speech -they shouldn't go about cutting deals with those who conflict with Fed ideals- but the delivery was way too heavy-handed.

Heading into Feb Sweeps, however, it still seemed like they were going to have to compromise at some point. The odds definitely were getting continuously stacked against Voyager when it came to dealing with the Kazon.

Oh, this treacherous benefit of hindsight...

 

[Kegg]

Oh, this treacherous benefit of hindsight...

Oh, quite. If Janeway was made to pay for what she said later on and recognised it as such I might like "Alliances" better, but even ignoring hindsight (or trying to) the episode seems to sincerely portray that this is the conclusion to the problem.

Nobody in the damn crew says 'hey, wait a minute, don't we still have the problem we had in the first act?' The swelling music and speech are sort of portrayed as the Answer To All Our Problems. So it seems even on a cursory reading of the episode that it feels it's actually dealt with its own problem, only no it goddamn hasn't.

 

[Pemmer Harge]

as bad as treshold is, vs crossfire, it might even win the week.

The thought had occurred to me...

 

[Kegg]

I'll give Threshold this: It has the more interesting romance.

I mean, yeah, I like Odo, and an Odo/Kira/Shakaar romantic triangle, fair enough, but how can that beat Janeway and Paris being superevolved into salamander-humans on a distant planet where they screwed each other and then left their baby salamander things on an alien planet (dead beat transevolutionary parents, the rascals)?

You have to admit, that's more memorable.