Do you think the writers in voyager were closet sexists?
- Thread starter Infern0
- Start date
No. They were just idiots. It's highly unlikely they meant to be sexist.
The lousy writing is something else, this is about acclimatization.
Watched Madmen much?
Hells, watched Bewitched much?
Endora and Samantha should have BBQed Darren for that shit he tried to pull on them. No magic, stay home and clean the house, no woman of mine is getting a job!!
Old people were writing for Voyager, some of who were dinosaurs who only thought they were progressive when really they weren't.
"Look, look! It's a girl!! A girl is captain! Womans lib! Lets burn some bras! YAY!"
This isn't the 70s, and if it was, Mary Tyler Moore fucked them (I have Andrew Dice Clay on the brain. Google him, there's context to justify the before comment.).
Gay was the boundary to be breaking in the 90s but Voyager was just too conservative not to understand what lessons it's audience needed to learn and what they could pick up from reruns of all in the family.
Fuck. It's 2011. Gay has been dealt with. Black and girl too.
What's the new token boundary for the media to rage against?
Watched Madmen much?
Hells, watched Bewitched much?
Endora and Samantha should have BBQed Darren for that shit he tried to pull on them. No magic, stay home and clean the house, no woman of mine is getting a job!!
Old people were writing for Voyager, some of who were dinosaurs who only thought they were progressive when really they weren't.
"Look, look! It's a girl!! A girl is captain! Womans lib! Lets burn some bras! YAY!"
This isn't the 70s, and if it was, Mary Tyler Moore fucked them (I have Andrew Dice Clay on the brain. Google him, there's context to justify the before comment.).
Gay was the boundary to be breaking in the 90s but Voyager was just too conservative not to understand what lessons it's audience needed to learn and what they could pick up from reruns of all in the family.
Fuck. It's 2011. Gay has been dealt with. Black and girl too.
What's the new token boundary for the media to rage against?
Orthodox Jews in space.
Since I consider her one, I would say "No."
I doubt this was an honest inquiry and more of an inflammatory statement, however.
2 of 10 started a thread just south of here where you fellows can air your grievances.
The untouched frontier has always been men in dresses. We had that one dude in a skant in TNG to tease us with this possibility but all has been fail ever since. How do you have a brave new world when man can't relax in a dress after hours??
That thread is over now, I told them the answer.
Time to get these guys in Starfleet-issue kilts, stat! 
Time to get these guys in Starfleet-issue kilts, stat!
You know, weren't there several skants in "Encounter at Farpoint," not just one? I mean, not that I was looking... or anything...
I sincerely hope there was no genuine attempt on the topic creator's part to inject stealth into the blatant bashing thread this is.
It's cool; thankfully the thread derailed onto the much more pleasant topic of skants and space Scotsmen.
Skants: the first line of defense against Trekkie rage?
Agreed!
Janeway was and remains to this day one of the best female characters ever to be portrayed on screen in a leading role.
Name ten better and I'll cede my point.
Name ten better and I'll cede my point.
Ellen Ripley
President Roslin
Sarah Connor
Olivia Dunham
Zoe Washburne
Dana Scully
Princess Leia
Buffy
Hit Girl
Xena
Though I should amend that I don't think Janeway is a bad female character. I don't like Voyager and I do think she was at the wrong end of the bad writing stick. I just think there are plenty better.
President Roslin
Sarah Connor
Olivia Dunham
Zoe Washburne
Dana Scully
Princess Leia
Buffy
Hit Girl
Xena
Though I should amend that I don't think Janeway is a bad female character. I don't like Voyager and I do think she was at the wrong end of the bad writing stick. I just think there are plenty better.
Sexism means women are shit. Or at least less than men.
I do not recall how often Janeway was tied to train tracks with Tom coming to coming to rescue her on a white stallion but it didn't happen too often.
I do not recall how often Janeway was tied to train tracks with Tom coming to coming to rescue her on a white stallion but it didn't happen too often.
That's going too far, but I definitely think she's one of the strongest female characters in Trek.
Come on... that really was just asking for trouble, wasn't it?
I knew it wouldn't be long before at least one list showed up.
I agree that Janeway was often (too often) at "the wrong end of the bad writing stick", though I do like Voyager more than Bishop does. But that's not the point; I don't even agree that all of the names on his list are particularly great characters, and that's not the point either. We can debate the merits and flaws of how Janeway was written, the decisions she made, etc etc. all day, but when it comes to "Is female character A better than female character B?"... the inherent subjectivity of such a question means that you could probably get a dozen different lists from a dozen different people (and eventually, those behind them would start arguing about the differences in their lists). But if YOU (meaning Destructor in this case) think Janeway is amazing, then hey, great. Why do you need validation?
Though, to be fair, I suppose, if "leading role" was meant to specifically refer to "THE main star of the show/movie", then some of Bishop's selections don't count.
Though, there was that one time that Tom kidnapped her in a shuttle, and took her to some distant planet... and something about lizards or newts or something...?
But, oh, that was just some crazy dream Tom had anyway, so it doesn't matter.
Voyager may not have had the most consistent or stellar writing, but it is true that generally speaking, sexism wasn't exactly a huge problem for the show. The inconsistencies in the writing of the Janeway character herself can make the character seem less stable than the other captains, which is unfortunate since she is the first main woman captain, but I wouldn't call it "sexism", since the inconsistencies didn't have anything to do with the fact that she was a woman. It was just sloppy writing.
Seven wearing a catsuit, on the other hand...
You are now my NEW favorite person whose head is sticking out of a starship.
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