This.
Earth 2... it's a lovely step... backwards. It doesn't seem like a new or innovative idea.
DC to REBOOT???
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This.
Earth 2... it's a lovely step... backwards. It doesn't seem like a new or innovative idea.
This revamp is meant to be a shot in the arm for DC Comics but it's the same management, largely the same writers, largely the same artists - really how different can it be?
Here is how you do a reboot:
http://goodcomics.comicbookresource...ly-fired-the-supporting-cast-of-wonder-woman/
(see second story mentioned).
I would love it if Flashpoint ended with Didio simply appearing in the last couple of pages and saying "man this is crap - let's just start again".
http://goodcomics.comicbookresource...ly-fired-the-supporting-cast-of-wonder-woman/
(see second story mentioned).
I would love it if Flashpoint ended with Didio simply appearing in the last couple of pages and saying "man this is crap - let's just start again".
I'm left wondering if they're going with a full step backwards - as in a Superman, Batman and Wonder Woman of Earth-2. I bet they don't take it that far.
Isn't Earth 2 part of the current 52 multiverse? Or is DC changing the 52 Earths as well?
I believe there is an "Earth-2", but it isn't "Earth-2" in how it was known in the silver age.
People complain because DC is getting rid of the JSA.
No wait - they're not getting rid of them.
Yay!
They're putting them on Earth-2.
Wah!
Earth-2 being, of course, the very premise by which the JSA were reintroduced after the 1950s so that anyone reading comics now had a chance to know who they are.
Really, who cares which version of Earth these guys are on? I hear there's a comic book copy devoted entirely to publishing stories about superheroes that take place on some other Earth than DC's main one. Marvel, is it? They do okay for themselves.
No wait - they're not getting rid of them.
Yay!
They're putting them on Earth-2.
Wah!
Earth-2 being, of course, the very premise by which the JSA were reintroduced after the 1950s so that anyone reading comics now had a chance to know who they are.
Really, who cares which version of Earth these guys are on? I hear there's a comic book copy devoted entirely to publishing stories about superheroes that take place on some other Earth than DC's main one. Marvel, is it? They do okay for themselves.
I like the idea of relocating the JSA to another Earth. It means we dont have to search for silly reasons to keep them all young enough to have fought in WWII and still be in their 50's in the present day. Getting them to E2 is pretty easy as well if the Spear of Destiny is still in play. Hitlers Mystic goons simply banished them there when they were about to attack and end the war. This removes almost all heroes from E1 and allows the current group of heroes to surface with only a vague public memory of those past heroes exploits.
I agree with the above poster that they should then take E2 in a radically different direction than E1 post wartime. No atomic weapons, no cold war, etc, etc...
I agree with the above poster that they should then take E2 in a radically different direction than E1 post wartime. No atomic weapons, no cold war, etc, etc...
Exactly so. The JSA has always been deformed in some way or another in order to fit into the modern DC continuity. This frees the writers of that.
I also love the idea of a WWII setting if the creators can pull it off. Wonder if they're cognizant in this regard of Captain America's success doing that on the big screen this summer?
Link
I'm not seeing a big downside to that. Alan Scott doesn't get to kibitz with Kyle Rayner? BFD.
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The only real downside I can see is if they are using this to replace more interesting characters with less interesting characters. If they use this to replace Pieter Cross with Charles McNider or Michael Holt with Terry Sloane or Courtney Whitmore with Ted Knight, I will be very disappointed. The JSA series that started in 99 really had the best of both worlds. It had Alan Scott, Jay Garrick and Wildcat and then all the newbies, making it a pretty unique cast of characters. My one worry is that we'll lose the diversity of the team with this change and that will be a real shame.
While I prefer the idea of a shared fictional world, I never understood the need to keep the JSA characters continually connected to WWII. DC seemed to work on a sliding time line...except for these characters. It made it more and more ridiculous from a storytelling perspective to make up new excuses to keep these characters older, but not too old.
QFT. Except I see that as a major downside and why an alternate-Earth JSA doesn't interest me nearly as much. The '99 Relaunch and its "crusty old veterans teaching and training their dead friends' replacements" approach is what makes the book interesting to me.
Think about this for a second: The GA Flash and GA Green Lantern were first published seventy-one years ago.
Jay Garrick was in college when he became the Flash. So maybe he was in his late teens or early twenties. He'd still be about ninety now. Alan Scott was already an engineer, meaning he was older.
Furthermore, seventy-one years prior to 1940 was 1869. That was the year that U.S. Grant became president. The civil war had ended but four years earlier.
So, the GA heroes are almost as removed from a modern reader as a civil war character would have been from a kid in the 1940s.
At some point, DC is going to either have to keep the JSA set in the past, establish a sliding scale (for example, starting their careers in the 60s, not 40s), just make them immortal or stop using them altogether.
This is a reboot. THAT frees the writers of that.
The reboot can bring back ANYone. So... again... who cares if they were dead two months ago. It's a reboot.
Yeah... that's not such a big deal.
I think for me, they are rebooting the Universe--sorry, RElaunching the Universe--and they can do anything they want... and this is the most imaginative thing they can come up with...
Edited to add: Someone said it up thread, regarding some of the new JSAers. Michael Holt for example. Of course, he's in the new 52... I guess it's going to turn out he read a comic of Mr. Terrific (some sort of waves from Earth 2 reached the mind of a comic book writer, Grant Morrison...) and decided to become him in real life.
Only if they put the JSA back where they belonged.
Of course, in a reboot they can say that all these old guys started doing their thing in the 1960s instead of a generation before, which only makes them old instead of preposterously old. That misses the point of their existence sufficiently to beg the question of why it would matter to resurrect them at all.
I mean, we don't have enough Green Lanterns and guys who run fast without the geezers?
Yeah - like having Superman be from Krypton and wear a red cape is the most imaginative thing they could come up with, in a reboot?
Probably not, but it makes sense to a lot of people anyway.
I wonder if Alan Scott gets to keep his spiffy new "Lantern" suit. 
Putting the JSA back on Earth-Two, and giving them a book with an Earth-Two bullet or masthead is about the best way to go for them.
And between Robinson, Goyer and Johns, they created the best legacy versions these characters ever had. So I'd hate to lose any of them. At the same time, it's time to separate the JSA from WW2. Seriously, I don't know why people think they belong in that time. On the DC forums, someone called it their "golden years" or "greatest moment".....
Why?
Unlike their Marvel Golden Age counteparts, they did NOT fight in WW2. They were sidelined from doing anything of real consequence and were relegated to fighting the occasional spy or saboteur...as well as doing charity gigs for War Bonds. The Spear Of Destiny cockblocked them from having their "greatest moment".
And personally I've always found that annoying. So I'm mixed....I'd hate to lose the legacy versions of Hourman, Stargirl, Jesse Quick and especially Starman....but I think I'd like the original JSA to be more contemporary.
On nuEarth, the superheroes will have been around for five years. I say on Earth-Two say the heroes have been around for ten years. That would allow for some of the legacies, though maybe not all.
And that's assuming that we have to continue with the idea that the JSA must be older for some reason. Really, at this point, there's no reason that that should even be the case anymore. They could just as easily have only been around for five years, if you want a really fresh coat of paint on them.
If it were really well done, I think I'd be okay with that as well.
And between Robinson, Goyer and Johns, they created the best legacy versions these characters ever had. So I'd hate to lose any of them. At the same time, it's time to separate the JSA from WW2. Seriously, I don't know why people think they belong in that time. On the DC forums, someone called it their "golden years" or "greatest moment".....
Why?
Unlike their Marvel Golden Age counteparts, they did NOT fight in WW2. They were sidelined from doing anything of real consequence and were relegated to fighting the occasional spy or saboteur...as well as doing charity gigs for War Bonds. The Spear Of Destiny cockblocked them from having their "greatest moment".
And personally I've always found that annoying. So I'm mixed....I'd hate to lose the legacy versions of Hourman, Stargirl, Jesse Quick and especially Starman....but I think I'd like the original JSA to be more contemporary.
On nuEarth, the superheroes will have been around for five years. I say on Earth-Two say the heroes have been around for ten years. That would allow for some of the legacies, though maybe not all.
And that's assuming that we have to continue with the idea that the JSA must be older for some reason. Really, at this point, there's no reason that that should even be the case anymore. They could just as easily have only been around for five years, if you want a really fresh coat of paint on them.
If it were really well done, I think I'd be okay with that as well.
But what does that mean? Earth 2? WW2? The WW2 of Earth 2? Where do they belong?
The 1960s is an interesting idea, it's certainly something different.
To me what's interesting about the JSA is that they are legacy characters. It provides a history, a back story to the DCU.
Now, with this reboot, they want Supes and Bats to be the first...which, I get, they're the biggest sellers, and have been for years...forever.
I don't know, the idea that there have only been superheroes for ...what...5, 10 years in the NuNuDCU...seems weird to me. And in part, it's because it's new.
Um. Nice strawman there. And you know that's not the point I was making. But, that's fine. You don't like the JSA. You've made that clear in this thread.
That's something they're gonna have to explain. There's a Mr. Terrific comic in the new 52... so, at least one legacy character exists... how they explain it remains to be seen.
In the end, do we need these characters to be legacy characters? It may see preposterous to some purists, but where is it written in stone that Michael Holt is not the first Mr. Terrific. Or Dr. Cross is not the first Dr. Mid-Nite. Or why does Stargirl have to be connected to the Starman legacy? In all honesty except for Starman, Sand, Atom Smasher, and possibly Hourman none of them are focused on the legacy. Just a few changes here and there and they're the same character, but devoid of the legacy.
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