David A. Goodman responds

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Enterprise' started by Guest, Dec 12, 2002.

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  1. NCC-1017

    NCC-1017 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Mar 20, 2001
    CA, U.S.A. (Deep in the Central Valley...)
    Mr. Goodman, thank you for participating in this open forum. I have been a Trek fan as long as I can remember, and have watched all of the series. I haven't yet missed an episode of "Enterprise," and frankly it is only my loyalty to the franchise as a whole that has kept me watching it regularly. I must admit to being less that impressed with this show. I can't offer any specific advice (as if though you would take any from some unknown person via the internet), however I believe that there are enough general comments posted above so that you probably get the gist of where the complaining is coming from. The characters on Enterprise are fine, the ship and technology is fine, the production values are excellent, but ironically whats missing is that very element that the show's opening theme song is supposed to be about: heart. "Enterprise" lacks a direction, it has not really taken any serious risks or consistantly tackled serious social issues. The show needs to take better advantage of its timeframe and of the overarching element of the temporal cold war. As an audience, we should feel that "Enterprise" is leading us into the formation of the Federation via a twisted and rocky road. Instead, I fear, what we seem to be getting is something quite different. I applaud the writers for making an effort to be far more dilident about continuity from one show to another (a problem that Voyager had on a consistant basis), and I also applaud the writers for maintaining a decent level of continuity as regards the "future history" of Star Trek (TOS, TNG, etc.) I hope that at your next meeting with Rick Berman and Brannon Braga that you let them know that there are some fans out there with valid and appropriate criticism, all in an effort not to condemn or slam them, but to let them know that they can do better and that in so doing they will only help themselves. Mr. Berman and Mr. Braga should allow the writers more leeway and more creative license. Above all -- take some risks with the stories you tell. Don't be afraid to upset people, it o.k., discussion and debate is a good thing -- it gets people talking. The world of the 1960s gave birth to many a good TOS story -- the late 1990s and early 21st century should be no different. You need only look to the news headlines in order to find some inspiration. Political intrigue, diplomacy, racism, prejudice, sexism, hatred, exploration, understanding, morality philosophy, history -- this and much more should be the pervue of your stories -- the producers need not go back and rehash or retell old stories, there really should be little need for it, as the galaxy itself is your plaything and there are limitless stories and adventures to be told. I have faith that "Enterprise" will yet become a grand show, if only all involved could take a breath and re-examine the current state of affairs and what has led to it. People tire of the same old thing, but no one tires of well crafted and told stories.

    One final note: Please let Mr. Berman know that one thing that would immediately produce a better show would be to allow the composers free reign on the show's incidental music. I, and many others, greatly dislike the bland music that has become the norm for the show. Go back and watch an episode of TNG from the first 3 or 4 seasons, especially ones that featured scores by Ron Jones, and you'll see exactly what I mean. A dramatic and involving score would help more than it would hurt... And Thanks for listening.

    Life on Earth is expensive, but at least you get a free trip around the sun.
  2. wollem

    wollem Captain Captain

    Jul 17, 2001
    Ventura, CA, USA
    David, thanks for showing up! I just saw Precious Cargo, and thought it was pretty good. The "tribunal" in the mess hall was particularly funny!

    The only other thing I can add at this point is that I am sure that this script was not written by a 12-year-old. My friends and I used to write scripts when we were 12 and I know the difference! [​IMG]
  3. Reza

    Reza Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

    May 6, 2001
    New York
    You know, this Goodman character only responded once...I don't think he's been reading this thread after the 50th post or so...

    Niner aren't linear; we're everywhere.

    "Star Trek: Deep Space Nine was the most well written, produced, acted, and all together finest...Star Trek series."
  4. JNG

    JNG Chief of Staff, Starfleet Command Rear Admiral

    Sep 29, 2001
    He said above that he reads it every day. I have no reason to disbelieve him.
  5. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Dear Mr. Goodman,

    mazel topf on Precious Cargo. It was good. Along similar lines if TPTB think Precious Cargo (initials "PC" - how ironic) is enough of a hit despite "poor" ratings, how about revisiting a TOS fan fave and have the Gorn show up? They needn't be named, so as to preserve the mystery of their arrival in Arena. Or perhaps just have the settlement of Cestus III as the B story to a character development tale?
    I think your influence is a good one in the show (despite Team Knight Rider - but we all gotta do what we gotta do!).

  6. Masked Cucumber

    Masked Cucumber Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Jul 12, 2002
    Ontario, Canada
    It may not matter but I just wanted to say Thank you for a nice episode.

    I remain,

    The Masked Cucumber
  7. Samuel T. Cogley

    Samuel T. Cogley Vice Admiral Admiral

    Nov 7, 2001
    Hold still, Jim.
    Team Knight Rider kicked ass!
  8. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Sequel idea: A crewmember from Minnesota is brought onboard to investigate the brutal murder of the princess...her new mate is the prime suspect, motivated by money difficulties at the vehicle dealership owned by his father-in-law.

    Call it Precious Fargo and see if Frances McDormand is available as crewmember Maggie Gunderson, descended from a long line of Nordic crimesolvers!

  9. Guest

    Guest Guest

    I was thinking more about the basic problem with Enterprise over the weekend, and I think it comes down to this.

    We are no longer in the 1960s. A lot of the above posts talk about Precious Cargo being a "filler" episode. In the '60s, ALL of the episodes would have been today's filler episodes. Almost all successful dramas today have continuing storylines, taking the characters into long-running plots that explore their conflicts and growth. Dallas reintroduced the "soap opera"-style plot to '80s audiences. With it came the cliffhanger, which ENT emulated at the end of Season 1.

    But it's about much more than a cliffhanger at the end of a season. Most current dramas now have ongoing, overarching storylines, even if they have "drama-of-the-week" plots. Compare ER to Marcus Welby's "disease of the week," for instance. Or Alias to Mission:Impossible. Other dramas (off the top of my head) that have continuing stories are The Practice, Farscape, Gilmore Girls, Buffy, The Sopranos, JAG, etc., you name one. The few successful dramas that don't focus on the overarching story (such as CSI) are heavy on plot and short on characterization.

    The Star Trek franchise, however, has always drawn fans who are interested and involved in the characters. Look how many posts here discuss the characters. They're what pull us in to the story, and why we will stay or leave the story.

    We're in the 21st century now, almost 40 years after TOS debuted. Enterprise needs to meet the needs of the modern drama-watching audience by having continuity week to week, instead of so many stand-alone "filler" episodes.

    [This message has been edited by TracyTrip (edited December 16, 2002).]

    [This message has been edited by TracyTrip (edited December 16, 2002).]
  10. Guest

    Guest Guest

    TracyTrip, thank you for such a clear-headed post! Very astute, and I think quite clearly correct.
    Another reminder to us "that all things pass".
  11. evay

    evay Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    Sep 20, 2002
    Deck 4, Section 7
    We can either have stand-alone episodes, as much of TNG was, or huge story arcs, as much of DS9 was, and neither has to be "filler." "Cargo" came off as filler because it was a series of clichés poorly strung together, hampered by a *very*bad*actress*.

    Imaginative twists on the plot abound. Princess Fish Stick could have been male. Since she was from Krios, Kamala's planet, she could have been a male empathic metamorph (established as a dime a dozen on Krios). The hostage could have rescued Trip. Princess Fish Stick really could have been a doctor who was trying to get OUT of going to the conference, and the two Goons could have been minders hired to get her there. The Goons could have been happy to get rid of her, à la "Ruthless People."

    Look, we're a bunch of geeks, more or less, on the internet. If we can come up with half a dozen variants on this plot which would have been more interesting, why are B&B holding their paid writers back? None of those scenarios would have cost any more in sets or costumes -- just dialogue.

    Mr. Goodman, I know your hands are somewhat tied, but what kind of influence DO you have?
  12. Guest

    Guest Guest

    TKR was a guilty pleasure. I'm a Ford fanatic in Detroit so I watched it simply for that reason [​IMG].

    But I must say I'm stunned and grateful to see one of Trek's producers communing with little ol us [​IMG].
  13. Captain Robert April

    Captain Robert April Vice Admiral Admiral

    I must say that "Where No Fan Has Gone Before" was one of the best Star Trek related things I'd seen in a looog time. If you, and more writers with your sensibilities, could get more authority on this show, things would stand a much better chance of turning around.

    Instead, we've got Brannon Braga and Rick Berman standing in the way. Sorry, David, but as the ratings slump and the anemic box office take for Nemesis show pretty clearly, the fanbase has lost confidence in the current regime. When I slapped Braga with the antichrist label back in '95 (Gods, I feel old all of a sudden), I wasn't just trying to be cute. His warped sense of what constitutes a good story, with reinforcement by Rick Berman, is what is killing this franchise. Is it any wonder that the gang at DS9 wouldn't listen to Berman? He may be a top notch technical producer, but with regard to creative matters, he's sorely lacking, to put it mildly.

    From where I sit, this season is a loss anyway, so nothing said here is gonna have any effect in the short term.

    Next season, however, may be another story, all depending on how thin Paramount's patience is with the hemmorraging ratings and the likely possibility that Nemesis won't even break $60 million at the box office. Rick and Brannon have had pretty much absolute control over the franchise for over three years now, with ever dwindling returns. They're very quickly running out of excuses.

    If a palace coup is in the offing, it'd be best to make sure you're on the right side.

    I'd recommend getting friendly with Ron Moore, I suspect he'll be getting a phone call from Sherry Lansing in the near future. He's also a very nice guy.

    ROBT D. APRIL, Captain, SFC
    Commander, U.S.S. ELDRIDGE, NCC-1787
    Captain April's Briefing Room
  14. davejames

    davejames Vice Admiral Admiral

    Oct 6, 2001
    Sac, Ca
    If a future Star Trek series is ever going to work, it's gotta be back on sydication, I feel.

    Not that Berman isn't to blame, but clearly Paramount and UPN have been putting pressure on the producers and writers to "dumb down" the show for quite some time, just like with Voyager. And then they wonder why the ratings go down.

    The writers for DS9 had one important question they always asked themselves, "what is this story about?", that the staffs of VOY and ENT never have. Instead we get stories where the crew go on pointless, meaningless adventures where they don't learn anything, and we don't learn anything about them.

    "Hey, they kidnapped the Captain. We need to rescue him"

    "Hey, these aliens have taken over Enterprise. We need to stop them."

    And that's as deep as it gets.

    Don't these writers ever watch TV? The first 2 minutes of West Wing has more depth and substance and wit than the entire hour of Enterprise before it. Hell, 7th Heaven is more ambitious and edgier than Enterprise!

    Please guys, stop playing it so damn safe all the time! Take some chances.
  15. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Sadly, in the death-throes she waits, not for life, but for a much sought death. Her lover has tortured her to death, and now she silently waits. Her master(s) (ahem...need I mention?) seem to be witlessly dancing with the imps, while the headmaster changes to yet another channel; perhaps fittingly telling the story of a glowing insect. It's upon her. It's...It's...

    Don't stick your nose in my rings! --Titan Fleet Yards, Saturn
  16. Scarpad

    Scarpad Lieutenant Commander

    Jul 11, 2001
    Western Mass
    Watched Cargo tonight and it definately had me watching the clock. I Agree with everything that's been said here, very cliched old hat story, bad actress, and the need to show the crew in their undies and romping. It's very poor story telling. You cannot blame the author of this message since B&B gave him nothing to work for to begin with. This show needs some life infused into it badly
  17. Guest

    Guest Guest

    [post deleted - too harsh]

    [This message has been edited by Ugly Bag of Mostly Water (edited December 17, 2002).]
  18. Captain Robert April

    Captain Robert April Vice Admiral Admiral

    A few years ago, I started transcribing the original Star Trek Writer's Guide onto my computer, with the intent of sending the thing to Braga (in the foolish hope that he might learn something).

    Maybe I'll finish up that project...

    ROBT D. APRIL, Captain, SFC
    Commander, U.S.S. ELDRIDGE, NCC-1787
    Captain April's Briefing Room
  19. cooleddie74

    cooleddie74 Fleet Admiral Admiral

    Apr 25, 2001
    The Warped Sector of the Demented Quadrant
    BRING BACK IRA BEHR. It's as simple as that. Also,see if Harlan Ellison can pen at least ONE more episode for the TREK franchise. [​IMG]

    "He who dares not offend cannot be honest." -Thomas Paine

    The Truth IS Out There...at the domain of the Talkmaster! www.boortz.com
  20. PvtKtara

    PvtKtara Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

    May 23, 2001
    Welcome to the zoo--er, BBS, Mr. Goodman. Have fun, and don't let anybody give you any s--t when you're in here! [​IMG]

    PFC Ktara "Give me liberty, or give me Reed--aw, damn, I think I'll take Reed!"
    "Osama Bin Laden, you can kiss my royal Irish a--!" Mike Moran, FDNY, @ the Concert for NY
    Proud supporter of F.R.E.E.D.O.M.,Shamiradance, and Paul Wein Dot Com
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