Cringe Trek

[XCV330]

I found all their scenes together to be incredibly boring. So, not entertaining. It would have been ok in a single episode but they carried that plot over 6.

It seemed like from the morning after, he wasn't even trying to pretend he wasn't Dukat.

 

[Armus]

The problem wasn't that he used her likeness though, it was that he literally had the computer analyze her logs so that it could generate a good enough approximation of her personality as well. I intentionally didn't raise any questions regarding the legality of the Brahms program, as I'm no legal expert and there's no clear-cut analogue for it. But even if it's legal, it's still creepy and awkward in my eyes.

I mean, writing romantic fan fiction of Daenerys Targaryen and a self-insert character based on yourself is kind-of run-of-the-mill for fan fiction. But if Emilia Clarke were to read a romantic fanfic about her and a character obviously based on myself, I'd be very surprised if her first reaction wasn't "What the f*** is wrong with you?" and slowly backing away.

I think Geordi's infatuation with the holodeck Brahms in Booby Trap was sweet and romantic in that one episode because the episode began with Geordi's romantic failures. He didn't intend to develop feelings for a holodeck version of a real person but he was lonely, stressed, and he needed some solace. Since there was a real Brahms then yes the whole program should have been deleted after the Booby Trap was destroyed. Out of respect for the real Leah Brahms he should have deleted his fantasy Leah. Geordi was in a vulnerable place and we shouldn't be so quick to judge him since the reality of the holodeck characters would probably overtake anyone in that situation.

 

[F. King Daniel]

No, I never said that. And no it doesn't make sense. I'd hate to be judged in an American tribunal, people would just assume a lot of things NOT included in what I said. That's the cultural shock I was talking about.

What I am saying is that in a French movie destined to a French audience, we wouldn't bother if her breasts or even her naked butt were seen in a scene. There plenty of French movies where you see what you people call "full frontal nudity" and they're not even restricted because it's just natural. I mean when someone is at home with his/her lover they don't bother keeping a sheet up to their neck all the time, that's just ridiculous. If people act like it's real life they don't do THAT!!

My second comment is that even if you're shocked by briefly seeing a woman's breasts when it's a natural part of the story then you should be less shocked by those of Milla Jovovich who aren't very developed, if at all.

First, have you ever watched Netflix original series like Altered Carbon? Totally different rules to television regarding nudity and sexuality.

Second, Milla Jovovich's breast size doesn't make her any more or less feminine.

 

[Jayson1]

This is one of the reasons why you should protect all your personal stuff. If only he added a password or a voice ID to his personal-use holoprograms, he could've avoided all of this. He seems to have already learned his lesson when the real Leah Brahms arrived on the Enterprise and didn't act like the holographic recreation, so I think that if she didn't find it, he probably would've deleted it by himself as it dawned on him that he should've done this the moment he started loving a shadow.

I wonder if he couild even do it. I mean it wasn't really a personal program. It was a workplace situation taking place on the holodeck. Might be against the law to delete that. Like erasing video cam footage from camera's at work. Might also want to keep it in file for future use. In fact the real Brahms was going their for that very reason. He could have also just simply forgot to erase it in the way everyone makes mistakes by being lazy or simply having brain farts and then wonder. Why did I forget to do that. I mean LaForge himself turned Morarity into a living being by simply misspeaking. Granted it says something about how advanced holograms are that they can become alive so easy but that is another issue all together.

Jason

 

[cooleddie74]

Princess Fishstick's acting in "Precious Cargo(ENT)." The episode as a whole is one of the cringiest of the 21st century but she is a significant part of why it is.

 

[Vger23]

Anyway, back to Cringe Trek. I cringe at the Borg Queen asking Data, "Was that good for you?" along with Data's giddy reaction to her breath of air on his piece of biological skin.

Kor

I honestly think the entire "Borg Queen is a seductress" angle that FC inexplicably decided to pursue is a huge cringer. Stupid and embarrassing element to an otherwise top-notch movie.

 

[Maurice]

Star Trek sex is always cringey because the network was super uptight about starfleet sex. Of course, compared to Dukat/Winn, Worf/Jadzia sex was downright romantic!!

There was no “network” involved in TNG and DS9, so that doesn’t wash.

 

[BillJ]

There was no “network” involved in TNG and DS9, so that doesn’t wash.

But wasn’t there still Paramount’s TV division overseeing it all? From my perspective, TNG and DS9 were both very conservative, even by the standards of the time.

 

[Vger23]

But wasn’t there still Paramount’s TV division overseeing it all? From my perspective, TNG and DS9 were both very conservative, even by the standards of the time.

I'd guess that they still had some pressure to meet certain standards if the stations they were marketing the show to in syndication were going to show it. Perhaps it wasn't as tough / overt as producing a show for a network, but they still had to convince individual stations to pick it up and broadcast it.

That said, if you look at other Paramount "syndicated" products in the late 1980's like War of the Worlds and Friday the 13th, they definitely pushed more boundaries than TNG or DS9. War of the Worlds could be downright explicit at times for a broadcast TV show, particularly with violence and gore.

 

[Discofan]

The whole "we eat live worms" thing is ok when they're just saying it but when you see them actually putting wormy stuff in their mouths that's a little too much for me.

 

[Ovation]

The whole "we eat live worms" thing is ok when they're just saying it but when you see them actually putting wormy stuff in their mouths that's a little too much for me.

A degree of...sensitivity...I have never shared. Oh well.

 

[Discofan]

A degree of...sensitivity...I have never shared. Oh well.

Well, de gustibus non disputandum est.

 

[Jayson1]

Worms don't seem like much. The Vistors on "V" were eating mice and stuff. Sure it might be gross but that was kind of the point.

Jason

 

[Discofan]

Worms don't seem like much. The Vistors on "V" were eating mice and stuff. Sure it might be gross but that was kind of the point.

Jason

Well, when they did that they looked like reptiles though. Reptiles don't chew they swallow things whole and then it takes them weeks to digest. Seeing someone chewing with his mouth open on something that really looks like worms is another kettle of fish.

 

[Maurice]

But wasn’t there still Paramount’s TV division overseeing it all? From my perspective, TNG and DS9 were both very conservative, even by the standards of the time.

Yes, but that's the studio, as opposed to the studio and the network. The network is the one who usually has the most restrictions. UPN was both a studio and a network. TNG and DS9 likely had the least interference of all the shows because of that.

 

[MAGolding]

Didn't' he marry her in "All Good Things..."?

Some people are not thinking logically.

That doesn't make what we see him do on screen during Booby Trap and Galaxy's Child any less cringeworthy for me. Not to mention it was only in Q's anti-time future anyway. I don't think it counts.

Some people are not thinking logically.

But assuming he eventually marries her then doesn't that mean that she didn't think these moments were all that cringy? And that she saw them as the awkwardness of someone who's not smooth with the ladies, something smart women are wary of. The smoothness I mean.

Some people are not thinking logically.

There's a gap of almost 30 years between Galaxy's Child and All Good Things... that's more than enough time for them to let things slide and start over. I don't think that just because you get in a relationship with someone you automatically stop thinking that those cringy moments are cringy. Maybe at the beginning, before the rose-colored glasses come off. But I think even during the rosy phase it was more like a tacit agreement between the two not to discuss the holoprogram, ever.

You might try refreshing your memory of "All Good Things":

AFORGE: You've got leaf miners. You might want to use a bacillus spray. My wife is quite a gardener. I've picked up a little bit of it.
PICARD: How is Leah?
LAFORGE: Just wonderful. Busy as ever. She's just been made director of the Daystrom Institute.
PICARD: What about the little ones, Brett, Alandra and er?
LAFORGE: Sidney.
PICARD: Sidney.
LAFORGE: Well, they're not so little any more. Brett is applying to Starfleet Academy next year.

And:

PICARD: So, you've heard?
LAFORGE: Leah's got a few friends at Starfleet Medical. Word gets around.
PICARD: I'm not an invalid. Irumodic Syndrome can take years to run its course.
LAFORGE: I know. Once I heard, well, I just wanted to stop by just the same.
PICARD: Well now that you're here, you can help me carry those tools. Well, my cooking may not be up to Leah's standards, but I can still make a decent cup of tea. Oh, I read your last novel. I thought that the protagonist a little too flamboyant, but for the rest I
(he sees three tatty people jeering at him)

So this proves that LaForge's wife's personal name is Leah. And of course we all know that the human population of the Federation is so tiny that there can be only one human woman named Leah.

Of course Leah is also a scientist or engineer since she has just been made director of the Daystrom Institute. And of course we all know that the human population of the Federation is so tiny that there can be only one female human scientist or engineer named Leah.

Or maybe there are so many billions of human women in the Federation that there are countless thousands of female human scientists and engineers named Leah, which might possible be LaForge's favorite female name since childhood for all we know.

And even if LaForge did marry Dr. Leah Brahms, the same Dr. Leah Brahms as in "Booby Trap" and "Galaxy's Child", that doesn't mean that LaForge's wife experienced meeting him and getting angry in "Galaxy's Child".

Many old television shows seem to have been made with very little continuity. The produces of them seem to have considered each episode as something which might possibly happen to the protagonists, instead of thinking of all the episodes together as things which happened one after another to the protagonists.

And the concept of alternate universes can make sense of that annoyingly careless attitude of early tv creators. If every episodes (with a few exceptions in the case of sequels) happens in an alternate universe of its own (or with the pilot film if there is a pilot) then the problems of fitting so many adventures into so short a time, and many other problems can be resolve.

So possibly "All Good Things" happens in an alternate universe from "Galaxy's Child" and neither LaForge or Brahms remembers their bad relationship in "Galaxy's Child" because it nevr happened in their alternate universe.

 

[Kor]

I'd guess that they still had some pressure to meet certain standards if the stations they were marketing the show to in syndication were going to show it. Perhaps it wasn't as tough / overt as producing a show for a network, but they still had to convince individual stations to pick it up and broadcast it.

That said, if you look at other Paramount "syndicated" products in the late 1980's like War of the Worlds and Friday the 13th, they definitely pushed more boundaries than TNG or DS9. War of the Worlds could be downright explicit at times for a broadcast TV show, particularly with violence and gore.

Yes, when people reference "the network" in relation to TNG and DS9, I think they're thinking more about the whole system of over-the-air broadcast television in the US. The stations that air the show have to watch out for the FCC, which has authority to regulate indecent/obscene/profane content, but not violence for some reason.

Kor

 

[Discofan]

..

There's little doubt about that. her first name and her job, match.

 

[fireproof78]

I honestly think the entire "Borg Queen is a seductress" angle that FC inexplicably decided to pursue is a huge cringer. Stupid and embarrassing element to an otherwise top-notch movie.

And completely unnecessary.

 

[Jayson1]

Isn't the Borg Queen suppose to be creepy? The whole point of the character is she is scary and creepy and you don't want to be in that room with her. I think the Queen works well on that level but over the years I feel she was a mistake in regards to the Borg. They should have always been like a uncontrollable storm that you can't understand or stop in most cases. Best thing you can do is hide and hope they don't notice you.


Jason