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CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar 2 - Electric Boogaloo-Fanboys gone WILD-too many hyphens

Do you enjoy pie?

  • Yes, sweet, please

    Votes: 79 40.9%
  • Yes, savory, please

    Votes: 42 21.8%
  • Yes, any kind

    Votes: 80 41.5%
  • No, I'm a heathen

    Votes: 37 19.2%

  • Total voters
    193
From Shawn’s retelling, it was a long distance hallway conversation.
In public? No wonder.

And how are either of them going to trust each other? If they record a conversation then any accidental slip of the tongue or clumsy statement is going to go all over social media. And if not, then either one of them can claim the other said whatever they want. It's really a no-win scenario, isn't it?
 
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In public? No wonder.

And how are either of them going to trust each other? If they record a conversation then any accidental slip of the tongue or clumsy statement is going to go all over social media. And if not, then either one of them can claim the other said whatever they want. It's really a no-win scenario, isn't it?

I won't argue with that, and the fact that several pages of this thread have now been devoted to the shenanigans of a 12 year old boy, the 15 seconds worth of blurting out by a 60 year old failure, and the hours and hours of responses by both sides kind of tells you how silly all of this has become.
 
Moving on... AxaSupporter Reece Watkins speaks to Trekzone:

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Its interesting to hear a voice from the other side of things (other than Alec). I'm always a believer of the idea of a story having three sides: yours, theirs and the truth.
 
Rumors suggest Jonathan is no longer on Team Axanar.
I'd forgotten about Jonathon Lane and his funny ways. Those long, long blog posts giving approximately two sentences of information. I'm surprised to be honest, I thought his support for Alec Peters went beyond family ties etc so often would he defend the indefensible.

Hey, I wonder if he got himself $30-50k on the way out like pretty much everybody else seems to?
 
Moving on... AxaSupporter Reece Watkins speaks to Trekzone:

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Its interesting to hear a voice from the other side of things (other than Alec). I'm always a believer of the idea of a story having three sides: yours, theirs and the truth.
I appreciate his point of view but it also reiterates that Axanar suffered from mission creep. The ideas of building a studio so other fans could use the space sounds nothing like making Axanar.

It's nice that Alec has supporters. I just don't agree on the choices made around what started out as a fan film.
 
Moving on... AxaSupporter Reece Watkins speaks to Trekzone:

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Its interesting to hear a voice from the other side of things (other than Alec). I'm always a believer of the idea of a story having three sides: yours, theirs and the truth.

Not sure I want to sit through that interview. Reece has been a complete tool during all of this, in a lot of ways.
 
That's debatable. Very debatable. And it would appear that some here have come to a different conclusion altogether.
What's debatable about it? If it wasn't mission creep, then he planned to build a for-hire / for-profit studio from the get-go. I don't recall him saying that back in the early days of his proposed project. Ergo: Mission creep or he flat out lied to everyone. Either scenario is totally believable at this point.
 
What's debatable about it? If it wasn't mission creep, then he planned to build a for-hire / for-profit studio from the get-go. I don't recall him saying that back in the early days of his proposed project. Ergo: Mission creep or he flat out lied to everyone. Either scenario is totally believable at this point.

The problem I have with the term mission creep is that it implies getting sidetracked. I don't believe that getting sidetracked is what occurred.

The stated goal was never to make a fan film. It was to make the fan film. The fan film was to be the best fan film ever, something of higher quality not only than all other fan films, but also than professionally produced theatrical Star Trek itself.

Such an over-hyped pie-in-the-sky goal could never be realized. And that's the fundamental problem.

The project peaked at "Prelude." If you want to pinpoint by when the project was definitely off course, it was when they tried to go ahead after "Prelude." No one in authority had the necessary expertise or resources at their disposal to see the project through and meet the expectations as originally advertised, which would also necessarily involve topping "Prelude." It was too heavy a lift. Everything that happened after that was like a meandering Zeno's fan film [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeno's_paradoxes#Dichotomy_paradox]. It was never going to get done.

You cannot get sidetracked when the main track goes nowhere. The main track was supposed to go to utopia, so it was always going nowhere.

So, yeah, I can't really call what happened mission creep, when the original mission was impossible. And that's putting as positive a spin on it as I think there is.
 
I mean, I see the point, but honestly the idea of expanding the goal of "making THE fan film" to "making a studio space for all fans to enjoy and use" sounds to me like something akin to mission creep. Not getting sidetracked, but expanding upon the initial idea to create something grander. Unless I am thoroughly misunderstanding what "mission creep" is defined as. :shrug:
 
I mean, I see the point, but honestly the idea of expanding the goal of "making THE fan film" to "making a studio space for all fans to enjoy and use" sounds to me like something akin to mission creep. Not getting sidetracked, but expanding upon the initial idea to create something grander. Unless I am thoroughly misunderstanding what "mission creep" is defined as. :shrug:
I see what you mean. And my goal isn't top split hairs, especially to death.

In software, mission creep has a fairly well-understood sense. It involves getting sidetracked, pulled away from making progress towards your main goal through some combination of factors, including but not necessarily limited to paying too much attention to what should be secondary concerns. An essential element of it, though, is that it occurs unintentionally, accidentally, so slowly you don't even realize it's happened, until you've already fallen victim to it. Hence, the "creep."

I do not believe that Axanar failed because they lost sight of the main objective of making a film due to their focusing too much on the studio and the merchandising instead, and getting lost in that. Rather, their decision to set up the studio and sell merchandise signaled that they had by that point elected to pursue other objectives and put off direct work on the fan film, at least temporarily* but for the foreseeable future. That's a red flag. Not mission creep, but flat-out either change of mission, or (again with the positive spin) clarification of their mission after realizing just how far they had to go.

To get us to utopia they had to build the bestest train to get us there. Sorry, my snark may just be starting to show, now.

* - "Everything is temporary!" — Cosmo Castorini (Moonstruck).
 
I see what you mean. And my goal isn't top split hairs, especially to death.

In software, mission creep has a fairly well-understood sense. It involves getting sidetracked, pulled away from making progress towards your main goal through some combination of factors, including but not necessarily limited to paying too much attention to what should be secondary concerns. An essential element of it, though, is that it occurs unintentionally, accidentally, so slowly you don't even realize it's happened, until you've already fallen victim to it. Hence, the "creep."

I do not believe that Axanar failed because they lost sight of the main objective of making a film due to their focusing too much on the studio and the merchandising instead, and getting lost in that. Rather, their decision to set up the studio and sell merchandise signaled that they had by that point elected to pursue other objectives and put off direct work on the fan film, at least temporarily* but for the foreseeable future. That's a red flag. Not mission creep, but flat-out either change of mission, or (again with the positive spin) clarification of their mission after realizing just how far they had to go.

To get us to utopia they had to build the bestest train to get us there. Sorry, my snark may just be starting to show, now.

* - "Everything is temporary!" — Cosmo Castorini (Moonstruck).
Ah, that helps clarify things. I don't have a better definition beyond thinking that their ambition was so over the top that they did broaden out that mission to the point of nearly unobtainable. And that's more what I see happening but perhaps not in a mission creep sense but a ambition sense. If that make any sense.
 
Ah, that helps clarify things. I don't have a better definition beyond thinking that their ambition was so over the top that they did broaden out that mission to the point of nearly unobtainable. And that's more what I see happening but perhaps not in a mission creep sense but a ambition sense. If that make any sense.

I would absolutely agree that they bit off more than they could chew.
 
I would absolutely agree that they bit off more than they could chew.
Except they didn't. Christian Gossett said they were ready to roll right into production of the actual Axanar feature film and the crew that did Prelude was ready to start on Axanar and he even had a rentable studio space lined up.

But Alec started complaining about how much some of the aspects of Prelude cost, and felt some of the work was being overcharged and he of course could find people just as good who would work for a lot less etc. And that was when he started floating the idea of just creating their own studio space, which Gossett and others kept trying to talk him out of; until he went ahead with his own plans and they threw up their arms and frustration and quit (where were driven out/fired by Alec.)

It was pretty clear that after Alec saw the response to Prelude, he figured he could start his own studio business using other people's money, and amassed and burned through $2.5 million at a warehouse which she ultimately couldn't afford the rent on. Then after he left, The actual owner of the space got rid of all his unusable upgrades and running it out to someone who turned it into a motorcycle shop. I don't know if it's still that today or not.
 
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