Spoilers Canon, Continuity, and Pike's Accident

[Noname Given]

...the question arose about whether TOS, TAS, DISCO, and SNW are in the same continuity...

Yes they are all in the same continuity.

The fallacy a lot of fans have is that Star Trek continuity is general is tightly consistent overall.
^^^
It isn't, never has been; and no, the situation didn't change/improve in the Berman and Braga Trek era either.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Yes they are all in the same continuity.

The fallacy a lot of fans have is that Star Trek continuity is general is tightly consistent overall.
^^^
It isn't, never has been; and no, the situation didn't change/improve in the Berman and Braga Trek era either.

Berman/Braga is quite the convenient scapegoat, isn't it? People love to shit on them for no readily apparent reason. It gives the illusion that people care, without actually having to do (or think) anything.

 

[fireproof78]

Berman.

Braga.

Kurtzman.

People like their scapegoats. Easier than just saying, "I don't like this thing."

 

[Noname Given]

Berman/Braga is quite the convenient scapegoat, isn't it? People love to shit on them for no readily apparent reason. It gives the illusion that people care, without actually having to do (or think) anything.

I'm not shitting on them per se - but I see too many TNG fans claim TOS was wildly inconsistent WRT canon compared to TNG - and that situation was IMPROVED under B&B (and no, it wasn't).

 

[Yistaan]

Berman/Braga is quite the convenient scapegoat, isn't it? People love to shit on them for no readily apparent reason. It gives the illusion that people care, without actually having to do (or think) anything.

To be fair, Berman particularly isn't a saint and we've heard a lot of cringey stories about how he allegedly objectified actresses behind the scenes. And while of course there's innocent until proven guilty etc. he hasn't to my knowledge come out and decisively denied these allegations either. For these reasons people may feel comfortable with blaming stuff that might not be his fault on him if in their minds he's already likely a jerk.

As for Braga, I haven't heard anything really bad about him (althoug Ronald Moore apparently had issues with him on Voyager I heard), but at the same time he's given conflicting explanations on what he was aiming for in the Trek under his tenure. For example, I'm still not clear if Future Guy being Archer is a genuine thing or something he was trolling Trek fans on twitter about.

 

[ichab]

To be fair, Berman particularly isn't a saint and we've heard a lot of cringey stories about how he allegedly objectified actresses behind the scenes. And while of course there's innocent until proven guilty etc. he hasn't to my knowledge come out and decisively denied these allegations either. For these reasons people may feel comfortable with blaming stuff that might not be his fault on him if in their minds he's already likely a jerk.

I remember seeing a video where Braga suggested bringing a Borg on as a member of the Voyager crew and he said that Berman's response was "Make it a Borg babe!" Plus with the comments that Terry Farrell made about her dealings with him, it's not to hard to dislike him. IMO he should have been put out to pasture after Voyager.

As for Braga, I haven't heard anything really bad about him (althoug Ronald Moore apparently had issues with him on Voyager I heard), but at the same time he's given conflicting explanations on what he was aiming for in the Trek under his tenure. For example, I'm still not clear if Future Guy being Archer is a genuine thing or something he was trolling Trek fans on twitter about.

Every video I've seen he stated the temporal cold war was a studio mandate. I've never seen his comments about who future guy was suppose to be. In fact to this day I don't know who future guy was. Was that ever explained?

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Every video I've seen he stated the temporal cold war was a studio mandate.

That is exactly what it was.

The people actually making the show never wanted the TCW. It was ordered by the network.

As was the transporter. The ENT showrunners didn't want that either.

 

[Yistaan]

I remember seeing a video where Braga suggested bringing a Borg on as a member of the Voyager crew and he said that Berman's response was "Make it a Borg babe!" Plus with the comments that Terry Farrell made about her dealings with him, it's not to hard to dislike him. IMO he should have been put out to pasture after Voyager.


Every video I've seen he stated the temporal cold war was a studio mandate. I've never seen his comments about who future guy was suppose to be. In fact to this day I don't know who future guy was. Was that ever explained?

In November 2012, Brannon Braga stated on his Twitter account that the show's fifth season would have revealed Future Guy to be Jonathan Archer "trying to correct history" and repair a corrupt future by influencing his younger self. Braga added that Archer being Future Guy was the plan from the beginning, and previous statements claiming Future Guy was intended to be a Romulan were meant as a red herring. [3][4]

In December 2012, Braga expanded on his previous statements by indicating that Archer may have been kept alive by Suliban genetics. [5] It was also indicated that Archer may have had a motive to even kill his past self to benefit the future. [6]

Brannon Braga later recalled, "I thought the most interesting idea that we came up with [regarding the identity of Future Guy] was that it was going to be Archer himself. And an Archer from some sort of terrible future where he, in some way, was responsible for doing something wrong, but he's manipulating himself. And if you go back and look, it could very well have been Archer." Braga also expressed disappointment at never having gotten a chance to establish that Future Guy was really Archer and to have Archer transform into this other persona, traveling to the 29th century (which Braga reckoned had been discussed by the makers of ENT). ("In Conversation: Rick Berman and Brannon Braga", ENT Season 1 Blu-ray special features)

 

[The Wormhole]

And while of course there's innocent until proven guilty etc. he hasn't to my knowledge come out and decisively denied these allegations either.

Quite the opposite in fact. When questioned about Terry Farrell's allegations in a 2016 interview, Berman defended himself by saying "a woman's job on television is to look pretty."

For example, I'm still not clear if Future Guy being Archer is a genuine thing or something he was trolling Trek fans on twitter about.

I'm going to go with trolling. When Enterprise ended, Braga said in interviews Future Guy's identity was completely unknown and no one ever bothered thinking up an identity for him. This stuff about Archer being Future Guy was likely something he thought up later. Maybe it genuinely is what Braga would do if he had the chance to do an Enterprise sequel or follow up or whatever, but the idea is still very much something he likely came up with years after Enterprise ended rather than while the show was in production.

 

[Mudd]

I remember seeing a video where Braga suggested bringing a Borg on as a member of the Voyager crew and he said that Berman's response was "Make it a Borg babe!"

And...he was right.

 

[Tuskin38]

Didn't Braga also say at one point that Future Guy was a Romulan?

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ Not that I'm aware of, no. It was just a fan theory.

 

[Yistaan]

Didn't Braga also say at one point that Future Guy was a Romulan?

^ Not that I'm aware of, no. It was just a fan theory.

At the 2009 VegasCon, however, Manny Coto and Brannon Braga stated that "Future Guy" was "probably going to be a Romulan" and would have tied into the Romulan War as a future Romulan, trying to "instigate things." [2] In the ENT Season 1 Blu-ray featurette "In Conversation: Rick Berman and Brannon Braga", Braga remarked, "We had thrown around a lot of ideas about who Future Guy was gonna be. A Romulan [for instance]."

It just occurred to me that the infamous 'These are the Voyages' probably could've been refitted into an elderly Jonathan Archer, revealed to be Future Guy but no other info is given on how he survived so long, reliving the events of NX-01's final mission and revealing that at least one of the goals of his schemes is to prevent Trip's death. Then the series ends on a soft cliffhanger where it's never revealed if Future Guy/Old Archer ever is successful in preventing it.

That'd put Scott Bakula into double duty for the finale along with old age makeup, but it probably would've been received a lot better with essentially the same story we got minus Riker and Troi.

 

[Paul755]

https://www.denofgeek.com/tv/star-t...season-2-big-original-series-canon-questions/

A bit more from Goldsman on canon/continuity near the end of this interview.

 

[Mudd]

I am so not interested in seeing intriguing, entertaining SNW Spock deteriorate into dour, arrogant TOS Spock.

In the meantime, what's coming up this year looks like great fun.

 

[Tallguy]

I am so not interested in seeing intriguing, entertaining SNW Spock deteriorate into dour, arrogant TOS Spock.

In the meantime, what's coming up this year looks like great fun.

You forgot angry. You can't do TOS Nimoy without angry.

(And Peck did that wonderfully as the bratty little brother Spock in his scenes with Michael. By far my favorite thing in all of Disco.)

https://www.denofgeek.com/tv/star-t...season-2-big-original-series-canon-questions/

A bit more from Goldsman on canon/continuity near the end of this interview.

Still making me nervous that "they have a plan" and that they are going to make continuity "make sense" (paraphrasing). I mean, amazing if they can pull it off. But the end of Disco S2 tells me the odds are not in their favor.

 

[Noname Given]

You forgot angry. You can't do TOS Nimoy without angry.

(And Peck did that wonderfully as the bratty little brother Spock in his scenes with Michael. By far my favorite thing in all of Disco.)



Still making me nervous that "they have a plan" and that they are going to make continuity "make sense" (paraphrasing). I mean, amazing if they can pull it off. But the end of Disco S2 tells me the odds are not in their favor.

I just hope it remains popular enough that they get the 5 to 6 seasons they seem to be aiming for to do 'their plan' (whatever it is.)

I LOVED SNW S1 and S2 looks really good too.

I hope the WGA and SAG/AFTRA unions and the Studios can soon agree to a deal that everyone is okay with (won't say 'happy' because in these situations it's absolutely RARE any side walks away 'happy'.)

 

[Tallguy]

If the worst thing we get is SNW's equivalent of Shades of Gray, I guess we're OK.

 

[Yistaan]

Still making me nervous that "they have a plan" and that they are going to make continuity "make sense" (paraphrasing). I mean, amazing if they can pull it off. But the end of Disco S2 tells me the odds are not in their favor.

Wil Wheaton and Scott Bakula show up drafting Pike and his crew into the Temporal Wars and all hell breaks loose. Then the last scene is Wesley and President Archer dropping them back into the 1960s TOS Enterprise with no explanation, filmed on James Cawley's set.

 

[Tallguy]

Wil Wheaton and Scott Bakula show up drafting Pike and his crew into the Temporal Wars and all hell breaks loose. Then the last scene is Wesley and President Archer dropping them back into the 1960s TOS Enterprise with no explanation, filmed on James Cawley's set.