were there complaints against putting ian in?
Spoilers Canon, Continuity, and Pike's Accident
- Thread starter CorporalCaptain
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Probably.
Definitely. To the point that people felt Lucas had screwed up his iconic films and were trying to eliminate them from history. Yeah, the Special Editions have their detractors.
And I'm one of them. I despise a lot of the things they changed from the original 1977 STAR WARS:
- The Mos Esly stuff that has Jawas swinging from riding animals
- Han shot first (my ass)
- Han walking on Jabba the Hutt in the landing Hangar.
I could easily have them down as conspiracy hunters who heard rumours from the El Aurian survivors of the Borg who destroyed their planet and went hunting.
Now why the El Aurians didn't think to warn the Fed of this...
It was probably a few lines in the filing computer and that was that.
A sadly accurate assessment of how bureaucracy can, and often, does gloss over things and ignore them rather than bother following up.
"Hey, shouldn't we say something about these reports of real life Cybermen?"
"Nah, we've all got to work overtime as it is to get those parts in by Tuesday"
"Wasn't that deadline 3 months ago"
"It WILL be installed by Tuesday dammit"
If they had done it well? Less so, I suppose. It doesn't feel like part of the same film and McDiarmid just didn't look like the Emperor anymore. Also they moved around the dialog to "explain" Vader finding out about Luke (or something).
It's trying to solve a problem that didn't need to be solved and doing it badly.
Even if they did take the threat seriously, the reduced warp speeds from TOS (they went to the center of the galaxy in TAS and ST5, in line with TOS' stated top speed of 990 light years in 11.5 hours) to dramatize Voyager being lost in the same galaxy meant that the Fed couldn't go check out the Borg even if they wanted to. As it was the Hansens had to violate the Neutral Zone just to find the transwarp conduit that led them to the Delta Quadrant.
What defenses would they put in Fed space that they didn't already have? And the Prime Directive would also forbid the Fed from automatically "taking sides" in the El-Aurian/Borg conflict. While we as the audience sympathize with the El-Aurians primarily through the Trek episodes with Guinan, the Fed had no reason to necessarily believe that the El-Aurians account of the Borg as evil were unbiased, especially now as we know that the El-Aurians apparently went to war with the Q, while the Q (Q himself aside) don't really go to war with anyone.
Not to mention the particular El-Aurian refugees seen in Generations were probably still enduring Nexus withdrawal to give much in the way of coherent Borg testimony.
To be fair obviously Ian's ESB Emperor looks like how the character looked in ROTS (because they were filmed at the same time). Yes, he doesn't look like the ROTJ Emperor anymore, but I'm not sure your complaint has merit considering the actress with chimpanzee eyes superimposed in the original theatrical ESB doesn't look like ANY other incarnation of the Emperor, including ROTJ's.
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Maybe they did and it was classified by Section 31 along with the wreckage from Regeneration while S31 investigated.
Naw. Simpler to just say that EVERYTHING in Star Trek after Voyager's Future's End episodes and the feature film Star Trek First Contact takes place in a alternate timeline...
Maybe I should start writing these down? Something like "Tallguy's Rules of Star Trek":
Rule 83: Section 31 is always the wrong answer.
Rule 83a: Unless the question is "What can we keep out of future Star Trek?"
Given the influence of groups like "Terra Prime" and the desire to avoid a panic I could see this being a possibility. Bad enough that they are dealing with poor contact with the Klingons, and Suliban and such. Why add the idea that there are cyborg zombies somewhere, out there.
Or, it could have been filed as a brief to Command, and got misplaced. There is a great JAG episode discussing a submarine that was on a CIA mission that observed the Japanese fleet enroute to Pearl Harbor. Unfortunately, the communication they sent as a warning was misfiled and so it never went through.
Lots of room for human error.
If Section 31 didn't exist we'd just have another organization doing skullduggery, that we would hate just as much.
Section 31 probably knew everything about the Borg before the Fed was even founded (Bashir said they've been in hiding for 300 years as of the 24th century)! How long do you think Zefram Cochrane would've lasted in a full blown Section 31 torture/interrogation session? We'll be lucky if he lasts 3 minutes before screaming he sees 5 lights.
Nope. Its addition to Trek was random DS9 strangeness - Trek had managed just fine without cynical, shallow conspiracy bullshit for decades.
Even so, I don't mind it's addition or its inclusion. Trek is not lesser for it.
it could have even been something misplaced by Section 31 internally. Or they did do their due diligence and not even they thought the Borg would be near unstoppable.
agreed as long as they stay super shadowy and rarely used like they were on DS9. Not something as an open secret like the Tal Shiar or Obsidian Order. Or how they were used on Disco.
If they knew about the Borg's part in First Contact, Section 31 may have been worried that anything they do might mess with that (after all they threw the entire crew of the USS Defiant under the bus knowing full well they were destined to end up in the past of the Mirror universe).
Then again, Nechayev's order to use any means necessary to wipe out the Borg after Picard let Hugh go seems to contradict that.
I was fine with it on Disco. People treat it like it's some big open thing, but they just utilized legitimate assets to further their operation, which real world agencies do all the time. And then they suffer a loss, and contract and regroup.
Adaptation is the key to survival.
Also, the idea that Section 31 is not appropriate for Trek, but it's totally appropriate for a senior ship commander to engage in spy work? That's more ridiculous to me, than an organization that is so distrustful of outside forces, and seeks to preserve their way of life at all costs. One sounds very human and the other very drama based.
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