Babylon 5

[Guy Gardener]

Surgery was murdering the kids soul.

Leaving the kid alone, was letting him waft away to alien heaven full of lollipops and pony rides.

 

[DonIago]

I'm not mocking their beliefs. People, or aliens, can believe whatever they want.

It's murdering a child that was going way past the line. You don't murder children. Period.

But from their perspective their kid was already dead, so...you are taking issue with their belief system. Not necessarily an unjustified one!

 

[Farscape One]

I can never condone or defend a person, fictional or not, for murdering a child. I don't give a damn if it's a religious reason or not. There are very few things in life I never budge on, and that is one of them.

(And no, I'm not anti-abortion. But when a kid is born, they deserve a chance to grow up.)

 

[DonIago]

I wonder whether their people faced an overpopulation crisis at some point in their past, which led to them adapting views that would curb the population, but encoding it as a religious belief.

 

[Kraig]

From the"Believers" episode in the Lurker's guide to Babylon 5: The Children of Time, a minor race with strong religious beliefs, would rather let one of their number die than allow invasive surgery, which they believe destroys the soul.

F.Y.I The writer for the script of the B5 Episode "Believers" was David Gerrold (TOS: The Trouble With Tribbles).

 

[Guy Gardener]

I wonder whether their people faced an overpopulation crisis at some point in their past, which led to them adapting views that would curb the population, but encoding it as a religious belief.

I'm thinking it was first one enhancements from three shadow wars ago.

Waking up one day as a P40 telepath or suddenly grown a razor sharp tail.

Your neighbours are going to set you on fire for being weird.

 

[Zod]

I don't know if anybody has an answer to this but it has been gnawing at me since I binged through the show over this summer for the second time. My first time through was 12 years ago.

In Season One episode Mind War the telepath friend of Talia evolves into a creature of energy at the end.

He says (To Sinclair I think) I will see you in a million years....

Did they ever explain what they meant by this?

 

[Gov Kodos]

I don't know if anybody has an answer to this but it has been gnawing at me since I binged through the show over this summer for the second time. My first time through was 12 years ago.

In Season One episode Mind War the telepath friend of Talia evolves into a creature of energy at the end.

He says (To Sinclair I think) I will see you in a million years....

Did they ever explain what they meant by this?

He could foresee humanity's development to the energy beings seen in the season 4 finale would be my guess.

 

[Farscape One]

I think that's what he meant... a general statement to humans.

Now that you mention "MIND WAR", one thing always did bother me. As powerful as Ironheart was, he didn't see in Talia's mind the sleeper program?

JMS was always superb at giving little clues throughout the show about everything. But that seemed like a slight oversight.

Obviously, Bester and the Psi Corps likely examined and gained a lot of knowledge from Talia... perhaps enough to do secret experiments down the road.

I just thought it was a missed opportunity, particularly when you think of the VCR dude in "DEATHWALKER".

 

[DonIago]

I'm pretty sure Talia's fate was one of JMS'es "trapdoors", not something he really planned to execute.

 

[Kraig]

I think that's what he meant... a general statement to humans.

Now that you mention "MIND WAR", one thing always did bother me. As powerful as Ironheart was, he didn't see in Talia's mind the sleeper program?

JMS was always superb at giving little clues throughout the show about everything. But that seemed like a slight oversight.

Obviously, Bester and the Psi Corps likely examined and gained a lot of knowledge from Talia... perhaps enough to do secret experiments down the road.

I just thought it was a missed opportunity, particularly when you think of the VCR dude in "DEATHWALKER".

Ironheart didn't see Talia was an agent because he wasn't looking, he had no reason to. Talia wouldn't react unless Ironheart knew the telepathic command that would unlock her 'Control" personality as an undercover agent. A telepath would know if they were being scanned. It is bad manners, and against Psicorp rules to deep scan another telepath without their permission and Talia Winters and Jason Ironheart were friends and former lovers. I wonder if she lost the gift of telekenesis given to her by Jason Ironheart when her Control personality was unlocked by Lyta Alexander and took away the Talia Winters personality.

 

[Guy Gardener]

I don't know if anybody has an answer to this but it has been gnawing at me since I binged through the show over this summer for the second time. My first time through was 12 years ago.

In Season One episode Mind War the telepath friend of Talia evolves into a creature of energy at the end.

He says (To Sinclair I think) I will see you in a million years....

Did they ever explain what they meant by this?

In the the original Bible There was no Sheridan.

Catherine Saki stumbled into the shadows after season one, and Sinclair blew up Zahadum, who was then brought back by Lorien. So it was supposed to be Sinclair who ascended in Sleeping in Light. Then a million years later, post humans were allowed into Vorlon space as Sol was about to explode, and Jason Ironheart was waiting at the party, and met Sinclair.

 

[Farscape One]

I'm pretty sure Talia's fate was one of JMS'es "trapdoors", not something he really planned to execute.

I know his trapdoors, which were one of his most brilliant ideas. He knew the realities of tv programming could lead to anyone being gone at any time, and having an exit for everyone was genius.

But originally, it was Takashima that was going to be Control. When the actress didn't sign on, that part of the world went to Talia. I know Andrea Thompson wanted out at that season, but I'm pretty sure it was her fate as soon as she was cast. Timetable might have been the only difference, though.

 

[valkyrie013]

Actually, the 'Control" arc was going to happen regardless, Remember when Kosh had that weird alien scan her? He was making a backup copy of Tallia. So when control asserted itself, they would be able to "reboot" her with the zerox copy.. if she wanted to come back.

 

[DonIago]

Even by B5 standards that might have been pretty weird. I wonder how they would have explained why Kosh cared.

 

[Gov Kodos]

Even by B5 standards that might have been pretty weird. I wonder how they would have explained why Kosh cared.

With Kosh, some cryptic yet humorous one liner. However, the Ironheart/telepathic boost might have been used as a reason to keep Talia from Psicorp and Shadow influenced hands. The Vorlons ought to have been aware of the Shadow influence on earth so keeping a ramped up telepath from Psicorp would be one reason to care. Control might have been found out if Kosh wanted to use Talia as a go between the way Lyta was.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

against Psicorp rules to deep scan another telepath without their permission

Really? I always thought the Psi Corps had pretty much carte blanche to scan whomever they wanted (both telepaths and non-telepaths), whenever they wanted, for whatever reason they felt like. I wasn't aware they operated under any rules, as such.

 

[Zod]

Really? I always thought the Psi Corps had pretty much carte blanche to scan whomever they wanted (both telepaths and non-telepaths), whenever they wanted, for whatever reason they felt like. I wasn't aware they operated under any rules, as such.

I was watching The Gathering again recently and when Lyta came aboard Sinclair was spouting off all these rules to her about telepath behavior aboard B5. Also when they asked her to scan Kosh she first said no. Said she couldn't scan without consent and stuff about "court orders"

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ Clark wasn't president at that time, so the Psi Corps probably hadn't yet had the chance to get their hooks into EarthGov.

Once Clark was in control, though...all bets were off.

 

[Zod]

^ Clark wasn't president at that time, so the Psi Corps probably hadn't yet had the chance to get their hooks into EarthGov.

Once Clark was in control, though...all bets were off.

That is true! From what happened afterwards when I watched Crusade it appears they went in the opposite direction and limited telepath behavior even more. That first officer guy was so scared to do anything telepath related.