The OFFICIAL STNG-R general discussion thread!

[throwback]

Well, for me, one of the issues I had with TOS-R is that they weren't always adhering to what was established.

For both the "Errand of Mercy" and "Friday's Child", the artists at CBS Digital selected a D-7 battlecruiser. The actions and quick destruction of the ship in the former episode, and the description of the ship in the latter indicate a smaller ship, possibly a scout, than a capital ship.

I agree with some that the CGI in these shows is dodgy, and, though, I had hopes for new FX in TNG (ships, planets, etc.), I am relieved that the restoration team has demonstrated good common sense by choosing not to enhance these shows. If you are going to do, do it right or don't do it at all.

 

[mswood]

The CGI in TOS-R looked a lot better than Enterprise. Enterprise's CGI just looked atrocious through all 4 seasons, especially in "These Are The Voyages...". The only CGI that looks better than TOS-R's (aside from the 2009 film) are the CGI shots from FC and the later seasons of DS9 where the CGI ships were being mixed into shots with filming models like the DS9 station.

With a few possible matte exceptions (and perhaps a planet or two), I can' think of a production opinion I have ever heard that I disagree with as much.

Clearly the work done on VOY, DS9, and ENT were done under budget and time limits (and some shots were above their ability to do successfully, in the sort of way that B5 did shots that had scope but lacked a believable level of quality), most of those weren't Space Shots.

There is not a single space bound FX shot from TOS that I found even getting to an average quality space shot down in any season of CGI work for Voyager (season 1 -7), DS9 (season 5-7), or ENT (season 1-4) and thats with ENT's last seasons showing the decrease in production budget.

 

[jefferiestubes8]

Review

Highdef digest has a review up today

http://bluray.highdefdigest.com/5954/st_tng_next_level.html

 

[ChristopherPike]

*snorts coffee and blows it out over screen*

What's that? Better CG on Remastered TOS, than ENT?!?

NX-01 looks much more photorealistic, than cartoony NCC-1701. CBS should've shelled out for the outfit who did the Defiant during the "In A Mirror, Darkly" episodes.

Only element it trumped their VFX as far as I can see, was inserting real life extras into enhanced matt backgrounds. Where on ENT, CG created characters (moving spacesuits on dry docks, tiny guys visable inside inspection pods, crewmembers & Suliban exposed to vacuum conditions) frequently lacked the authentic movement only a real human being can provide.

Back on topic: I've just ordered the TNG-R sampler disc and can't wait to see all that enhanced detail ILM (and others) originally did, but which we couldn't see back then.

 

[RAMA]

The CGI in TOS-R looked a lot better than Enterprise. Enterprise's CGI just looked atrocious through all 4 seasons, especially in "These Are The Voyages...". The only CGI that looks better than TOS-R's (aside from the 2009 film) are the CGI shots from FC and the later seasons of DS9 where the CGI ships were being mixed into shots with filming models like the DS9 station.

I'm not an Enterprise fan, but the effects work by Eden FX blew the TOS-R work done by CBS Digital out of the water.

Right, because they are two totally different conceptual designscapes and of course you will never ever understand that in million years.

RAMA

 

[JJohnson]

I'm watching Q Who right now, and 20 minutes into the show, I see the black cardboard on the back monitors...are we to assume they won't cg that out so that the monitors look normal?

 

[Destructor]

I'm watching Q Who right now, and 20 minutes into the show, I see the black cardboard on the back monitors...are we to assume they won't cg that out so that the monitors look normal?

I think that is safe to assume- it's not like they have a massive budget to CG every little thing out.

 

[Start Wreck]

Right, because they are two totally different conceptual designscapes and of course you will never ever understand that in million years.

RAMA

They are stylistically different, but that doesn't mean one isn't also qualitatively better produced than the other.

Although if they get the artist(s?) who did the digital matte paintings back for TNG-R, I will be very happy indeed. They were superb.

 

[BillJ]

The CGI in TOS-R looked a lot better than Enterprise. Enterprise's CGI just looked atrocious through all 4 seasons, especially in "These Are The Voyages...". The only CGI that looks better than TOS-R's (aside from the 2009 film) are the CGI shots from FC and the later seasons of DS9 where the CGI ships were being mixed into shots with filming models like the DS9 station.

I'm not an Enterprise fan, but the effects work by Eden FX blew the TOS-R work done by CBS Digital out of the water.

Right, because they are two totally different conceptual designscapes and of course you will never ever understand that in million years.

RAMA

If you can't simply admit one is of higher quality than another then I'm thinking you're arguing simply to be arguing.

There may have been time limitations but I'm sure Dave Rossi and Mike Okuda would've loved to have been able to produce a Klingon model that wasn't a segmented mess.

 

[JRS]

All of this talk about visual effects and people behind them reminds me of this short film called "Digital Grunt", a humorous fictional story about the behind the scenes life of working in the visual effects industry:
http://youtu.be/HPflLGEHUAI

(sorry of the slight off-topic)

 

[RAMA]

Right, because they are two totally different conceptual designscapes and of course you will never ever understand that in million years.

RAMA

They are stylistically different, but that doesn't mean one isn't also qualitatively better produced than the other.

Although if they get the artist(s?) who did the digital matte paintings back for TNG-R, I will be very happy indeed. They were superb.

If we're to say what FX are best absolute terms, then Enterprise is the clear leader, as it produced modern FX at the limit of the tech of the time. The TOS-R FX are tremendously successful and widely praised by the pro FX community because their goal was to NOT produce FX to the limits allowable by technology but to create them so they did not look out of place: rounded, soft edges, less detail, limited motion...though in most cases, slightly tweaked so they were beyond the capabilities of the budget of the 60s era (the ion pod scene, the expanded motion in Doomsday Machine, Klingon D7s maneuvering in space, instead of stationary, etc). Two different goals, both successful.

 

[RAMA]

I'm not an Enterprise fan, but the effects work by Eden FX blew the TOS-R work done by CBS Digital out of the water.

Right, because they are two totally different conceptual designscapes and of course you will never ever understand that in million years.

RAMA

If you can't simply admit one is of higher quality than another then I'm thinking you're arguing simply to be arguing.

There may have been time limitations but I'm sure Dave Rossi and Mike Okuda would've loved to have been able to produce a Klingon model that wasn't a segmented mess.

This has never been an issue and I never suggested anything of the kind, read the above post I just wrote...

RAMA

 

[jefferiestubes8]

Den of Geek has a review up
http://www.denofgeek.com/Reviews/12..._generation_the_next_level_bluray_review.html

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

What we have to look forward to in season one...

'The Last Outpost'

What color is that uniform? Fuschia and wine?

That's much closer to the actual color of the costume than it usually appeared in the broadcast version, similar to the more pronounced green tint in the TOS command costumes in TOS-R. The TNG outfits are actually a little warmer red than this, but not a lot.

 

[Tosk]

I won't argue about how obvious it is that the colors are out of whack in that Outpost shot...I'll just say I'm very glad it won't look like that on Blu-ray.

 

[Trekker4747]

The deep red looks much better than the sorta-purple.

 

[davejames]

Yeah I still can't get over how much better those early uniforms look now.

 

[Brikar99]

Yeah I still can't get over how much better those early uniforms look now.

Being able to see their texture and color better, they do seem much less 'spandex-like' in HD.

 

[free2131]

Wasn't gonna spend $20 on 3 episodes, but managed to get a copy off eBay for $5, so I'm excited to see the differences for myself.

Too bad that the upgrade couldn't have included the acting and plots in the first two seasons, though.

 

[davejames]

Being able to see their texture and color better, they do seem much less 'spandex-like' in HD.

Yeah it used to seem like there was a really dramatic difference between the two uniforms, but it was probably just the weird and inconsistent coloring the show had early on.