First time watcher of 'Emissary'...

[ReadyAndWilling]

alright, so this is my situation in relation to DS9: i've seen all of S7 and S6, portions of S5 and a couple episodes from S3 and S4. i haven't seen any episodes from S1 and S2. i've seen all of VOY, ENT and a decent portion of TNG.

i've been on this board for quite a while and it has become an important part of my life. i was reading in another thread that the the DS9 pilot is different to the others. i've seen most people say it sucks and a minority who say it's decent. i'm yet to see anyone say it's brilliant. i attribute this to the show, like most shows, being in it's infancy stage and hasn't found itself yet.

what are some things i should be trying to take notice of?

 

[Distorted Humor]

It is brilliant....

 

[Photon]

I like it.

 

[TheGodBen]

I don't know who said Emissary sucks, it seems to have a pretty good reputation around these parts. I'd give it an 8 or 9 out of 10.

As for what there is to take note of, the character dynamics should be interesting for you. You've come to know most of these characters as friends, so it should be interesting to see how some of them started out strongly disliking one another.

 

[flemm]

It doesn't suck. In fact, as far as the quality of the writing and the story are concerned, it's easily the best Trek pilot.


As an episode, it's in the very good to excellent range, but as a pilot, I do think it has its problems. It's very cerebral and high-concept at times and, while it does a solid job of introducing the characters and setting, it ends up having to spend a lot of time on Sisko's visions in the Celestial Temple, which are pretty slow and off-putting.


As an episode, it's easily in 4/5 star territory, but as a pilot I think I'd give it a significantly lower rating, maybe 2.5/5.


Part of the problem is that the writers still see DS9 as an entirely episodic show at this point, so the pilot has to resolve all the conflicts it presents: Sisko's character arc, the Cardassians' involvement, discovery of the Prophets and the gamma quadrant, etc. The end result is a pilot that has way too much material squeezed into it, which then leads to a big chunk of season 1 having nothing much to say and little sense of purpose. We end up with mostly TNG cast-off scripts until the writers figure out what they want the show to be about towards the end of season 1.


In retrospect, DS9 should have been planned with serialized elements from the beginning, which would have allowed the early plot threads to unfold more organically. The pilot could have focused solely on a more tense, action-packed depiction of the Cardassian withdrawal from Bajor. We could have seen the situation unfold from Bajoran, Cardassian and Federation points of view, etc.


Still, the writing is vintage Michael Piller, with its main flaw being that it is too ambitious and high-concept for an introductory episode.

 

[USS Intrepid]

I've never understood how anyone can say DS9's pilot sucks.

Of course, taste is largely subjective, but Emissary ticks all the quality boxes for me. Well-written, well-acted, beautiful set design. The characters and setting are, mostly, pretty compelling and it sets up it's premise very neatly. DS9 is not my favourite series, but I do believe it has the best pilot.

That said, it's not perfect either, and I'd generally agree with the points raised by flemm above.

 

[Anwar]

Emissary was the best pilot episode of any modern Trek show. It was a great introduction to Sisko and his relationship with the Prophets, and the bit where they help him come to terms with his wife's death is beautiful.

 

[TeutonicNights]

It's a masterpiece.
Normally, I envy people who still have to watch DS9 and are about to experience it for the first time.

But watching this back in the 90's while TNG was still on... is something you can't really recreate today (I guess).
This show grabbed me from scene one and never let go.
The characters, the special effects, the flashbacks, the PS cameo, the whole Bajor/Cardassia Business, the wonderful Sisko/Prophets thing. the gloomy atmosphere mixed with Trek optimsm - PERFECTION

 

[ReadyAndWilling]

It doesn't suck. In fact, as far as the quality of the writing and the story are concerned, it's easily the best Trek pilot.


As an episode, it's in the very good to excellent range, but as a pilot, I do think it has its problems. It's very cerebral and high-concept at times and, while it does a solid job of introducing the characters and setting, it ends up having to spend a lot of time on Sisko's visions in the Celestial Temple, which are pretty slow and off-putting.


As an episode, it's easily in 4/5 star territory, but as a pilot I think I'd give it a significantly lower rating, maybe 2.5/5.


Part of the problem is that the writers still see DS9 as an entirely episodic show at this point, so the pilot has to resolve all the conflicts it presents: Sisko's character arc, the Cardassians' involvement, discovery of the Prophets and the gamma quadrant, etc. The end result is a pilot that has way too much material squeezed into it, which then leads to a big chunk of season 1 having nothing much to say and little sense of purpose. We end up with mostly TNG cast-off scripts until the writers figure out what they want the show to be about towards the end of season 1.


In retrospect, DS9 should have been planned with serialized elements from the beginning, which would have allowed the early plot threads to unfold more organically. The pilot could have focused solely on a more tense, action-packed depiction of the Cardassian withdrawal from Bajor. We could have seen the situation unfold from Bajoran, Cardassian and Federation points of view, etc.


Still, the writing is vintage Michael Piller, with its main flaw being that it is too ambitious and high-concept for an introductory episode.

ok, wow, that's an informative reply. i'll make sure i watch it.

It's a masterpiece.
Normally, I envy people who still have to watch DS9 and are about to experience it for the first time.

But watching this back in the 90's while TNG was still on... is something you can't really recreate today (I guess).
This show grabbed me from scene one and never let go.
The characters, the special effects, the flashbacks, the PS cameo, the whole Bajor/Cardassia Business, the wonderful Sisko/Prophets thing. the gloomy atmosphere mixed with Trek optimsm - PERFECTION

cool bro.

i always thought seasons 5-7 were where the show was at its best, so that's all i've really seen.

do you think it's worth watching from the first episode?

 

[ReadyAndWilling]

btw when did the show begin to form those long arcs? was it just from the Dom War till the end?

 

[MacLeod]

The plot elements did come into focus during the later hald of the shows run, but in the earlier season esp S2 they did start to drop little bits of info.

 

[pimp]

It is a good episode, but I have one slight problem with it, that fact that Sisko was very rude to Picard basically I did not like it cus it was not Picard's fault it was all Locutus of Borg fault for killing his wife - star fleet commander should put his emotions to one side and respect a captain, but I guess hes human so kind of understandable, but my god the look on Picard's face

 

[Anwar]

It was deliberate, to show Sisko was pretty much a jackass in the making before the Prophets forced him to confront his trauma. The novelization made it more clear that he felt awful about the way he treated Picard.

 

[Tosk]

That scene is great and necessary for Ben's arc in the pilot. At that point, he's still angry about losing Jennifer. Whether or not Picard himself was responsible is irrelevant.

Plus, it's not like he said anything out of line. It was one of those "Not what he said but how he said it" moments.

P.S. I love Emissary. Best Trek pilot hands down.

 

[Trek Survivor]

Who on earth has said "Emissary" sucks? It's the best Trek pilot yet!!! Seriously.