Opinions about Trip

[SFRabid]

About love being the motivation of Trip on season 4, I agree more or less. I don't think it is in any way demeaning for the character, most people are motivated by love in some periods of their lives and it can be strong enough to change a person's perception of the world.
However I believe that there are occasions that show that there is much more there. One such case is Home, where he steps back and accepts T'Pol's decision. The fangirl in me wants him to go fight Koss and do everything possible to stop the marriage, but Trip has grown and does not react impulsively any more. He is hurt, but supports T'Pol -and her mother- in what is extremely important for them, he thinks about concequences.
Then, during the Vulcan arc, he leaves T'Pol and Archer behind, in grave danger and goes out too stop a war, against orders. He becomes a true leader, a person who can think a step ahead and make hard decisions. There is much more complexity and depth in Trip than just a young man in love.

I have to agree. If Trip had broken the wedding and "rescued" T'Pol from the miarrage it would have been a bit to storybook. Instead of taking the romance novel approach where love always wins I appreciate that the writers made it more like the real world. Sometimes you have to make hard decisions. He didn't take the easy way, he did what he thought was best for her family in the long run.

 

[frenchman]

that prove to me that he really loves her.

 

[Mach5]

that prove to me that he really loves her.

Hm, I must admit I'm still on the fence on this.
Remember Trip's conversation with T'Les a few minutes earlier?

"T'Pol might call off the wedding... Or worse, not call it off."
This quote suggests he chickened out, I believe. This would-be interruption of the wedding was de facto green lit by T'Les herself, he practically had her blessing (T'Mom's conscience kicked in, after all expecting a daughter to sacrifice herself for mothers career is selfish, it should be the other way around).

 

[SFRabid]

You have to remember that the other force in this is Vulcan tradition. Vulcan weddings are arranged. Choosing who to marry to them would be as wrong as an arranged marriage is to us. Their decisions are based on logic, not emotion. It was logical for her to marry Tos.

I also think the "or worse" comment showed just how much Trip loved her. It hurt to watch her get married to someone else. Asking her to go against tradition and her decision and then being rejected would break their friendship. Instead he decided to support her in her decision, no matter how painful it was. Sometimes that is what friends and lovers do.

 

[Mach5]

You have to remember that the other force in this is Vulcan tradition. Vulcan weddings are arranged. Choosing who to marry to them would be as wrong as an arranged marriage is to us. Their decisions are based on logic, not emotion. It was logical for her to marry Tos.

T'Pol was always the one who swam against the current. The very act of bringing Trip to Vulcan with her was an act of defiance, so was that kiss at the end. I don't think tradition had anything to do with her decision to marry Kos. It was always about her mother, and T'Les knew that.

And when it comes to tradition, marrying Kos was not the only option T'Pol had. She could have declared Kali'fi, and chosen any champion she wanted. Tradition even allowed her to fight Kos herself, and I think he would hardly be a match for her since she was a trained combatant (V'shar operative) and Kos was a mere scholar.

So you see, It was about T'Les and her needs from the start.

 

[SFRabid]

So you see, It was about T'Les and her needs from the start.

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on that. I don't think that she would ever consider a fight to the death as an option. She definitely would not put Trip in that situation or kill Tos just to get out of the agreement. And I thought the kiss was a great "thank you for supporting me" gesture as well as a show of love.

 

[Mach5]

So you see, It was about T'Les and her needs from the start.

I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on that. I don't think that she would ever consider a fight to the death as an option.

IIRC, it was not necessarily "to the death." Beating the crap out of Kos and forcing him to yield would be enough, I believe, and he didn't exactly strike me as someone willing to die just to fulfill a family obligation.

 

[Penguin]

There we have it. All boils down to the realtionship between Trip and T-Pol.


It is not if trip is a great engineeror a good one or anythng else. It is the relationship.

Unfortunately never resolved by the writers or TPTB, probably delibertely.

As far as home goes I have always thought it was senseless.

I still believe that the episode simply should have been t-Pol taking Trip to vulcan to get her mothers approval of Trip.

Once that hapenned then on the fire plains t-Pol could have confessed her love for trip and they could return to enterprise and it would be business as usual (as was the case in Vaoyager after Torres confessed her love for paris. the issue was dropeed from season three until the last seasn when the two married and were going tohave a child).

The love story could simply be in the background and left there having been resolved.

 

[Mach5]

There we have it. All boils down to the realtionship between Trip and T-Pol.

That's ENTERPRISE for you
(Seriously, you can't have a Trip thread without T'Pol in the mix. That's just not how it works)

Unfortunately never resolved by the writers or TPTB, probably deliberately.

Aahh, the great infamous 'middle finger conspiracy.'

I still believe that the episode simply should have been t-Pol taking Trip to vulcan to get her mothers approval of Trip.

I always believed that was one of the reasons she brought him with her. She wanted to test the waters, so to speak.

Once that happened then on the fire plains t-Pol could have confessed her love for trip and they could return to enterprise and it would be business as usual (as was the case in Voyager after Torres confessed her love for Paris. the issue was dropped from season three until the last season when the two married and were going to have a child).

I never wanted T'Pol to confess her love, at least not verbally. It just isn't the Vulcan way (TNG: "Sarek"). Sharing feelings through mating bond was more then adequate. Why say anything when you can project it telepathically?

BTW, never having seen TnT share a mind meld was beyond disappointing.

 

[SFRabid]

We need season five to wrap this up.

 

[Mach5]

We need season five to wrap this up.

Yeah, how come no one ever thought of that?

 

[commodore64]

(Seriously, you can't have a Trip thread without T'Pol in the mix. That's just not how it works)

I wish it didn't "work" that way. I'm not really sure why it does. I think Trip is more interesting than who he wanted his girlfriend to be. Granted, T'Pol was my second favorite character (although I wasn't crazy about her in parts of season 4, and no it doesn't have anything to do with Trip ... I liked T'Pol in Terra Prime for example). I guess what I'm saying is -- he's an interesting cat and deserves more to me.

About love being the motivation of Trip on season 4, I agree more or less.

Don't you think if it was a motivation that would've introduced it before season 3? (Uh, oh, did I just open up a can of -- "Didn't you see Breaking the Ice?")

You know, I was thinking last night about how some of you believe the motivation was T'Pol and I think now I understand why you're so darned angry at TATV. If your favorite character's one motivation isn't resolved, it can be frustrating. Worse, I suppose, that he died before that was ever resolved. I suppose that's worse than just your favorite character dying.

 

[Mach5]

About love being the motivation of Trip on season 4, I agree more or less.

Don't you think if it was a motivation that would've introduced it before season 3? (Uh, oh, did I just open up a can of -- "Didn't you see Breaking the Ice?")

I for one don't. When Trip first met T'Pol, she was just this hot Vulcan chick and a nuisance to him. In "Breaking the Ice" he found out that there was more to her, but he still didn't know her well enough to develop feelings.
In season 2 there was barely any TnT interaction that could define them as friends, let alone something more. It wasn't until Season 3 that they got to know each other more intimately. She helped him grieve, and he showed her that he was more than just a dumb hick. She brought him back to life, so to speak, and that's why he fell for her.

You know, I was thinking last night about how some of you believe the motivation was T'Pol and I think now I understand why you're so darned angry at TATV. If your favorite character's one motivation isn't resolved, it can be frustrating. Worse, I suppose, that he died before that was ever resolved. I suppose that's worse than just your favorite character dying.

That's one way of seeing it. The main problem with TATV is that it ignores stuff that happened in Season 4. It feels out of place, the plot is ridiculous, and Riker & Troi looking like sh#t doesn't help matters either (Even Troi's uniform was of wrong color - it was supposed to be blue, not greenish).

 

[commodore64]

She helped him grieve, and he showed her that he was more than just a dumb hick. She brought him back to life, so to speak, and that's why he fell for her.

I'm not going to debate the merits of the T/T'P relationship (restraining myself!), but I never saw Trip as just a dumb hick. He liked and did some stereotypically Southern things and had a stereotypically Southern accent (although from the wrong region), but I don't think anyone including Trip himself saw him as a dumb hick.

 

[Mach5]

She helped him grieve, and he showed her that he was more than just a dumb hick. She brought him back to life, so to speak, and that's why he fell for her.

I'm not going to debate the merits of the T/T'P relationship (restraining myself!), but I never saw Trip as just a dumb hick.

Neither did I, but Blalock did call Trip a "catfish eating honky tonk guy," and I assume T'Pol initially had similar prejudices.

 

[SFRabid]

That in itself is not a bad thing.

 

[commodore64]

I think her point was really that she didn't see T'Pol falling for Trip. I think the colorful metaphors were just slander to show the actress' upset. From Blalock's standpoint, I don't blame her. T'Pol was a great character and deserved some well-crafted stories that didn't involve romance or T&A.

 

[kissthestar]

I must've missed the honky tonk ep. Pity.

 

[Mach5]

T'Pol was a great character and deserved some well-crafted stories that didn't involve romance or T&A.

Couldn't possibly disagree more. IMO romance only enriches the character.
As for T&A, at risk of sounding immature, having someone like Blalock on the show and not utilizing her 'attributes' would be a crime against nature (Aw, who am I kidding, this is immature as immature goes, but who cares )

 

[SFRabid]

Well, there was...
1. Drug addiction.
2. Prooving one's self to those that don't trust you.
3. Loyalty to captain or loyalty to race.
4. Turning your back on tradition.

I thought she had some of the best story lines starting with The Andorian Incident.