Spoilers Andor - Season 2
- Thread starter Fuddles
- Start date
That conversation wasn't about defending Syrill, or putting his mother in her place; it was about establishing lines of demarcation, and commoditising her access to Syrill as a way of restricting how much she can disrupt their very very (obsessively) ordered lives. She wasn't negotiating on his behalf, she was saying that she will *make* him do the things his mother wants him to do, but only on Dedra's terms. Syrill gets no say in it, just like he didn't have any say in cancelling the dinner.
Any affection in that relationship is entirely one-way and very unhealthy. Dedra likes control. Dedra needs control. Of everything. All the time. She gets plenty of that at work, but since they won't let her live in her office 24/7, Syrill provides a means to scratch that itch at home too. The only thing she likes more than *having* control is *imposing* it on an unruly subject. Syrill is easy, but his mother presents a fun, if brief challenge.
Still don't buy it? Go rewatch her scenes with Bix in season 1. She's positively giddy at the prospect of breaking someone.
Good points
So far as I'm aware; the closest they've gotten before now is in the novel 'Bloodline' that covers Leia's connection to Vader being outed as a means of discrediting her whole political career as a New Republic Senator. It's not even a depiction or anything, but a discussion between two of her aids grappling with the idea that Amidala and Vader could ever have had a relationship, with one briefly questioning whether Anakin "assaulted" Padme, before quickly dismissing it.
(Before anyone raises the point: yes he did actually assault her, but not like *that*, and the implication of their conversation is quite clearly in reference to how Luke & Leia were conceived.)
As for how 'Andor' handles it: I tend to agree with the sentiment that this is new (and potentially fraught) ground for Star Wars, but this is a show for grow-ups, not kids. What was depicted was realistic in terms of Bix's PTSD, and the many, many ways authoritarians have, do, and continue to abuse their power over people in vulnerable positions. Also, it shows the kind of people that are attracted to that kind of power. It's not just megalomaniacs like Palpatine, Tarkin, and Krennic, or sadists like Dedra. There are all kinds and stripes.
It wasn't in any way gratuitous, or done simply for shock value. It was creepy and disturbing, and vital to the story. Bix is not OK. She will likely not be OK for quite some time to come, if ever.
Yeah the more I really think about it Star Wars is very violent depiction. Even though said scene are borderline moderate in terms of how the violence is depicted. George Lucas and others has often said it’s a children’s film. Well maybe the merchandise is for children but it has always had adult themes.
Was a bit of a shock they went with an attempted rape but now I’ve thought upon it, it’s not a stretch that could happen in this fictional universe..
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I asked in another forum whether the Imperial officer would've been punished or rewarded by the Empire if he was caught forcibly having his way with Bix. While commenters claimed that someone like Vader would've punished the officer, I mentioned that in Bloodline people were already thinking of Vader as a r***** and he obviously endorsed slavery, so for all we know Vader and Palpatine would've rewarded the officer. They are evil, after all.
I think it more likely that nobody would really care, so long as they're vaguely discrete about it, and discerning in their targets. I mean there's a reason he chose an undocumented worker, isolated out in the middle of nowhere. Tarkin would likely kill him for it, but not out of concern for the victim, but out of disgust for the sheer lack of military discipline and decorum. And let's be clear; he'd also imprison and/or execute Bix too just for being undocumented . . . or for being behind on quotas . . . or some other pretext.
Like I said; there's all kinds of flavours of evil, and they're almost all attracted to power.
Perhaps. But Vader is a kiddy killing murderer. He cuts down his enemies with no remorse, see the scene in rouge one.
Would say they be sharing a special place in hell together. But his “redemption“ by not killing his son, then murdering his so called [palpatine] friend and mentor got him in Jedi heaven lol
To be fair the Ahsoka show showed his ghost reliving clone wars battles so who knows
The scope of the intimacy coordinator's job has greatly expanded in recent years in light of things like Me Too and other things to be responsible for scenes of simple hugging, kissing laying in bed together (even if fully clothed and no suggestion of anything happening) or even just holding hands. It is believed that within the next five years all shows and movies will have an intimacy coordinator as a matter of default, becuase that is the reality of the world we live in. For example, the current season of Doctor Who has an intimacy coordinator, and there's nothing sexually suggestive at all in that show.
The Imperial military undoubtedly has a rule on the official record forbidding sexual assault, though how well it's enforced is probably contingent on the commanders overseeing the individuals who commit the acts. I doubt it's ever rewarded, not even from people like Palpatine or Vader, but when it is punished, it's probably due to factors like the officer is being punished for negligence, IE, if the rest of the team were attacked while he was assaulting a victim and he becomes the only survivor because he was secluded elsewhere assaulting someone, he's going to be punished for dereliction of duty, not sexual assault. Unless of course someone really has an axe to grind with this particular officer, then he will also be charged with sexual assault in addition to dereliction of duty as a means of really making sure he gets maximum punishment possible. Plus in many cases in the Imperial military, I would imagine when one is punished for anything, it's not so much the deed they're being punished for as it is getting caught.
You're trying to apply a moralistic Abrahamic cosmological viewpoint to what is explicitly based on a Buddhist concept of spiritual enlightenment. I suggest you go read up on Aṅgulimāla, and you might have a better grasp of the subject.
That's not at all what was happening. Those scenes weren't about Anakin's state of being, but Ahsoka's state of mind and spirit. Contrary to what some claim, that wasn't Anakin "going dark", that was Anakin showing Ahsoka a reflection of her own fears, anger, and hatred. Just like Luke in the cave, Yoda on the dark island within the wellspring. It's about her facing her fears and moving beyond them.
Gnosticism posits that good and evil are basically on the same side, beings called archons who pose as gods and demons, feeding off people's suffering from their play-acted conflict, with people having no afterlife but continously being shuttled from one reincarnation to another to fuel the suffering production that the archons feed off of. All ghosts, etc. are basically archons posing as deceased people, proclaiming false stories about a happy afterlife so that people after death willingly step into the light (in reality a reincarnation chamber), with the actual deceased the archons pose us in actuality long since been shuttled off to the next reincarnated life.
If Star Wars EVER went into this this would shake up the franchise in unspeakable ways. We never got an answer for who exactly the Whills were, but if they were actually Star Wars' version of archons then...
Well, you know, I'm getting close to 60, and I'm watching Andor.
I'm not looking for a kids' show. I'm so glad it's not a kids' show. The original Star Wars was rated PG. Star Wars has never been considered a franchise that is completely devoid of material that some parents might have concerns about exposing their children to.
Star Trek had a somewhat similar attempted rape scene, in "The Day of the Dove."
There are far worse ways for children to become aware of material supposedly suitable only for adults.
Considering the depiction of dismemberment, murder, and genocide acceptable for children, and let's toss in an epic-scale antidemocratic coup d'état for good measure, but when one bad guys tries to rape a good person that's right out, that's an unhealthy double-standard.
I'm not looking for a kids' show. I'm so glad it's not a kids' show. The original Star Wars was rated PG. Star Wars has never been considered a franchise that is completely devoid of material that some parents might have concerns about exposing their children to.
Star Trek had a somewhat similar attempted rape scene, in "The Day of the Dove."
There are far worse ways for children to become aware of material supposedly suitable only for adults.
Considering the depiction of dismemberment, murder, and genocide acceptable for children, and let's toss in an epic-scale antidemocratic coup d'état for good measure, but when one bad guys tries to rape a good person that's right out, that's an unhealthy double-standard.
To some extent, the problem is there's the risk hormonal and immature young people might get excited by that sort of scene and their biology warped into wanting to commit such crimes themselves (as people are born wanting to reproduce but not necessarily kill, and that genetic desire can be distorted by external factors into criminal desire).
I can't find the link but there was a convicted rapist who blamed watching Return of the Jedi in his youth for his life of crime as he said that once he saw Leia in that outfit while he was watching as a teen he was never the same again, or something like that. Now admittedly this is an extreme example but still...
Lulz.
I don't see anything in Lucas's ideas that even remotely lines up with this. So far as I understand it, his ideas for the Whills are mostly based in microbiology than pure mysticism.
The "ghosts" in Star Wars aren't really ghosts at all; that's just a shorthand for how they appear to us the audience. They are consciousnesses that have achieved enlightenment and preserved their individuality when they became one with the cosmic force at the point of physical death. They exist outside of space and time.
There are no "demons" in Star Wars cosmology. No evil Sith ghosts. At best, only powerless illusions; mere shadows, impotently clinging to the physical realm for fear of oblivion. Indeed, Lucas canned a whole sub-plot from the Mortis arc because of this. The dark side can never be the path to enlightenment or immortality. The dark side gives nothing, only takes and consumes. It's in it's very nature.
Oh I agree that Lucas didn't have this in mind. But if Rian Johnson had gone this route instead of... whatever he was doing in the Last Jedi, my opinion of the film would've improved immensely. If Luke said the Jedi needed to end because the light and the dark are on the same side causing the problems the light claims to fix (banning Jedi from getting from sex and marriage turned Anakin into a hormonally starved psycho, such as how real life religious bans on even legal prostitution destroys the lives of some men who struggle to get dates and marry out of desperation into situations that make Mon/Perrin look like paradise in comparison, which I've witnessed personally), we'd be taking Star Wars in a new direction and tackling some serious real life issues as well.
Star Wars’ family-friendliness has always just been a matter of editing. We say it’s okay for eight-year-olds — even primarily for eight-year-olds, such as I was when the original movie hooked me — but only because we don’t directly see the thousands or millions of people getting turned into charred corpses and body parts, but it happens (behind the editing) in pretty much every film.
I think we... might actually see this after the Ghorman massacre. After episode 3 of this season it's clear Gilroy isn't pulling punches this time around.
