Why the hate for Alex Kurtzman?

[Lord Garth]

It's safe to say Elon Musk is at least a casual Star Trek fan from all the references to the franchise he's dropped over the years (someone should try and ask him TOS vs TNG). There's an admittedly small chance that something NuTrek related could go viral on X that then rises to his attention level. CBS spent how much money on this? Wait, there's video of Alex Kurtzman saying he wants to use Star Trek as a platform for political messaging, and another video from PRODIGY season 1.0 Blu-ray talking about wanting to indoctrinate children into certain values?

The 2004 Janet Jackson Super Bowl half time incident held up a CBS sale of some TV stations for almost two years. Skydance will eventually need to get FCC clearance to buy the CBS TV stations and potentially the FTC over the studio. Some CBS executive just might be going "you know, Elon is a Star Trek fan, so....."

Nothing TV-sized will catch Elon Musk's attention. I'd be shocked. Movie-sized, maybe. My main concern is those following whatever mandates he or the Trump Administration impose. I'm hoping Star Trek is clever and works its way around them. But anything like, "We've outgrown the use for money!" I don't expect a phrase like that to be uttered during these next four years.

I assume Starfleet Academy will bring up the Federation and Starfleet's values and teach them to cadets. So that right there will be a good way to see how things are dealt with.

If the Prequel Trek Movie gets made, if it's set close to our time then I think they'll have to address the direction the world has been and will be going in. At least to some degree. Especially since it's a Post-WWIII Society.

 

[Campe]

My wife owns a Tesla and I still say: Fuck Musk.

 

[Danja]

Nothing TV-sized will catch Elon Musk's attention. I'd be shocked. Movie-sized, maybe. My main concern is those following whatever mandates he or the Trump Administration impose. I'm hoping Star Trek is clever and works its way around them. But anything like, "We've outgrown the use for money!" I don't expect a phrase like that to be uttered during these next four years.

Trek has had a post-scarcity ethos for decades. Nothing new there.

 

[The Wormhole]

I think that part of Trek has always been vastly overblown. Look at “The Cage”. Very, very white. NBC had to push diversity, advertisers wanted diversified programming because minorities were becoming more affluent and had money to spend.

Even in the 1960s, there were TV shows with black actors in far more prominent roles than TOS did. Even the claim that Plato's Stepchildren was TV's first interracial kiss is wrong, it isn't even the first interracial kiss on TOS!

 

[nightwind1]

And thus this thread was a pretty terrible idea. I have said my piece, and am departing.

This isn't a starbase. You don't need to announce your departure.

 

[I am not Spock]

I've been mostly pretty happy with Kurtzman era. Don't get the hate.
I remember some segments of the fandom back in the day railing against Berman and Braga too.
Some of these same fans are now saying they miss the days of Ent! How soon they forget

 

[StarMan]

I can't speak to those looking back on ENT and VOY with rose-tinted glasses. They both had their moments but were more miss than hit.

As for Berman / Braga comparisons, you'd better believe they were savaged back in the early days of the forum.

Why the hate? He's the guy at the top, and the majority of Trek produced during his tenure has been fairly rubbish. Fine by me if you don't agree, but those that do are not an insignificant percentage of fandom - sorry.

 

[fireproof78]

The man doesn't deserve hate or wishes that his house has burned down or accusations that he hates Star Trek.

 

[CoveTom]

Nothing TV-sized will catch Elon Musk's attention. I'd be shocked. Movie-sized, maybe. My main concern is those following whatever mandates he or the Trump Administration impose. I'm hoping Star Trek is clever and works its way around them. But anything like, "We've outgrown the use for money!" I don't expect a phrase like that to be uttered during these next four years.

I assume Starfleet Academy will bring up the Federation and Starfleet's values and teach them to cadets. So that right there will be a good way to see how things are dealt with.

If the Prequel Trek Movie gets made, if it's set close to our time then I think they'll have to address the direction the world has been and will be going in. At least to some degree. Especially since it's a Post-WWIII Society.

Y'know, TNG started during the Reagan administration. In fact, Reagan later visited the TNG sets. There is nothing coming in the next four years from the White House that is going to restrict Trek's ability to say whatever it wants to say. The main problem, as I see it, is that the current era of Trek really doesn't want to say much.

 

[Lord Garth]

Y'know, TNG started during the Reagan administration. In fact, Reagan later visited the TNG sets. There is nothing coming in the next four years from the White House that is going to restrict Trek's ability to say whatever it wants to say. The main problem, as I see it, is that the current era of Trek really doesn't want to say much.

I was a kid but from what I've seen from old clips: neither did the news programs look like they were bending to Reagan the way Joe Scarborough and Mika Brezinski bended to Trump. Or even on YouTube, the way Cenk Uyger and Ana Kasperian have bended to Trump. At most, news stations in the Reagan Era were neutral.

Trump wants the news to agree with him and be in his favor. It's in his own tweets. Xs. Whatever they want to call themselves. (link)

If he got his way and the news became (more) submissive to him, how far behind can entertainment be? It would be great if that doesn't happen. But I consider it a non-zero possibility.

The main problem, as I see it, is that the current era of Trek really doesn't want to say much.

Not that this isn't true, but it's a potential problem on a larger scale than just Star Trek, which I guess would take things beyond the scope of this discussion. I've said what I wanted to say about it.

I hope I'm wrong. This is one time I don't want to be right. Back to Trek.

I'd see people complaining all the time about Discovery etc. being "Woke!" but really all they had was diversity. The vast majority of the time, the characters didn't say anything about it. It was just there. So, the negative reactions have been more a reflection on the people (over-)reacting. Not necessarily because of anything that was actually said on DSC or the other shows. So that's why I agree about them not saying much.

The MAGA parallel with the Klingons was extremely forced. And in PIC, I agree that ICE could've been handled better.

 

[fireproof78]

see people complaining all the time about Discovery etc. being "Woke!" but really all they had was diversity. The vast majority of the time, the characters didn't say anything about it. It was just there. So, the negative reactions have been more a reflection on the people (over-)reacting. Not necessarily because of anything that was actually said on DSC or the other shows. So that's why I agree about them not saying much.

This.


There is nothing in Discovery's messaging that could offend a person unless they are looking to be offended. It is purely a diverse cast, one that I happened to enjoy.

Full disclosure, I lean more conservative than others here.

 

[ScottJ85]

My wife owns a Tesla and I still say: Fuck Musk.

Hell, I own a Tesla and I say fuck that guy.

 

[BK613]

Hell, I own a Tesla and I say fuck that guy.

So, do you have the bumper sticker that says 'I bought this before we knew Elon was crazy'?

 

[ScottJ85]

So, do you have the bumper sticker that says 'I bought this before we knew Elon was crazy'?

Nah, it's a car, not a political statement.

 

[publiusr]

It’s a good car…Elon might steer the Donald from the snake handlers— at least I hope so.

 

[BK613]

Nah, it's a car, not a political statement.

It's the 2020s, where everything is about politics.
Well, except for politics...that's still about personal power.

 

[Tomalak]

I think that Alex Kurtzman has done a pretty good job at shepherding the franchise during the streaming era.

Diversity has obviously been key for him, not just in terms of casting, but the shows themselves. Obviously they all have the Star Trek ethos, but the spread has been good and there's usually something for everyone. I haven't enjoyed them all equally, but I've appreciated each of them.

I don't have any illusions that it's CBS/Paramount who hold the real power, and they're guided by their metrics and streaming analytics telling them exactly what kind of show to make to appeal to target demographics.

But within that, Kurtzman seems to be hiring good writers and showrunners who put their stamp on the series. He's also not afraid to try new things: who would have thought a comedy cartoon would have become one of the most popular series in years?

Entrenched fanbases are often highly resistant to change, so of course he's going to be the target for criticism just as Rick Berman was. Plenty of fans will no doubt hate Starfleet Academy and make sure everyone knows it. I hope it will also bring in new fans. Star Trek desperately needs new blood.

The revived Star Trek is heading into it's eighth year now, and will almost certainly reach ten years. That's pretty good going.

 

[CoveTom]

The revived Star Trek is heading into it's eighth year now, and will almost certainly reach ten years. That's pretty good going.

Agreed.

However, if there is one thing we learned from the Berman era, is is that you don't want to overstay your welcome. I think ten years is just about right that, even if the franchise is successful, it's time to hand the reigns over to another person. Imagine if Berman had stepped away around 1997, right after the success of First Contact. He would have left at the height of his era's popularity and we could have perhaps avoided the stagnation that followed in his later years.

 

[BillJ]

Agreed.

However, if there is one thing we learned from the Berman era, is is that you don't want to overstay your welcome. I think ten years is just about right that, even if the franchise is successful, it's time to hand the reigns over to another person. Imagine if Berman had stepped away around 1997, right after the success of First Contact. He would have left at the height of his era's popularity and we could have perhaps avoided the stagnation that followed in his later years.

Unfortunately, if he had walked away in 1997, he wouldn't have collected the checks from 1998-2005. Money drives everything and very few walk away from it.

 

[fireproof78]

Who here is going to walk away from being paid?