Spoilers The Boys Season 4 Discussion ( Spoilers)

[DarKush]

She is a Supe and a very prominent one so it doesn't seem that strange to me that she gets easier access to a liberal presidential candidate, they're on the same side so to speak. You can see this in real world too where politicians gladly accept the support of popular entertainers when it's campaign time.

In the real-world politicians do cozy up to celebrities, but they also tend to avoid controversial ones. Within the world of The Boys, we already saw Neuman get squeamish when Homelander showed up at the Singer-Neuman party. Homelander as head of Vought, is more of the establishment than Starlight and her Starlighters seem to be, so Singer is putting himself more out on a limb being so cavalier about letting Starlight visit him.

Her beating up Firecracker just happened moments ago, the fallout is coming for sure which is why Singer dropped her immediately like a hot potatoe ( the only unrealistic part is that he made the call himself, it should have been a no name, low level staffer that informed her putting as much distance between her and Singer as possible).

The fallout might happen, but nothing stopped Firecracker from pressing charges, or even the police from intervening.

I don't think it's that far fetched. As they said they were young teenagers back then and easily influenced. We have seen in past seasons that Starlights mom is the typical beauty queen mom, who wants fame and money by pushing their kid as a product and not a human being. We can chalk up the last part to the writing process itself and that they needed something truly bad to pin on Starlight, which wasn't needed in past seasons.

It seems this season is all about everybody's past mistakes and skeletons in the closet surfacing and they have to deal with it.

I do get that this season is muddying everyone up, I just wish they had done it in a way that felt more organic to Starlight's character as we've seen her. Granted we haven't seen everything about her, and people have many facets and contradictions, but this rumor spreading just felt more like her mother than her.

This was my first thought too - fingerprints and strands of hair is one thing but dropping a log is akin to just leaving your ID on the counter to spare the lab the DNA analysis ( and you can bet your ass Homelander would force everyone at Vought to provide a DNA sample to find out who he needs to kill). If this is without consequence then it's sloppy writing but it made for a funny scene as it's what i expect Ashley to do in her situation.

I wonder if Sister Sage will get involved here, and that way Ashley will be indebted to her. And perhaps A-Train will mellow on her a bit. I hope we get to see what happened in Sage's past to make A-Train dislike her so much.

Concerning A-Train it's been building up slowly that he's having doubts and the events of last season pushed him quite a bit into that theory. His brother dropping the hard truth in front of his sons/his nephews and humiliating him in front of close family might have been quite a kick to the behind as to what he does and represents.
It was still massively dangerous because it could have been easily Homelander himself instead of Ashley that surprised him, i don't think he did thorough recon to find out where Homelander is before breaking into his private quarters ( that oddly seem to be readily accessible by anyone).

A-Train's story has been building up over the seasons. Him saving Hughie last episode was fine by me, as was him getting the evidence to exonerate the men accused of killing Homelander's acolytes. However, stealing V from Homelander's apartment is too big of an ask for someone with such a finely honed sense of self-preservation as A-Train has. I don't think he would be that far along yet in his redemption arc to even for Hughie and his guilt over killing Hughie's girlfriend. I was expecting A-Train would run into Ryan and not Ashley.

 

[TedShatner10]

I do get that this season is muddying everyone up, I just wish they had done it in a way that felt more organic to Starlight's character as we've seen her. Granted we haven't seen everything about her, and people have many facets and contradictions, but this rumor spreading just felt more like her mother than her.

In all likelihood, Starlight's pretty gruesome mother must've put her up to ruining Firecracker's reputation...

 

[FPAlpha]

The fallout might happen, but nothing stopped Firecracker from pressing charges, or even the police from intervening.

Dude, it literally just happened. Firecracker is perhaps still lying on the floor bleeding by the end of the episode. Give it a little time, this will have consequences starting with the next episode.

In all likelihood, Starlight's pretty gruesome mother must've put her up to ruining Firecracker's reputation...

I think that's a given the way the mother was presented in previous seasons. Also at 13 young teenagers are very easy to influence and can be pretty mean without thinking twice about it. As they get older some, hopefully most, wise up and regret past actions but by that point damage is done. Teenage years can be very rough for some people, so much that some scars carry over to adult life and form entire characters and psychological problems.

 

[DarKush]

Dude, it literally just happened. Firecracker is perhaps still lying on the floor bleeding by the end of the episode. Give it a little time, this will have consequences starting with the next episode.



I think that's a given the way the mother was presented in previous seasons. Also at 13 young teenagers are very easy to influence and can be pretty mean without thinking twice about it. As they get older some, hopefully most, wise up and regret past actions but by that point damage is done. Teenage years can be very rough for some people, so much that some scars carry over to adult life and form entire characters and psychological problems.

Annie had time to talk to the president after beating down Firecracker for the world to see. I think a quicker, stronger, and legal response could've happened. That said, maybe Firecracker held off if she had found out, or was told about the carnage in her dressing room.

 

[TedShatner10]

I think that's a given the way the mother was presented in previous seasons. Also at 13 young teenagers are very easy to influence and can be pretty mean without thinking twice about it. As they get older some, hopefully most, wise up and regret past actions but by that point damage is done. Teenage years can be very rough for some people, so much that some scars carry over to adult life and form entire characters and psychological problems.

Thing is Starlight mainly grew up past her teenaged mindset and became more empaphic/mature, while the sociopathic Homelander and narcissistic Firecracker never fucking did....

 

[Commander Troi]

Jesus, I knew they screwed Homelander up, but I didn't expect that they brought in expert psychiatrists to *really* screw him up as a means of control! It's no wonder he's nuts.

Poor Frenchie. Having a horrible past like that means sometimes it comes back to bite you in the ass.

I still want to see more about this Shining Light cult Kimiko was in.

I was so proud of Hughie for not dosing his dad. Did his mom pick his pocket and give it? I guess so. Why? What has she been doing for these decades anyway?

I will never get the horror of Firecracker and Deep singing "Up Where We Belong" out of my head.

Of all the blood and horror, what actually made me angry was Firecracker using an abortion against Annie. When she said how she'll now have to relive that every time they ask her about it... Oh, and Firecracker's casual racism.

 

[FreezeC77]

This week's had some pretty good one-liners. Like Annie telling Singer that running ads during CSI Vegas is likely a hit among the "left the TV on because we're dead demographic." Or A-Train describing MM as "the talking goatee with gold chains."

I liked that they said Jon Voight was there for the Vought truther broadcast lol... Kevin Sorbo and Scott Baio musta been running late

 

[FreezeC77]

Jesus, I knew they screwed Homelander up, but I didn't expect that they brought in expert psychiatrists to *really* screw him up as a means of control! It's no wonder he's nuts.

Poor Frenchie. Having a horrible past like that means sometimes it comes back to bite you in the ass.

I still want to see more about this Shining Light cult Kimiko was in.

I was so proud of Hughie for not dosing his dad. Did his mom pick his pocket and give it? I guess so. Why? What has she been doing for these decades anyway?

I will never get the horror of Firecracker and Deep singing "Up Where We Belong" out of my head.

Of all the blood and horror, what actually made me angry was Firecracker using an abortion against Annie. When she said how she'll now have to relive that every time they ask her about it... Oh, and Firecracker's casual racism.

It looked like Hughie put the vial of compound V into his pocket which his Mom saw him putting something into his pocket. Then for some unknown reason he takes that jacket off and leaves it WITH the vial unattended in the room.

I think the question is how did she know what it was and how much to administer and made me wonder if the Vought "Mary Kay" knockoff she did was actually a rouse and she had used it as cover to get into homes and either with parental approval or without, to administer it to children.

 

[Commander Troi]

I think the question is how did she know what it was and how much to administer and made me wonder if the Vought "Mary Kay" knockoff she did was actually a ruse and she had used it as cover to get into homes and either with parental approval or without, to administer it to children.

Ooh! Good catch!

 

[TedShatner10]

Jesus, I knew they screwed Homelander up, but I didn't expect that they brought in expert psychiatrists to *really* screw him up as a means of control! It's no wonder he's nuts.

I'd imagine at Homelander's birth (which caused numerous deaths and injuries) I wouldn't be surprised that a young Black Noir was present to eventually help restrain an infant Homelander (and that Vought's dream team of psychologists "tamed" Homelander with Mindstorm's help).

 

[JirinPanthosa]

I gave up on The Boys after a few episodes because I thought all the stuff like a tiny man jumping into a woman's crotch was a bit too puerile. But now all the bigots are throwing such a tantrum over gay stuff I think I'm going to give it another chance just to annoy them.

 

[Commander Troi]

It often is puerile, but the show also has alot to say about big corporations, celebrity, media, and politics.

 

[The Wormhole]

I wouldn't be surprised that a young Black Noir was present to eventually help restrain an infant Homelander (and that Vought's dream team of psychologists "tamed" Homelander with Mindstorm's help).

Noir didn't know about Homelander until Edgar told him about a child Vought wanted to replace Soldier Boy with as a means of convincing Noir to get the team to turn on Soldier Boy.

 

[TedShatner10]

Noir didn't know about Homelander until Edgar told him about a child Vought wanted to replace Soldier Boy with as a means of convincing Noir to get the team to turn on Soldier Boy.

Oh yeah, he wasn't clued in when Homelander was already born, but considering Vought wanted a superior superhuman to Soldier Boy, I wouldn't be surprised Vought had 'supes on standby to try and contain a newborn Homelander (when he was so destructive and dangerous at birth, and Vought were semi-competent enough to somehow mentally & emotionally get under the skin of a young but feral Homelander).

 

[Lakenheath 72]

Rethinking over the episode, I have two thoughts.
a. Is that really Hughie's mother? Vought could have hired a person from within the company, give her a credible sounding background, and have her do missions for the company. Considering the many shenanigans that company has done over the years, I think Hughie should have been suspicious if suddenly his mother appeared from nowhere and made claims like she did. It appears that at no time did he do a check on her backstory.
b. What happened in the laboratory? I would think Barbara would be covered in blood, yet she had no blood on her. Did Homelander escort her out of the bad room, brought the rest of the staff into the bad room, killed them, and then brought her back in, sealing the door?

The medication that Firecracker is prescribed is real and is used for gastrointestinal issues.

And, it looks like Kimiko has abandoned her efforts at speaking. She dumped all the speech therapy books into the trash can.

 

[TedShatner10]

b. What happened in the laboratory? I would think Barbara would be covered in blood, yet she had no blood on her. Did Homelander escort her out of the bad room, brought the rest of the staff into the bad room, killed them, and then brought her back in, sealing the door?

He may have killed them all mercifully quick with neck snaps (a glimmer of decency from Homelander; young lab hands not involved with his supposed upbringing), then more carefully "decorated" the chamber with their limbs and innards (while emotionally unloading on a horrified Barbara). I'm a bit puzzled how a semi-retired Barbara knew Homelander was in the lab and rushed there within perhaps minutes (perhaps the Vought guards topside were lowkey threatened by Homelander to "take the day off", knew where he was going on the Vought blacksite, and seen him in one of his funny moods, then called Barbara).

 

[CaptainWacky]

Rethinking over the episode, I have two thoughts.
a. Is that really Hughie's mother? Vought could have hired a person from within the company, give her a credible sounding background, and have her do missions for the company. Considering the many shenanigans that company has done over the years, I think Hughie should have been suspicious if suddenly his mother appeared from nowhere and made claims like she did. It appears that at no time did he do a check on her backstory.

Didn't he recognise her as soon as he saw her?

 

[Starkers]

(we even see nightmarish flashes of his birth mother in fear/agony, who is likely his biological mother and not a surrogate, due to her similar looks).

I thought those flashbacks were to a young Homelander in the oven as a child? Don't they also say they paid some random woman to carry the baby?

Man this show continues to be wonderfully fucked up, and they really do seem to be trying to out gross themselves week on week!

I think even since S1 I've had the feeling that either A-Train or Deep was going to get some kind of redemption arc, and it was always more likely with A-Train. Would Hughie really have forgiven him quite that easily? I'm not sure.

What the hell is living inside Butcher then? Presumably he's got super powers again given what he presumably did to stretch powered priest?

Obviously he's done some terrible things in his past but I can't help feeling for Frenchie. I was begging Annie not to do what I knew she was gonna do in beating the crap out of Firecracker (seriously does FC have no powers beyond some sparks?)

The Sage/Deep/Lobotomy sex game was...I was gonna say fucked up but obviously everything in this show is!!

The idea that they physically tormented young HL is bad enough, that they psychologically twisted him to make him easier to control makes it worse. It's hard to excuse him but given the number they did on his as a child it's no wonder he's messed up. Homelander's midlife crisis is nicely done as well, especially the way he collects his grey pubes

I definitely need to find out about Mother's Milk's new die/exercise plan!

 

[The Wormhole]

The bit about some random woman being paid to be a surrogate for baby Homelander, who then died during the rather violent birthing process has me a bit confused. Back in S3 when we had the episode about Homelander's birthday, Homelander said he doesn't actually have a birthday because he was a test tube baby and that Vought's marketing people just chose some random day to be celebrated as his birthday. But if Homelander was in fact carried by a woman for presumably nine months (or close enough to) and was, let's politely say, removed from her, wouldn't the day that occurred on in fact be Homelander's birthday? Meaning he does in fact have a birthday?

I guess it's still possible Vought's marketing people could have still selected another date for whatever reason, the actual birthday is too close to another holiday and they didn't want the celebration of the birth of the greatest superhero to overshadow it or whatever. Of course, given when Homelander was talking about the contradiction of his birthday, he was comparing it to how Christmas being celebrated on December 25 had more to do with the Church appropriating pre-existing solstice festivals rather than December 25 being the actual birth of Jesus. I guess I shouldn't be too shocked Homelander would try to twist facts around to compare himself to Jesus.

 

[Aragorn]

What the hell is living inside Butcher then? Presumably he's got super powers again given what he presumably did to stretch powered priest?

Some people are speculating that the tumor got superpowers.