The Dog of War issue 1 is very good!
DS9 30th Anniversary
- Thread starter DS9forever
- Start date
Yes I am not a dog person, but the story is quite good.
The Sisko autobiography is out soon!
Here's a picture of Cadet Sisko made for the book
https://twitter.com/DAttico/status/1724431854869049522
https://twitter.com/DAttico/status/1724431854869049522
Would Sisko have attended the Academy that far back that he'd be wearing a monster maroon? Memory Alpha says he was born in 2332 (they cite three episodes to back that claim up). Assuming he was 18 when he joined the Academy, that would be 2350. MA also states Starfleet switched from the monster maroons to the early TNG jumpsuits in 2350. Which admittedly could be speculation on their part, but reasonable speculation. The latest we saw a monster maroon was 2348 in the hologram message Jack Crusher left for Wesley, as seen in TNG Family. While we know they switched to the early TNG jumpsuits by 2353, as we see Picard wearing one when he's informing Beverly Crusher of Jack's death in TNG Violations.
At the very least, even if we entertain Starfleet might have still been using the monster maroons in 2350, then they should be using the TNG badge, as that's what Jack had on in Family. So Sisko wearing the TOS movie era badge in that picture is definitely an error.
At the very least, even if we entertain Starfleet might have still been using the monster maroons in 2350, then they should be using the TNG badge, as that's what Jack had on in Family. So Sisko wearing the TOS movie era badge in that picture is definitely an error.
I love Trek fans' attention to detail!
Admittedly, my first thought was also along the lines of "was Sisko that old?"
Since costuming is an interest of mine, I'd also make these further observations:
- Even if he was still a cadet in the monster maroon era, he probably should have worn the cadet/enlisted jumpsuit instead of the officers' uniform.
- Even if they had phased out the jumpsuit and everyone wore the maroon jacket, the strap colour should have been red.
- Even if they got rid of the red colour division and cadets now wore the same colours as regular service members, he should probably be wearing the undershirtless version, as Jack Crusher did in "Family" and Rachel Garrett and crew did in "Yesterday's Enterprise", rather than the undershirt with the small collar, like Picard and friends wore in "Tapestry". (Even though I personally don't like the undershirtless look for them!)
Looking forward to reading the book when it comes out!
Incidentally, where did the term "monster maroon" come from for the TWOK uniforms?
IIRC, the original intent with TWOK was that cadets did wear an officers uniform, but with red for their department color on their undershirt and shoulder epaulet, as indicated with Saavik's uniform in that movie, with the jumpsuits just for enlisted. Indeed, the divide we see with black collars and red collars was meant to represent whether one was still in training (they wore red collars) or if they were qualified personnel (black collar). Yes, over the years this got ignored/forgotten to the point we ended up with Cadet Picard wearing a jumpsuit in Nemesis.
Regardless, since Sisko has a white undershirt and shoulder epaulet in that photo, that would also be an error as they should be red.
Ah well, the other autobiographies certainly had errors in their photo inserts, and in the end continuity errors have become a proud Star Trek tradition and I think some of us might actually be disappointed if there wasn't something for us to nitpick in our latest Trek show/movie/novel/comic/whatever.
Honestly, I think I picked that term up around here and by now it's just stuck with me.
Maybe it’s his graduation photo and Starfleet hadn’t updated their dress uniforms yet? We saw the Starfleet crew at Worf and Jadzia’s wedding in the same style they’d been using through TNG, and then Insurrection provided a new dress uniform design.
Same here… as with most of my fandom-related terms, I picked it up from this place. No idea where it came from originally.
I tried Googling it, and I found this blog post that claims it was from the fact that the uniforms were “very hard to put together”, but I have no idea if that’s correct or not.
Getting even further afield, the opening cutscene for the Starfleet Academy video game suggests the officer uniforms were used as dress uniforms by cadets, wearing proper division colors but no rank insignia or badges.
On a slightly different tangent, even though the current IDW Star Trek comic title isn't exclusive to DS9, Sisko (returned from the wormhole) is the lead. While DS9 has only appeared in a couple of issues, I'm using this to get my "some kind of DS9" fix for now. It's interesting because it's a different take on Sisko's return than the Pocket books took. Was a big fan of those. But just from good, fun story telling with Sisko at the center (and in the center seat) it's plenty fun for me.
I don't think I'd seen that before! Suddenly the picture goes from "error" to "deep cut"!
This is the kind of question I live for.
Poking around the Internet Archive, the oldest reference I can find is in a 1999 set of "dress uniform guidelines" (link goes to a PDF on the Internet Archive) from the "Starfleet Marine Corps," which is a part of STARFLEET, the International Star Trek Fan Association. If you poke around their current website, you'll see they also have the "monster black," which is their Marine equivalent.
I would guess it originated with STARFEET because the next-oldest reference I can find is from a 2002 piece of fan fiction (link goes to a PDF on the Internet Archive again; also, terrible sex scene) which is from the USS Avenger club of New Brunswick, NJ, which is a chapter of STARFLEET. So perhaps it originated with them and spread outward?
Thanks for the research. Although even if that explains where it came from, I'm still puzzled by the why. Why "monster?" I mean, I'm no fan of the TWOK uniforms, which are too retro and militaristic and look like they should only be dress uniforms instead of everyday duty wear (which should've been just the underlying turtleneck with an insignia pin), but "monster" seems excessive even to me. Could it be that they're called that because they're heavy and uncomfortable to wear? Although I don't know if they are.
I'm sure they are heavy and uncomfortable; I don't see how they couldn't be. And nicknaming them after how they feel to wear seems pretty likely in a costumer-focused community.
That makes a great deal of sense. They're probably the most elaborate Starfleet uniforms, with the most layers and the most frippery.
Yeah, my biggest complaint of the monster maroons as a uniform has always been that they strike me as the kind of outfit that might work as a dress uniform, but just seems awkward as a standard duty uniform. Like the rank insignia just don’t seem like they’re very intuitive at a glance, and the division coloring seems barely discernible most of the time.
Though I will say that “monster maroon” appeals as a name for them for me mostly due to alliteration.
Though I will say that “monster maroon” appeals as a name for them for me mostly due to alliteration.
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