Have ya met Star Trek?
Spoilers Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 2x01 - "The Broken Circle"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
Star Trek's a lot more American than half of our own politics are anymore.
I am not American, so please, don't assume
Nope.
I'm not American either.
I never said you were American.
Never said you were.
I never said they were American.
I genuinely don't know if you're all being awkward, or are just hitting reply without actually reading and engaging your brains for a moment.
People can use terms that originate in other countries. If you use a term it does not mean you are from that country.
C'est la vie.
Come on, you tried to imply that it was an "American thing" used by Americans.
The two are not mutually exclusive. Learn nuance.
Never said they were.
Sorry you feel that way. Not sure why you do. Most of my exchanges with posters here are not so drama provoking. Feel free to scroll past. That's my method.
I'm sorry, but this is just false. It's an idiom that, like most idioms, can be employed in a wide variety of circumstances. Nothing about it is inherently condescending. In fact, Chapel's use of the term in "The Serene Squall" is a good example -- she's not using the phrase to condescend to Spock; she's using the phrase to emphasize that she wants him to pay better attention to her because she wants to know he cares.
The characters on Star Trek, particularly TOS, reflect American culture quite a bit. The idea that a contemporary American idiom shouldn't appear on Star Trek because it's American is not consistent with actual precedent.
And, besides, as you yourself noted, plenty of people use that idiom who are not American.
Which is certainly fair. But it's no more implausible that "pro tip" would still be used in 2259 than any number of other modern idioms. If we don't mind Kirk calling Dr. McCoy "Bones" -- a reference to a slang name for surgeons, "sawbones," that has virtually disappeared from English usage -- then I don't particularly see why "pro tip" would be a problem.
It is true -- "pro tip," in spite of its etymological origin, is most commonly used in informal contexts.
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Anyway, I don't think any of the stated reasons you have for objecting to the use of "pro tip" hold up. What it really boils down to is, Star Trek during the Berman era tended to use highly formal prescriptivist English; you're accustomed to that creative conceit and the use of idioms that have only recently become common therefore breaks verisimilitude for you. But the Berman era ended almost twenty years ago and modern Star Trek writers are not interested in preserving the creative conceit that idioms and slang would not be in common usage. Just as we have to transition from the creative conceit that obvious models were spaceships to the conceit that CGI are spaceships, we have to transition from the conceit that idioms and slang would not be used to the conceit that idioms and slang we understand will be used.
Oh totally Berman era is my Star Trek, it's where I'm anchored.
I just hate "pro tip" it as a term which I think underscores it. It's not used by professionals normally. And it's often used condescendingly (as it's not used verbally in the UK, my exposure is more to it online) or it's often something you knew anyway. I've not been exposed to many positive uses.
Although I take the point that Chapel was not trying to be negative.
It's one term in one shitty show though... it's not worth so much thought. I just don't like it.
"Hot drop the saucer section", dear lord that too. Seven talking about marijuana. I have others, but they are infrequent.
But we are in SNW thread and SNW I don't have issues with their language use so far.
I just hate "pro tip" it as a term which I think underscores it. It's not used by professionals normally. And it's often used condescendingly (as it's not used verbally in the UK, my exposure is more to it online) or it's often something you knew anyway. I've not been exposed to many positive uses.
Although I take the point that Chapel was not trying to be negative.
It's one term in one shitty show though... it's not worth so much thought. I just don't like it.
"Hot drop the saucer section", dear lord that too. Seven talking about marijuana. I have others, but they are infrequent.
But we are in SNW thread and SNW I don't have issues with their language use so far.
I really don't see how that's any different from characters drinking alcohol. I mean, if Miles and Julian can get drunk off their asses singing together, I don't see why Seven can't make casual reference to marijuana usage.
Well alcohol is legal and drugs aren't in most places. But also there's been no signs of recreational/illegal drug use in Trek and I don't think it would be the first thing she would jump to in that context.
It's not the word itself. It's just it didn't feel like a logical follow on in the context of the conversation on a starship bridge. It felt like a cheap line to play to the audience, IMO, which is why I didn't like it.
And googling i see now it was in reference to finding the changeling's pot. I mean changelings don't even have lungs. It's silly.
It makes a lot more sense if you watch the scene instead of reading about it.
I watched it, but I couldn't remember the context. I see she also says cannabis.
... so? It's not like current real-life legal status is intrinsic to the drug. And marijuana is no more harmful than alcohol.
Add to this the simple fact that marijuana is primarily illegal because of racism, and I see no reason whatsoever why an enlightened society like the Federation would ban responsible cannabis use by adults.
We see characters engaging in recreational drug use quite often in Star Trek -- and that drug is called alcohol.
The scene goes:
SHAW: So… so… maybe you get them to come to you.
SEVEN: How?
SHAW: Bait them. Steal their pot.
SEVEN: Pot? I'm assuming you're not referring to cannabis.
SHAW: Sadly, no.
Seven often made wry, sarcastic comments throughout her tenure on Voyager, so that seems perfectly consistent with her personality to me.
It is, indeed, a joke that Seven tells. Jokes are often silly.
Raffi is clearly indulging in substances of some kind when we first see her in PIC S1. Never mind various references to drug addition across the franchise (e.g. TNG: "Symbiosis", ENT: "These Are the Voyages..."), and T'Pol's entire Trellium-D arc in ENT.
And yet the primary Changeling character we see in PIC S3 is often seen smoking
