Indiana Jones 5. It's official.

[jaime]

Really, a necessity must exist? Drug use, addiction, and violence have been with us since then too. Also a necessity?

Because I doubt that if I go without a story in my day to day life I will die, vs. actual necessities like air, food, water, shelter, and safety, and social connections.

The older I get the more and more I realize that what is defined as "necessity" is anything but in this first world of ours.

ETA: And to be perfectly clear I am not saying these things are not important to humanity as whole only that I don't put them on the same level of "This will kill me without it" type necessity.

When time allows I will consider it.

Sadly, I think an argument that some of those things could indeed be considered a necessity. Especially from a sociological point of view.
On an individual level?
Well, to paraphrase Hogfather, specifically Death, Justice is fiction, Truth is fiction, Love is fiction… all things we believe in, and need, that you won’t find on a periodic table of elements.
In the wider sense, my point is very much that those cultural elements are exactly what is needed for civilisation to exist in so many ways. They are the *why* rather than the *how* or the *what*.

 

[fireproof78]

Sadly, I think an argument that some of those things could indeed be considered a necessity. Especially from a sociological point of view.
On an individual level?
Well, to paraphrase Hogfather, specifically Death, Justice is fiction, Truth is fiction, Love is fiction… all things we believe in, and need, that you won’t find on a periodic table of elements.
In the wider sense, my point is very much that those cultural elements are exactly what is needed for civilisation to exist in so many ways. They are the *why* rather than the *how* or the *what*.

Well, when you put it that way Indiana Jones still doesn't qualify as a necessity.

I could fold such a "need" under social connections but that's the limit to me. When people say we need stories I just roll my eyes.

 

[Set Harth]

I must be a total weirdo: I think Rogue One and Solo, in that order, are the very best movies of the new cycle of Star Wars movies.

I feel like Solo missed a trick in not having a sequence comparable to Rogue One's Star Destroyers smashing together scene.

Namely, I think in Solo the Star Destroyer should have gone into the black hole with the summa-verminoth wrapped around it.

But instead they just ripped off the ending of Star Trek 09.

 

[thribs]

Solo was the most EU friendly out of all of them. It just wasn’t very interesting of a film.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Yup.

Rogue One is a litmus test to tell me if people had a brain. An awful character driven movie with no characters that throws a bunch of nostalgia at you in the last 10 minutes - which is why its the only thing people talk about.

True.

Ultimately. the entire film was nostalgia-bait with no purpose whatsoever; from the endless OT character and dialogue nods--including obscure ANH Mos Eisley cantina characters, having Vader in an utterly fan-stroking scene not at all in keeping with his behavior from the film which follows it in chronological order (i.e., let the Stormtroopers perform the attacks / raids) to the atrocious, video-gamey Tarkin and Leia, R1 was not a necessary chapter between the PT & OT. ANH's opening crawl explained the most important action / contribution of those "Rebel spies"--nothing else beyond that was of any need to the main OT story at all, and no one felt there was some "missing" lead-in to ANH back in 1977, either.

 

[fireproof78]

Not like ANH was needed either.

And with Star Wars post ROTJ everything feels superfluous.

 

[Anwar]

Solo was the most EU friendly out of all of them. It just wasn’t very interesting of a film.

The problem is that we know nothing can happen to Han and Han can't be much of a 3D character in it either. The whole point of him in ANH is that when we meet him he's just a money-hungry 1D jackass who doesn't prove himself until the end to have more to him. Solo couldn't do anything BUT make him a selfish jerk because otherwise it would mess up what ANH showed us.

 

[jaime]

Well, when you put it that way Indiana Jones still doesn't qualify as a necessity.

I could fold such a "need" under social connections but that's the limit to me. When people say we need stories I just roll my eyes.

Oh I didn’t say needed Indy specifically xD

 

[Starkers]

Ah remember when Lucas, Spielberg and Kasden were spitballing about how great it'd be if Marion had been 11 when she and Indy had an affair but it'd be ok because She'd have seduced him? Or when they wondered that maybe she'd been working as a call girl to make ends meet?

L — I like it if they already had a relationship at one point. Because then you don't have to build it.

G — I was thinking that this old guy could have been his mentor. He could have known this little girl when she was just a kid. Had an affair with her when she was eleven.

L — And he was forty-two.

G — He hasn't seen her in twelve years. Now she's twenty-two. It's a real strange relationship.

S — She had better be older than twenty-two.

G — He's thirty-five, and he knew her ten years ago when he was twenty-five and she was only twelve.

G — It would be amusing to make her slightly young at the time.

S — And promiscuous. She came onto him.

G — Fifteen is right on the edge. I know it's an outrageous idea, but it is interesting. Once she's sixteen or seventeen it's not interesting anymore. But if she was fifteen and he was twenty-five and they actually had an affair the last time they met. And she was madly in love with him and he...

 

[Set Harth]

Solo couldn't do anything BUT make him a selfish jerk because otherwise it would mess up what ANH showed us.

But it did in fact do that. He gave away 60 million credits to Enfys/the rebels!

 

[Anwar]

But it did in fact do that. He gave away 60 million credits to Enfys/the rebels!

Yes and that was another complaint about how it made him "too good" before he was supposed to turn good.

Ah remember when Lucas, Spielberg and Kasden were spitballing about how great it'd be if Marion had been 11 when she and Indy had an affair but it'd be ok because She'd have seduced him? Or when they wondered that maybe she'd been working as a call girl to make ends meet?

YUCK.

 

[Phily B]

ROTS did make less than Phantom Menace though. Just like ESB and ROTJ made less than ANH.



They haven't, they're just taking a longer time to think of what the next movies will be about. This happens.



It has, folks go back to watch it now and are wondering "Why did people hate this so much? What's wrong with it?"



Then blame Lucas for Crystal Skull, he was the one who revived Jones before Kennedy did.

Star Wars was a cultural phenomenon that was in theaters for what seems like years and has been rereleased multiple times. It's a bit different than a soft remake that saw its BO takings half. And yes, ROTS made less but that wasn't the point you made. It didn't make half of what TPM made, nor did it make less than the previous. All those movies are shit but people still lapped them up.

And why would I blame Lucas when we're talking about movies that KK produced? She's somehow produced abominations worse than the prequels and KotCS. Why would I cry about Lucas when he hasn't done anything for almost 20 years?

14? Seriously? Ewwww.


So lovely to know I don't have a brain! And here I wasted all these years trying to learn things with something I don't have!

FWIW, I find the last bit the worst part of R1.

Was your favourte part the part where the fat guy sacrificed himself, got all emotional, called the main character "little sister" and had a touching death scene even though they'd barely talked or interacted? It was a character driven movie with at best one dimensional characters who barely interacted. Probably because they heavily recut the film to throw in nostalgia bait.

 

[fireproof78]

The problem is that we know nothing can happen to Han and Han can't be much of a 3D character in it either. The whole point of him in ANH is that when we meet him he's just a money-hungry 1D jackass who doesn't prove himself until the end to have more to him. Solo couldn't do anything BUT make him a selfish jerk because otherwise it would mess up what ANH showed us.

I think Solo shows both sides of the character and does it well. That he was not always cynical and that it was life beating him up, killing his mentor, losing his girlfriend, being swindled informed his eventual development to ANH. It plays off of Han's face when Leia comments on his apparent apathy. Like Obi-Wan he conceals his pain.

It's a credit to Ford that his performance leads to exploring that depth.

 

[fireproof78]

And why would I blame Lucas when we're talking about movies that KK produced? She's somehow produced abominations worse than the prequels and KotCS. Why would I cry about Lucas when he hasn't done anything for almost 20 year

Who did Kennedy learn under?

 

[Bea Jonas]

George Lucas said his original idea behind the Indiana Jones films was to explore each of the world's major religions. With that in mind, how did the five films in the series do in that regard?

Raiders—Judaism
Temple of Doom—Hinduism
Last Crusade—Christianity
Kingdom of the Crystal Skull—I'm not sure what religion this film is supposed to represent, but it had did have aliens, so maybe Scientology.
Dial of Destiny: (Unknown—arrives June 30th!)

Anyway, it seems George's original plan to explore the world's major religions went off track right about the time it should have tackled Islam, which is a shame considering that faith's 1.9 billion adherents around the world.

 

[Captaindemotion]

Ah remember when Lucas, Spielberg and Kasden were spitballing about how great it'd be if Marion had been 11 when she and Indy had an affair but it'd be ok because She'd have seduced him? Or when they wondered that maybe she'd been working as a call girl to make ends meet?

Indiana Jones and the Sex Offenders’ Register

 

[Anwar]

And why would I blame Lucas when we're talking about movies that KK produced? She's somehow produced abominations worse than the prequels and KotCS. Why would I cry about Lucas when he hasn't done anything for almost 20 years?

Because the Sequels aren't worse than all that. Lucas isn't above scrutiny so we shouldn't single out KK like every other SW Producer was flawless.

 

[Dee1891]

Solo was the most EU friendly out of all of them. It just wasn’t very interesting of a film.

I liked it more than Rogue One, which is odd to me because I used to feel the reverse.

I don't regard the prequels and Crystal Skull as abominations.

 

[fireproof78]

Because the Sequels aren't worse than all that. Lucas isn't above scrutiny so we shouldn't single out KK like every other SW Producer was flawless.

Indeed. It's a mixed bag for LFL all across the board.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Anyway, it seems George's original plan to explore the world's major religions went off track right about the time it should have tackled Islam, which is a shame considering that faith's 1.9 billion adherents around the world.

I feel like Indy is the kind of person who would feign being Muslim so he could go on the haij and visit Mecca. And maybe sneak inside the Kaaba to see the meteorite inside. (If you're curious what's inside the Kaaba, there are videos on YouTube.)