That would be my fondest wish. The Borg are the biggest annoyance that Trek has ever conceived of and that they are here again just is a tough pill to swallow.
Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x09 - "Võx"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
What an amazing episode. Maybe the best hour of Trek TV since the franchise returned to regular TV (well, streaming, but you get what I mean). The Borg's plan was ingenious, I'd have never predicted using the transporter like that but its a very interesting plan that definitely worked well. Seeing Shelby was unexpected but cool, although she didn't last very long. Obviously the big moment was the return of the Enterprise-D. I'd been spoiled to it since an online article wqhere someone (either Buitron or McFadden, I think) mentioned having filmed on "The old bridge", but it didn't weaken the power of the moment at all. Picard and his crew, on the bridge of the Enterprise, flying out to save the Federation. Its what I've wanted from the show since it was first announced, and they're really giving it to us.
Also, RIP Shaw. I didn't really like him, but he got better as time went on. I really hope we get a Seven spin off from all of this.
Also, RIP Shaw. I didn't really like him, but he got better as time went on. I really hope we get a Seven spin off from all of this.
I was thinking how much of the Data bit this season is in some ways a Spock-in-the-movies buried in its story.
Then I remembered this post and wanted to say:
In TMP, alone of all Vulcans, Spock hears V’Ger. Which is how we get him back on Enterprise of course.
So, we can go back to TMP rather than TWOK if you like.
(I like how much of modern Trek looks to the movies tbh. Especially the visual side of things.)
I honestly don't think he's dead, but maybe that's just me expecting the easiest out given the writing. lol
It's just a flesh wound!
For what it's worth, the resolution of the best of both worlds was utterly stupid. Yeah that's some great security/computer tech you've got there, Borg. You have a low security access sleep mode that, when activated, somehow randomly makes you self destruct. Great security there. Really advanced species. Whatever.
The borg blew in 1990 and the borg blows in 2023. It was NEVER that great. That crap wouldn't even make my top 10 of TNG episodes yet somehow has become the focal point of the ENTIRE FRANCHISE. It's insanity.
The borg blew in 1990 and the borg blows in 2023. It was NEVER that great. That crap wouldn't even make my top 10 of TNG episodes yet somehow has become the focal point of the ENTIRE FRANCHISE. It's insanity.
He’s going to die, because ‘sleep’ didn’t work last time.
This plot doesn't work without at least one body and a meaningful farewell.
I’m okay with some TMP goodness. Disco McCoy to the rescue!
Seriously, I’ve come to appreciate TMP a lot more as I get older.
I do wonder if it really will be Picard this time mind you. It won’t be. But it would be more logical.
What irritates me so much about the Data thing was that it was SO easy to handle. Should have never killed off the character. All they had to do was just have Data create an aging program and enhance his "body" with more organic augmentation. They could have just had him look like Brent Spiner in the future. Data was always growing/changing anyway. It was the obvious solution. Would have given them a route to do something with the character and shut up Brent Spiner, too, who always complained that there was nowhere else to go with the character. They could have had so much more fun with that than the atrocity we ended up with. The whole thing is just a big mess.
Is it too late to get Pulaski in with a beard?
(Or the EMH… didn’t Picardo say he had been approached for Picard?)
Ahh much more fun to talk about a new episode than relitigate season 1... might save that thread for after this season ends.
Advance reviewer Dave Cullin has confirmed [implicit 310 spoilers]
And earlier in this thread, it was confirmed the Face
. Was hoping for an additional layer of involvement there.
On the generational divide... This season is pretty "Generation X"... and Terry Matalas is very much an "80s kid". So instead of the oversampling what the marketing department thinks Gen Z likes with DISCOVERY, this season is much more a home for Gen Xers and older Millennials.
The Red Door dragged for about 3 episode too long, but you can only do so much with the Borg as the big bad once revealed, so maybe that plot needed one extra component, like another group of antagonists in between the rogue Changelings and the Borg. Likely some of season 3's "Act 2" got cut for budget, and 307 and 308 should have been one consolidated episode. So we're effectively missing one whole episode of plot content.
We need to change Star Trek into something it wasn't to appeal to the mythical new younger audience. 
Advance reviewer Dave Cullin has confirmed [implicit 310 spoilers]
Shaw is dead
Shelby is "presumed dead"
Shelby is "presumed dead"
And earlier in this thread, it was confirmed the Face
is the Borg Queen
On the generational divide... This season is pretty "Generation X"... and Terry Matalas is very much an "80s kid". So instead of the oversampling what the marketing department thinks Gen Z likes with DISCOVERY, this season is much more a home for Gen Xers and older Millennials.
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I think the reference is in it having multiple epilogues. And there's a post-credit scene as well.
This is great to hear, especially if/when DS9/VGR finally get HD remasters.
One major problem with the serialization model of taking a movie idea and stretching it out to ten episodes is you always seem to end up with a stretched/bloated "Act 2", while "Act 3" doesn't get 33% of the run time, let alone allow for the mystery box to fully breathe once its been fully opened.
The Red Door dragged for about 3 episode too long, but you can only do so much with the Borg as the big bad once revealed, so maybe that plot needed one extra component, like another group of antagonists in between the rogue Changelings and the Borg. Likely some of season 3's "Act 2" got cut for budget, and 307 and 308 should have been one consolidated episode. So we're effectively missing one whole episode of plot content.
Star Trek, especially Berman-era, was very good at squaring the circle of appealing to liberals, moderates, and conservatives at the same time. Allegory and nuance can be far more effective for verisimilitude and relative timelessness rather than being overtly partisan and "current day".
Prime essentially restricts you when traveling abroad to watching content that you could both watch at home and also in the country of your current location. Probably an attempt to combat the VPN game.
Same here. I was really hoping for some kind of "origin of the Borg" take coupled with third parties taking advantage of the remnant. If they still had $10 million an episode, some kind of flashback expansive take would have been possible.
Check out 12 MONKEYS. Yes, that came from a film... but it started as an independent pilot that then swerved into a backwards adaptation to get green lit.
This is one reason I struggle with giving the episode anything more than 5/10. Part of it is 20/10 amazing, other parts are PICARD season 1 levels of horrible.
As one advance reviewers has said, it isn't a retcon, it "pluses canon".
No, no, no. You will eat your vegetables with gruel and like it! Or just go die off already.
We need to change Star Trek into something it wasn't to appeal to the mythical new younger audience. You really need to have older fans introducing it to their kids. Even Star Wars is running into this problem.
Just an in continuity series that feels like an organic follow up that doesn't zero sum game the audience.
I'm rewatching it now, and its crazy to see just how much was set up in season 1 and planned out from the beginning.
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Even more so limited to 10 episodes compared to 13-15.
There was so much world building during the Berman-era, that was hampered by the reset button and structural need of procedural syndication. That change alone opens the dam floodgates of possibilities.
This seasons is much bigger on emotion than logic. The story works in some ways, but it is set up to move from been feel moment to big feel moment. And that's OK, because that is the purpose of this season. So, I won't expect Picard to die. I don't expect Jack to die but if he dies (Big IF) then I would imagine it will be a fond good bye to his new family.
It would be nice if this wasn't a qualifier. It appeals to all people rather than those others of the (other political part that I don't agree with those evil people!). Shouldn't fun Trek appeal to many people, not just one stripe?
They started making new Trek shows, they didn’t invent time travel. Just be happy they finally found a way out of Nemesis now.
TMP is good sci-fi with all the normal good sci-fi tropes. The magical crewman, the robot seeking to understand humanity, deus ex machina, daddy issues, etc.
Its a very predictable story but it doesn't make it bad.
That they moved past Nemesis is the biggest credit to this series no matter what.
At least Star Wars has the advantage of being a Disney brand now and is on D+ so already more accesible to kids
And didn't "unhappen" it.
Did Nemesis happen? Yes
Has the problems it introduced been bypassed? Yes
Does Nemesis matter now? No not really