• Welcome! The TrekBBS is the number one place to chat about Star Trek with like-minded fans.
    If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Spoilers Star Trek: Picard 3x08 - "Surrender"

Engage!

  • Total voters
    243
Macintosh said:
Precisely. This isn't the same Data that we saw from "Encounter at Farpoint" through to Nemesis. As Altan Soong himself said, this being contains "an awful lot of Data", but it's not the same individual – even if he has the same memories. It's a new consciousness, combining parts of Data, Lore, B4, Altan Soong, Lal... it's much more than just the straight "reincarnation" Picard had. It's more like a Trill symbiont being transplanted into a new host. It's a new Data. I'm wondering if by the end of the season he might change his name to reflect his new existence, becoming "Soong" or something.
Click to expand...

While I understand the point you're making, I do think you're incorrect.

This *is* the same Data that we were with from Encounter at Farpoint all the way up to when Data turned B4 off in Nemesis. This is the manifestation of Data from that time, plus Lore, plus B4, Alton Soong and Lal.

In simple terms..think of Data as a ship. Along the way that ship is amended with parts from a sister ship, some custom modifications, etc..

It is still the same ship, just *more* than it was before.
 
Maybe they're finally bringing in the Enhanced humanity that Roddenberry was talking about in the novelization of TMP? Humans with ESP and psychic powers?
 
The Borg seem most likely to be the big boss, except when Vadic cuts off her hand and summons Zordon, he/she/they don't really sound Borg-y. That's the only thing that's throwing me for a loop with that theory. Honestly, at this point, why even introduce another villain at all? The Changelings are pretty heavy hitters on their own, why overcomplicate it?

And then Jack. Good grief. Just open the goddamn door. I think the funniest possible thing the show could do at this point, would be to prolong the Jack reveal until the last episode, just to fuck with us all.
 
Racefuel said:
While I understand the point you're making, I do think you're incorrect.

This *is* the same Data that we were with from Encounter at Farpoint all the way up to when Data turned B4 off in Nemesis. This is the manifestation of Data from that time, plus Lore, plus B4, Alton Soong and Lal.

In simple terms..think of Data as a ship. Along the way that ship is amended with parts from a sister ship, some custom modifications, etc..

It is still the same ship, just *more* than it was before.
Click to expand...

Data of Theseus
 
Campe said:
One thing I just realized: they destroyed Picard’s biological body when they destroyed the Shrike.
Click to expand...
I assumed that Riker, Worf and Troi brought it with them to the Titan. Must have been a cramped shuttle ride if so.

Although I can imagine Riker sauntering up to the bridge, saying "Okay guys, before we blow that ship to hell we need to beam Jean-Luc's bo....oh damnit." as the Titan's torpedoes hit their target.
 
I'm going to stick it out, because I've made it this far but unlike many I'm not enjoying this final season overall. Monologuing protoplasms seems indicative of the problems with it. It feels overwrought, the stakes are high but the pacing feels off, slow, then rushed. But then I liked S1 the best because it tried new things. I am in the minority.

Raffi brought swords to a phaser fight. Against liquid people. Okay. (She looked awesome though.)

This entire story could have been done in 6 episodes, easy. There is too much filler and even then the filler seems to focus on the wrong things.

The character stuff between Riker and Deanna was good. But I've been worried about their daughter since last week and this didn't help me be less worried.

I am seriously ready for all the geezers to be put out to pasture (and I say this as an old geezer nearing 70.) I don't need legacy characters anymore. I want fresh new faces. I want forward movement. I want the youngsters to be given a chance to become legacy characters someday.

That being said, Worf is now my favorite child.
 
Racefuel said:
Basically, yeah. I think it's just clear that its supposed to be *the* Data from Farpoint that we all "traveled with" on TNG.
Click to expand...
He's an evolution of that Data. Physically he's different and he also includes the experiences and personalities of his "brothers".

But yes, primarily he's a continuation of the Data we knew 35 years ago.
 
Defeating Vadic with violence is the most un-Trek thing of the three seasons so far and that includes the Borg Queen singing.
 
Poor T’Veen.

vadik’s demise was satisfying.

Will and Deanna’s scenes were a good explanation for the difference in Riker’s demeanor between the first and third seasons. As an empath, she couldn’t stand the pain that Will and Kestra felt after Thad’s death, so she muffled it, allowing her husband and daughter to appear at peace when they really weren’t. They also both hate Nepenthe. I never thought they were back to the woods types.

Commander Seven of Nine/Annika Hansen is learning some valuable lessons from Shaw about a captain’s responsibility to an entire ship.

I still have no idea where Jack’s abilities come from but my best guess is that it has something to do with Locutus of Borg. They haven’t mentioned pah wraiths or Shinzon this season but they definitely have brought up Locutus and all of the horrors connected with him. I think the Changelings planned to use Jack and his abilities to do something on Frontier Day similar to what Locutus did that killed 11,000. Picard’s DNA was altered and there must have been nanites lying dormant in his body that were in his sperm when he sired Jack. Jack would be the first truly biological human-Borg hybrid. His abilities point to some kind of cyborg ability, from hearing voices to being able to hear thoughts and take over other bodies and manipulate their actions. I’m not sure what weak but ancient power could be referenced here, unless it’s the original Borg queen or whatever alien power it originated with.
 
bookworm8571 said:
I still have no idea where Jack’s abilities come from but my best guess is that it has something to do with Locutus of Borg. They haven’t mentioned pah wraiths or Shinzon this season but they definitely have brought up Locutus and all of the horrors connected with him. I think the Changelings planned to use Jack and his abilities to do something on Frontier Day similar to what Locutus did that killed 11,000. Picard’s DNA was altered and there must have been nanites lying dormant in his body that were in his sperm when he sired Jack. Jack would be the first truly biological human-Borg hybrid. His abilities point to some kind of cyborg ability, from hearing voices to being able to hear thoughts and take over other bodies and manipulate their actions. I’m not sure what weak but ancient power could be referenced here, unless it’s the original Borg queen or whatever alien power it originated with.
Click to expand...
Why would Vadic be so famiiar with what Jack's going through though? If what you say is true, Jack is the first of his kind and Vadic would have no idea on what he sees in his visions, etc. Yet she knows all that.

Visitor1982 said:
Matalas has said the Borg won't play a part this season... So far, he hasn't mislead the fandom.
Click to expand...
I haven't seen this. Can you link the tweet? It'd be helpful to quote at people who keep insisting Jack's a Borg.
 
Tomalak said:
He’s just guilty about what happened to Spot after Nemesis…
Click to expand...
Or what happened to Spot when Worf was catsitting all those years ago. Spot went from he to she and had kittens. Clearly a sitcom-y accidental smooshing of the original Spot occurred and the normally observant Data didn't notice.

Turtletrekker said:
And as we saw in "All Good Things" the practical extent of his aging program was the ability to add a streak of gray in his hair. ;):lol:
Click to expand...
"Looked like a bloody skunk"
 
Charles Phipps said:
Defeating Vadic with violence is the most un-Trek thing of the three seasons so far and that includes the Borg Queen singing.
Click to expand...
Because Trek villains have never been dispatched violently? Even if we just consider the films...
Khan: Blown up
Kruge: Kicked in the face repeatedly until falling off a cliff into fire.
God: Shot with Klingon Bird-of-Prey disruptors
Chang: Blown up
Soren: Blown up
Ru'Afo: Blown up
Shinzon: Impaled, then blown up
Nero: Obliterated by a black hole
Marcus: Head crushed by Khan
Krall: Ejected into space

I mean...
 
Why would a blade even hurt updated changelings? Sure they might be more solid than the originals, but the point of a blade is to cut or stab vital organs. If you have no need for such organs then getting stabbed isn’t going to do much. Unless the henchmen weren’t changelings to begin with. They were infected with changeling goo so they could heal and maybe change outer form, yet they were still solids? This season is definitely a hell of a lot better than last one, but it’s still got its issues.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Commander Richard
  • Poll
Spoilers Star Trek: Lower Decks 5x09 - "Fissure Quest"
15 16 17
Replies
327
Views
19K
Oddish
Oddish
Commander Richard
  • Poll
Spoilers Star Trek: Lower Decks 5x08 - "Upper Decks"
2 3 4
Replies
70
Views
5K
Qonundrum
Qonundrum
Commander Richard
  • Poll
Spoilers Star Trek: Lower Decks 5x07 - "Fully Dilated"
4 5 6
Replies
116
Views
7K
Qonundrum
Qonundrum
Commander Richard
  • Poll
Spoilers Star Trek: Lower Decks 5x06 - "Of Gods and Angles"
3 4 5
Replies
84
Views
5K
Qonundrum
Qonundrum
Commander Richard
  • Poll
Spoilers Star Trek: Lower Decks 5x05 - "Starbase 80?!"
5 6 7
Replies
131
Views
8K
Qonundrum
Qonundrum
If you are not already a member then please register an account and join in the discussion!

Sign up / Register


Back
Top