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Spoilers Coda Trilogy Discussion Thread

Okay some I'm reading them through a second time and I have still have a mixed reaction, at times it feels almost like 'bad fanfiction' yet most of its brilliantly written.

First thing, it's not the kind of story I would have thought of telling but I can see why the authors gravitated to it and did enjoy it, that being said some of the choices seem problematic to me.

The big problem I have is Ezri Dax's death, it just sort of happens, she doesn't do anything especially heroic as the later characters do in their final moments, for instance Nog's sacrificing his life to save the refugee ships, Ro and Quark buying time, O'Brien fixing the hatch so Kira can escape, the Prophets giving Kira what she needs to complete the plan etc. Every other A list character's death is a big moment whereas Ezri, just dies, in a novel she's barely in at that! I'm not really sure what Ward was thinking when he structured the book that way, but Ezri's death should have been the climax of the book, the big moment its built around and it should have had some emotional impact. For heavans sake Worf is in this story, you know Worf, who was married to Jadzia Dax and considered Ezri part of his House/Family and interacted the most with Ezri in the final episodes with it being her that sees him off when he goes to be Ambassador. Yeah, they never meet in the book. WTAF Not forgetting she only gets introduced two thirds of the way through! She has no arc, very little to do and ends up dying merely to show that anyone can die.

The only other purpose her death in that manner served was to motivate the guy's on the DS9 cast, let that sink in three middle aged white men wrote a novel trilogy where one of the few female characters gets unceremoniously killed off to motivate the guys...

Again her death moves the *male* character Bowers to take the captain's seat of Ezri's ship in one of the few novels featuring Aventine as the main hero ship. It seems to me that this could have been written to save Ezri's death for later for the second book and if needs must having Ezri and the others going rogue bringing Bashir back to help her if he can to deliberately parallel with when she helped him during "A Ceremony of Losses" she can then have a meeting with her DS9 costars and a big heroic end stopping say the last Naga from reaching DS9 before it blows.


As has been stated elsewhere the Riker psychosis last too long, I've heard the authors try to justify it but given this is Star Trek and the things that exist there the idea that they can't force a clearly unstable officer to at least undergo a medical exam seems far fetched. Maybe if he'd been kept off page for most of the second book it wouldn't feel so long but it makes the Titan crew look like idiots for letting it go on so long.


Then there's the choice to go to the Mirror Universe, seriously? I'd have loved to be a fly in the room on that meeting, just think we could have seen how Gell Kamenor's government deals with the crisis as a direct contrast with how "Last Best Hope" handles their response to their sun going nova. We could have seen how the Typhon Pact as a whole deals with it, maybe how Garak and Cardassia try to handle the knowledge, hell we could have seen the Federation and its enemies and allies come together to make one last stand against the Devidians. Instead we go to the Mirror Universe... Erm, what?

Then there was the Worf/K'Ehylr nonsense, I honestly couldn't read those bits without sneering, I mean we're supposed to be celebrating the 20 years of novel development of these characters and we do that by ignoring not just the twenty years of novels but almost a full decade of character development he got on TV as well! I mean Worf is far from the insecure Klingon brought up by humans that he was when he had a fling with her, and that's all it was a fling. Hell watch the episode he doesn't even really want to marry her, it's just 'tradition' to him at a point where he hypercompensates. Even her death is merely because she got caught in the middle with Duras. Compare his fling with K'Ehylr to his relationship to Jadzia, he marries her because he wants to spend his life with her, he wants to build a future with her. Hence the discuss trying for kids. Worf by the end of TNG is pretty far from the guy who had a fling with K'Ehylr, by the end of DS9 let alone the 12 years passed in the novels he is so far from that man its laughable.

All that said there were a great many bits I did like.

The Stealing the Enterprise was great fun to read and brought a grin to my face as I read along with all the little injokes.

I actually enjoyed the Naga battles and all the different ways they fought rather than just shooting phasers and disruptors at one another.

I liked Ward practically admitting defeat on the T'Ryssa Chen/Rennan Konya weird thing he's had going his last few novels by having her discus her future with Taurik, chase after Taurik in the middle of her date with Taurik and actually spending more time cut up about Taurik's death than Konya's.

I love how Swallow flat out ignored the creepy as all f**k marriage between Spock and Saavik.

Bringing Picard and Sisko together, wish that'd happened earlier too bad it took the end of everything.

The alternate Borg were fun to read as Mack had a different take on them, I really liked the idea that the Borg's meddling with time has lead to multiple possible origins and cross pollenating their own past. Reminds me of the 90s Doctor Who novel Unnatural History where the multiple conflicting backstories for the Doctor was blamed off of changes to the timeline caused by his time travel.

I actually like how Mack was able to make Kira become a Vedek make some sort of sense given it goes against her character so completely Nana Visitor actually spoke out against it, I'd hoped when DRGIII sent Vedek Kira back in time that was how he was going to reconcile her joining the clergy, ie meeting herself. But Mack actually has it so something that goes totally against make some sort of sense.
 
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I'm of the opinion that the trilogy and the temporal psychosis that effected Riker and Word explains the events leading up to the first season of Picard. Novelverse Picard ends up haunting Primeverse Picard, driving him into a decade of despair and hopelessness until the shock of Data seemingly having another daughter causes the two personalities to sort themselves out for the sake of her.

I can think of no other reason for Primeverse Picard to act so out of character.

I’m sorry but how in anyway shape or form was Picard out of character in his show?
 
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I’m sorry but how in anyway shape or form was Picard out of character in his show?

A lot of people do not believe Picard would have stayed in his vineyard for twenty years. He would totally quit Starfleet if he thought the Federation were not doing the right thing to help people, but he would have been on the frontline running his own NGO equivalent while he knew people were in trouble, helping whoever he could.

I like a lot of things about Picard the show, but this has always stunk to me.
 
A lot of people do not believe Picard would have stayed in his vineyard for twenty years. He would totally quit Starfleet if he thought the Federation were not doing the right thing to help people, but he would have been on the frontline running his own NGO equivalent while he knew people were in trouble, helping whoever he could.

I like a lot of things about Picard the show, but this has always stunk to me.


I think it makes perfect sense, he spent almost half a decade crossed who knows how many lines trying to save lives. He was party to and responsible for the creation of the synths, literary creating that ‘race of disposable people’ he found horrifying in TNG. and it all went wrong, millions are dead as a result, he believes himself to be responsible and then Starfleet turns its back, he threatens to resign and… they call his bluff.


Imagine everything his done, all the sacrifices he’s made for the uniform and ideals and when it came down to it the Federation stubbed all its ideals in the back.

Picard is a broken man. What else would he do, he’s been a starship captain for the last fifty years. All of it for nothing, he probably could have done more, he probably should have tried to wage a public effort to shame the Federation to do something, but he doesn’t because he is broken. He devoted his entire adult life to something that betrayed every ideal it held. Everything he’s sacrificed, everything he’s lost, for nothing. It’s far from a healthy reaction but it feels entirely in keeping with his character.
Everyone burns out eventually
 
Picard is a broken man. What else would he do, he’s been a starship captain for the last fifty years. All of it for nothing, he probably could have done more, he probably should have tried to wage a public effort to shame the Federation to do something, but he doesn’t because he is broken. He devoted his entire adult life to something that betrayed every ideal it held. Everything he’s sacrificed, everything he’s lost, for nothing. It’s far from a healthy reaction but it feels entirely in keeping with his character.

Yes. Exactly. A lot of people mistake uncharacteristic behavior for being written out of character. They're two different things. Nobody is a perfect, invariant mathematical formula always behaving in a consistent, predictable way. We change over time, we feel and act differently in different circumstances, and we can be so hurt or worn down by life that we just give up. Sometimes the fact that a character is behaving uncharacteristically is the entire point, to show just how bad things have gotten. It's not bad writing; on the contrary, having them behave predictably and unvaryingly no matter how bad things get is bad writing.

It's only out-of-character writing if a character behaves atypically for no reason, beyond the writer not understanding how they'd react to a given set of circumstances. That's not what happened in Picard. Picard reacted uncharacteristically because of the circumstances, and that was the whole point of the story. It was a story about a man who'd lost his way and needed to remember who he was.
 
I've yet to read this trilogy, but I'm intrigued. Is the implication that, after the timeline is reset, most of the characters and races introduced in the books are still out there in the new timeline?
 
I've yet to read this trilogy, but I'm intrigued. Is the implication that, after the timeline is reset, most of the characters and races introduced in the books are still out there in the new timeline?

Effectively, any character in the First Splinter born before the divergence point during First Contact is theoretically alive in the Prime timeline - as the Picard novel The Dark Veil establishes, characters like Christine Vale and Ranul Keru are part of the Titan crew, just as an example. Just that events in the Prime timeline shook out differently and they didn’t follow the same path - after all, that divergence point is still while Prime timeline events took place and there is explicit overlap (the Dominion War, Voyager’s return, Data’s death).

Of course, in the event that any species built up by the novels appears in modern Trek in incompatible ways (re: the Breen are established as consisting of only a single species, they go in the “armored lizards” direction for the Tzenkethi, etc.), then that is the version that will rule going forward, because the tie-ins have to maintain consistency with the screen portrayals - the Gorn of SNW, for example, reproduce entirely differently than they were established in the Typhon Pact novels featuring them. Whether this can or will be handwaved as meshing later doesn’t change the fact that this makes a big difference in the two portrayals, and, by virtue of being what’s on screen, what we saw on SNW is going to be the one that future novels adhere to, rather than the novels’ prior take.
 
I've yet to read this trilogy, but I'm intrigued. Is the implication that, after the timeline is reset, most of the characters and races introduced in the books are still out there in the new timeline?
Yeah, the PIC novel The Dark Veil even goes into some detail about early plans for the Titan's mission and crew - exactly what we got in the novel series - versus what ended up happening due to the Romulan crisis.
 
Okay I’ve just got to the Earth destruction part of book 3, how the freaking hell is Riker still in charge after refusing direct orders from both the President and the Admiral of the Fleet.

Given Akaar’s last order to relieve him why does annoy one on Titan follow his commands?
 
Since Akaar died immediately after, it's kind of hard for his orders to be enforced.

In full view of the entire senior staff he refuses orders from his President and the chief Admiral, they should have ended that ridiculous plot tumour then and there at the latest
 
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In full view of the entire senior staff he refuses orders from his President and the chief Admiral,
Who, as I said both died. There tends to be a perception among those on the front line that the superiors at home are cut off from what's going on at the front, and that's under normal circumstances where home is safer than the front. This can cause those among the front to ignore orders from their superiors at home, or reinterpret them in a manner to suit the situation, and there is historical precedent to demonstrate this works and can be integral to overall victory. Now look at this situation, home just got destroyed immediately after Akaar ordered Riker to be relieved. Shit just got Super Real, and if home is destroyed, the front line is really going to get gruesome. Akaar is a superior cut off from the reality of the front, and there might even be a perception that ignorance just got him killed. Riker seems to have answers/a plan, and in the uncertainty they currently find themselves in, it makes since the Titan crew would continue follow him despite the last orders given by a man who died immediately after issuing them and can't do anything to enforce them or reprimand anyone for disregarding them.

Which is another thing, Akaar is dead and can't reprimand anyone on the Titan. Riker is very much alive and in an unhinged state, who knows what he's capable of? Fear likely also played a part in the Titan crew's compliance as much as anything else.
 
Who, as I said both died. There tends to be a perception among those on the front line that the superiors at home are cut off from what's going on at the front, and that's under normal circumstances where home is safer than the front. This can cause those among the front to ignore orders from their superiors at home, or reinterpret them in a manner to suit the situation, and there is historical precedent to demonstrate this works and can be integral to overall victory. Now look at this situation, home just got destroyed immediately after Akaar ordered Riker to be relieved. Shit just got Super Real, and if home is destroyed, the front line is really going to get gruesome. Akaar is a superior cut off from the reality of the front, and there might even be a perception that ignorance just got him killed. Riker seems to have answers/a plan, and in the uncertainty they currently find themselves in, it makes since the Titan crew would continue follow him despite the last orders given by a man who died immediately after issuing them and can't do anything to enforce them or reprimand anyone for disregarding them.

Which is another thing, Akaar is dead and can't reprimand anyone on the Titan. Riker is very much alive and in an unhinged state, who knows what he's capable of? Fear likely also played a part in the Titan crew's compliance as much as anything else.

Except Riker has done nothing but act like a complete unstable lunatic for the past half book with completely obvious mental lapses while basically throwing a tantrum on the bridge plus’s illegally detaining the Captain and CMO after they relieved him of duty
 
I'm reading this for the first time and am on Book 2. I don't have my copy of Book nearby, but didn't Hegol Den die in the first book? Because he's very much alive in the second one.
 
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