Spoilers Star Trek: Strange New Worlds 1x05 - "Spock Amok"

[Trekker4747]

Non hetero had more than 10% representation now I'm tv and movies especially tv. The estimates are 20% much larger by about 2x than the actual non hetero population. I have no trouble with representation I do have a problem with over representation and changing established character to make a statement which is what modern writers want to do.

Heterosexuals have been the focus of society for pretty much its entire existence, probably around 10,000 years. I think we can handle them taking a seat more towards the middle of the bus for a while. Those who've not been represented, misrepresented, and outright abused deserve some focus for a while.

Again, relax, heterosexuals aren't going anywhere they just might -gasp- not be the focus of attention in a TV series or movie here and there. Stop clutching your pearls, you'll break the strand.

 

[UssGlenn]

Or a… gasp… actual non binary person. But then I am not sure the show runners were aware back then of non binary people’s existence.

I am sure many people are not aware of their own non binary nature out of ignorance or ingrained social expectations.

It was 1992, I'm not sure most LGBT people in 1992 knew non-binary was a thing. It certainly didn't enter the general public's consciousness until very recently.

But on this show, you've got Ortegas, maybe Chapel,

When was Ortegas implied to be LGBT?

 

[ToddCam]

As I said, self-reporting. If a pollster called me and asked me if I were gay/LGBTQ+, I would be very wary to this day of being honest.

 

[Jedi Marso]

Frakes was vocal on such an idea so were many others. Berman rejected because he was worried it'd go too far and jeopardize the numbers they had buying the episodes.

Yep.

It was a totally understandable decision on the part of Berman back in those days, but I still claim it was a copout. If you want to be edgy, be edgy. Don't half-ass. I'd argue that even in 1990 or so, it would have been less controversial than having Shatner kiss Nichols onscreen in the 60's.

 

[ToddCam]

It was 1992, I'm not sure most LGBT people in 1992 knew non-binary was a thing. It certainly didn't enter the general public's consciousness until very recently.




When was Ortegas implied to be LGBT?

Her hair cut, I guess?

 

[Weyoun 251]

Her hair cut, I guess?

I was about to say the same.

I've been to enough ska punk/emo gigs to know that the assumption is born out of stereotypes about lesbians than any real basis

 

[Jedi Marso]

It was 1992, I'm not sure most LGBT people in 1992 knew non-binary was a thing. It certainly didn't enter the general public's consciousness until very recently.




When was Ortegas implied to be LGBT?

Since the trailers, hasn't she? She looks and comes across as pretty butch.

 

[Trekker4747]

Her hair cut, I guess?

That'd be my guess. Her general look is on par with a stereotypical lesbian from a 90s sitcom or movie. But nothing in the show has said either way. I think even the actress is straight. (or maybe Bi.)

 

[wayoung]

Just FYI those numbers everyone are quoting are generationally skewed. Boomers don't identify as LGTBQ+ , Gen Z do in big numbers, with a sliding scale for Millenials and X. As LGBTQ+ becomes more and more accepted and people become less shamed about, representation increases, and people stop fearing for their lives, careers, families, and friends, the number of people go up. No reason to suspect this won't continue to be the case, as the Kinsey scale suggests virtually no one is purely straight.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2021/02/24/gen-z-lgbt/

Additionally, saying "20% of people on TV/Films being LGBTQ makes them overrepresented when they only make up ___ population!" requires a very select window of TV/Film. Nobody grows up watching just The CW's new shows. Expand that window to the last ten years and the 20% drops like a rock. 20 years. 30 years. 40 years. Etc.

 

[DaveyNY]

It says "turbolift two floor shout" which is what they did, Number 1 called for the Bridge La'an called for Engineering. Two floors. Not specifically turbolift #2.

It should be read like this "TURBO LIFT: TWO-FLOOR SHOUTOUT"

 

[TRON JA307020]

But that‘s the thing. Unless you can point to a character that was clear cut established as hetero, you cannot say they changed something fundamental about the character. They expanded them or filled in blanks that could go either way.

Also, I don’t think it‘s over representing necessarily either.
I am sure many people are not aware of their own non binary nature out of ignorance or ingrained social expectations. They simply never considered that they could be not entirely cos hetero. As long as they manage to fit their life into those categories it‘s no problem for them and they have no reason to expand their horizon and self explore.

I did that for over 40 years. I only recently started to consider that I might be on the ace spectrum, which explains a lot of things about myself.

Yeah but in this 40 years you probably knew on some level. For example a heterosexual male who loves women and thinks about them all the time, is sexuslly attracted to them all the time dates, dates them all the time is probably not 40 years later going to decide that he was all along also attracted to men also decide to start dating men. There most likely has to be a early attraction there and just doesn't happen decades later.

 

[cooleddie74]

 

[TRON JA307020]

Just FYI those numbers everyone are quoting are generationally skewed. Boomers don't identify as LGTBQ+ , Gen Z do in big numbers, with a sliding scale for Millenials and X. As LGBTQ+ becomes more and more accepted and people become less shamed about, representation increases, and people stop fearing for their lives, careers, families, and friends, the number of people go up. No reason to suspect this won't continue to be the case, as the Kinsey scale suggests virtually no one is purely straight.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2021/02/24/gen-z-lgbt/

Additionally, saying "20% of people on TV/Films being LGBTQ makes them overrepresented when they only make up ___ population!" requires a very select window of TV/Film. Nobody grows up watching just The CW's new shows. Expand that window to the last ten years and the 20% drops like a rock. 20 years. 30 years. 40 years. Etc.

No one is purely straight? So all heterosexuals want to have sex with same sex partners?

 

[ToddCam]

Just FYI those numbers everyone are quoting are generationally skewed. Boomers don't identify as LGTBQ+ , Gen Z do in big numbers, with a sliding scale for Millenials and X. As LGBTQ+ becomes more and more accepted and people become less shamed about, representation increases, and people stop fearing for their lives, careers, families, and friends, the number of people go up. No reason to suspect this won't continue to be the case, as the Kinsey scale suggests virtually no one is purely straight.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2021/02/24/gen-z-lgbt/

Additionally, saying "20% of people on TV/Films being LGBTQ makes them overrepresented when they only make up ___ population!" requires a very select window of TV/Film. Nobody grows up watching just The CW's new shows. Expand that window to the last ten years and the 20% drops like a rock. 20 years. 30 years. 40 years. Etc.

This. I am in that Xennial area (generations are really the dumbest labeling for labeling-sake) and I only came out to a few people about 10 years ago, and I put a pause on it after the 2016 night club massacre (I'm also Latino so that was especially affecting). But a couple years ago I started back up again because I am just so tired and now on this forum I won't shut up about it. But I will probably always be wary of being murdered for it.

 

[DaveyNY]

Yeah but in this 40 years you probably knew on some level. For example a heterosexual male who loves women and thinks about them all the time, is sexuslly attracted to them all the time dates, dates them all the time is probably not 40 years later going to decide that he was all along also attracted to men also decide to start dating men. There most likely has to be a early attraction there and just doesn't happen decades later.

Everything you just posted is wrong.

Don't base other peoples life experiences on your own.
You have no clue.

Also, you are very much coming across as being extremely judgmental in this conversation.
It's not a good look.

 

[Lakenheath 72]

I find some of the responses infuriating. I do not see the logic in what is being said. It makes sense to me that they would specify which turbolift should be used as many of the starships and stations of the 23rd and 24th century have numerous turbolifts and they are numbered. If you do not believe me, go to the transcript page and, in the search page, type in "turbolift [number]". I have found examples from TNG, DS9, and VOY.

 

[ToddCam]

No one is purely straight? So all heterosexuals want to have sex with same sex partners?

Yes.
[/sarcasm]

Wanting to have sex with is not the only thing about sexuality. I consider myself gay, but I also am sometimes attracted to women. They are mostly beautiful, tbh. I don't want to have sex with them, though.

 

[DaveyNY]

I find some of the responses infuriating. I do not see the logic in what is being said. It makes sense to me that they would specify which turbolift should be used as many of the starships and stations of the 23rd and 24th century have numerous turbolifts and they are numbered. If you do not believe me, go to the transcript page and, in the search page, type in "turbolift [number]". I have found examples from TNG, DS9, and VOY.

Because it's not the LOCATION OF THE TURBO LIFT that's the intention of that particular quest.

It's being the one to get the computer to acknowledge Your Request before the other person, who is also shouting a LOCATION.

Thus TWO Different Locations are requested at the same time.

 

[TRON JA307020]

Everything you just posted is wrong.

Don't base other peoples life experiences on your own.
You have no clue.

Also, you are very much coming across as being extremely judgmental in this conversation.
It's not a good look.

I'm using my own experience as a human.

 

[DaveyNY]

I'm using my own experience as a human.

Yes, and you are very much positing that experience on other's.

As I said, you have no clue.

Your assumptions are particularly wrong in this instance.