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Spoilers Loki season one discussion thread

This whole time, nagging at the back of my head, I've wondered about the nature of pruning. If it was something that could be done so easily with the batons the hunters carry, why don't they just prune everyone right way? Why all of the bureaucracy?

And then Mobius was "pruned." No way we've seen the last of Owen Wilson.

But then Loki was "pruned," too.

Of course the star of the show wasn't actually dead and the show didn't try to make use wait a week until reveal he was actually still alive (I'll get to that scene later). However, it does raise the question of what exactly is pruning and whether it was consistently portrayed throughout the series. Has every instance we seen thus far, from the mouthy inmate Loki saw at the beginning of the series to Mobius been actual instances of people being completely removed from existence? Or have they all been sent somewhere or somewhen else? Or was Loki's "pruning" an isolated incident? If so, why this time (aside from avoiding killing off the lead character) and did Ravonna deliberately cause that isolated incident? Or did the variant Lokis intervene in some manner? I'm probably waaay overthinking this, but like I said before, it's something that's been nagging at me this whole time.

Unsurprisingly, the Time Keepers, at least as presented at the TVA by Ravonna, are all a façade. Merely a wizard's trick. But who is actually behind the curtain? I don't think it's simply Ravonna herself but she is in on it. I also think the Time Keepers did actually exist at some point but no longer do for whatever reason, or maybe they weren't ever as grand and powerful as the TVA have built them up to be.

I found it odd that the opening flashback showed young Sylvie just happily playing with her toys, seemingly minding her own business, when the TVA popped up to arrest her and accuse her of crimes against the "sacred timeline." Was she arrested for something she had already done and they took their, er, time to show up or did they show up to prevent her from causing a Nexus Event? I was relieved to see later on in the elevator that even Sylvie doesn't know the exact nature of the Nexus Event she supposedly caused. I'm not saying it was something that the TVA fabricated but there is definitely something highly dubious about the nature of that situation, further evidenced by Ravonna's evasion about it ("I don't remember").

Now getting back to the mid-credits scene: Wow, how about that for a reveal?! I actually forgot for a moment that Richard E. Grant was going to show up at some point and I'm absolutely thrilled that my previous speculation that he would be playing another Loki variant was correct. But I didn't expect him to play a version with the early comics costume! I love it! I cannot wait to watch him chew the scenery with Tom Hiddleston! As for the other three variants with him, I have no idea what's going on there (especially the baby crocodile/alligator) so I'm curious to know if they also have any comic connections.

Lastly, the biggest surprise of the whole episode wasn't that scene. It was, of course, the long-awaited return of Jaimie Alexander as Sif! We already knew she was returning in Love and Thunder but it was awesome to see her show up in a bad memory time loop used to punish Loki. Perfection! :lol:
 
I'm not knowledgeable in Norse mythology, but someone on the MCU wiki claims that Loki cut Sif's hair in the mythology as well and that might be a reference to it.

One of the Lokis is holding a Hammer, I wonder if it's a version of Mjolnir, and that Loki was worthy in his timeline.
 
Unsurprisingly, the Time Keepers, at least as presented at the TVA by Ravonna, are all a façade. Merely a wizard's trick. But who is actually behind the curtain? I don't think it's simply Ravonna herself but she is in on it. I also think the Time Keepers did actually exist at some point but no longer do for whatever reason, or maybe they weren't ever as grand and powerful as the TVA have built them up to be.

I still think Ravonna could be behind the TVA. She did not seem phased at all when the Time Keepers were killed and were revealed to be androids. And she has seemed to be in control and keeping information close to her.

But I do like your theory that the Time Keepers existed at some point and were replaced by the androids in order to keep the TVA going after they were gone.

I know there is also the theory that Kang the Conqueror is a Time Keeper. It is possible Kang created the TVA in order to make sure that the timeline where he conquers the galaxy happens. Perhaps, Kang created the android Time Keepers in order to keep up the facade of the Time Keepers in order to maintain the authority of the TVA.

But it could be something else entirely.

I found it odd that the opening flashback showed young Sylvie just happily playing with her toys, seemingly minding her own business, when the TVA popped up to arrest her and accuse her of crimes against the "sacred timeline." Was she arrested for something she had already done and they took their, er, time to show up or did they show up to prevent her from causing a Nexus Event?

I think it is mentioned that the TVA waited until Sylvie became a big enough change in the sacred timeline. That is why they waited to grab her when she was a few years old instead of grabbing her at birth. As a newborn, she could not really change the timeline but as she got older, she could. I am not sure it makes sense though. If her very existence was a nexus event, I am not sure why waiting until she is older would make a difference.
 
Great episode. A lot happened. But I do feel like the 2 Loki's falling in love should not have caused a nexus event since they were in an apocalypse. The 2 Loki's falling in love would not matter since they were about to die. That was the whole point that Loki explained in an earlier episode: changes don't matter in an apocalypse since everything is destroyed anyway. So I feel like the show basically broke their own rules in order to advance the plot. The show needed a way for Mobius to find Loki and save him, so they came up with this exception out of the blue so that Mobius would detect Loki and be able to save him just in time.
 
I'm not knowledgeable in Norse mythology, but someone on the MCU wiki claims that Loki cut Sif's hair in the mythology as well and that might be a reference to it.

One of the Lokis is holding a Hammer, I wonder if it's a version of Mjolnir, and that Loki was worthy in his timeline.
Loki cut Sif's hair and she got a golden wig. Sorry, I don't have a copy of the Eddas handy to give a page number.
I was thinking the same thing about the hammer.

Overall, an incredible episode. Just thinking, I've had some of my best "moments" masturbating, so is it really such an abomination to be with an (opposite? appropriate?) gender version of myself? For the God of Mischief I think it's awesome. I guess if one adheres to certain religions that are against spilling one's seed it would be naughty. Personally, learning to love yourself is the greatest love of all. (Listen. It's remarkably Loki-appropriate.)
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And "Holy Wizard of Oz Batman!!! " This isn't unexpected, but well done!
The 2 Loki's falling in love would not matter since they were about to die.
Unless their getting together and getting it on in itself did some kind of timeline mischief/reset. Otherwise, the TVA seems to have some special need for Sylvie, so once noticing the "variance surge" they had to jump in and grab them. I'm feeling it's a combination of both.
 
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The pruning device beams them somewhere else. Knocks them out of the timeline. I think the TVA agents probably believed these people were being disintegrated or vaporized. But apparently it sends them out of the timeline and they land somewhere else. It occured to me from Ep 1 that it might be that these people are not dead. And now we see that they are alive somewhere else. Since those appeared to be other Lokis at the end, one assumes there is some dimension outside that particular timeline where they can coexist.

Lokis with different ages, different genders, different histories. Why two of them forming a deep enough connection while together in the "sacred" timeline would cause some branching or anomaly is not clear. Initially we heard that nothing matters on an apocalypse world, but that must be wrong. What if you went to Vesuvius with a device that would stop the Volcano eruption? Nothing matters, unless you do something that matters. And something about Loki squared mattered. I assume we will hear more about that.
 
I wanted to see young Sylvie pulling a prank or some other mischief but I guess that wouldn't have been as pointless of a moment to take her which I think is part of the story. Nice to see Walking Dead's Cailey Fleming, she's already got Walking Dead, Star Wars and now Marvel on her resume and she's not even old enough to drive.

Even before the reveals you could sense it was going to fall apart when we started seeing back at the TVA characters talking about their lives outside work in a way we haven't seen before. You have some people don't know what a fish is but if you start talking hopes and dreams it's harder to buy that there's full buy-in on the mission with everybody.

Does Hunter B-15 have a glass jaw or what?!?

The delivery of the setup promised by the end credits should be fun to see.
 
"We may lose, sometimes painfully, but we don't die. We survive." Beautiful line.
Hiddleston IS a figgan demi-god. (Reference to Frigga was a happy coincidence.) His ability to make his character real and deliver lines like that with such force, or say something with just a scoff and a shake of his head that some other actor would need three paragraphs of exposition? I would watch this guy looking in the mirror shaving and it would beat 90% of other actors making a speech.
 
I wonder if the Nexus Event was that for once a Loki actually cared for someone other than himself, something that would inspire him to do something greater instead of playing his predetermined role of a villain.
Could be, but I had the impression Sylvie-Loki started out caring about others. It's interesting to think that "our" Loki may have started out the same way.
 
While dozing off earlier, I suddenly had a thought: What if Miss Minutes is far more than what she appears to be? I know someone joked about that back when the season started, but now I think there might be something to that, especially considering the hints Tara Strong suggested in a recent interview about not seeing the last of her.

Of course, the obvious answer would be Kang (either she's a projection of him or a minion of his), but my groggy mind went somewhere else, which made more sense then than now: What if she's one of those Jack Kirby cosmic beings? I don't know much about them beyond what we see in the original Infinity Gauntlet mini-series, but I think there was one that represented time.

Or, again, I might be overthinking this. :lol:

I'm not knowledgeable in Norse mythology, but someone on the MCU wiki claims that Loki cut Sif's hair in the mythology as well and that might be a reference to it.
Oh, duh, of course. I should've made that connection. I'm a huge fan of Norse mythology and recently read Neil Gaiman's retellings of the most well-known ones. That moment is a wonderful reference to them.

One of the Lokis is holding a Hammer, I wonder if it's a version of Mjolnir, and that Loki was worthy in his timeline.
I noticed that as well. Like I said in my review, I wonder if that's a reference to the comics in someway or of this is an MCU original idea.

I still think Ravonna could be behind the TVA. She did not seem phased at all when the Time Keepers were killed and were revealed to be androids. And she has seemed to be in control and keeping information close to her.
I agree she's part of it but I don't think she's the driving force. Remember in the flashback, she was a mere hunter and the TVA was already operating.

I know there is also the theory that Kang the Conqueror is a Time Keeper. It is possible Kang created the TVA in order to make sure that the timeline where he conquers the galaxy happens. Perhaps, Kang created the android Time Keepers in order to keep up the facade of the Time Keepers in order to maintain the authority of the TVA.

But it could be something else entirely.
The Kang theory makes a lot of sense especially considering we know he's already coming. I wouldn't be surprised if this series turns out it's going to lead into Quantumania much like Wandavision leads into Multiverese of Madness.

I think it is mentioned that the TVA waited until Sylvie became a big enough change in the sacred timeline. That is why they waited to grab her when she was a few years old instead of grabbing her at birth. As a newborn, she could not really change the timeline but as she got older, she could. I am not sure it makes sense though. If her very existence was a nexus event, I am not sure why waiting until she is older would make a difference.
Ah, that does sound familiar. I plan on rewatching the episodes before the finale but I imagine her situation will become clearer before then (or maybe not).

The pruning device beams them somewhere else. Knocks them out of the timeline. I think the TVA agents probably believed these people were being disintegrated or vaporized. But apparently it sends them out of the timeline and they land somewhere else. It occured to me from Ep 1 that it might be that these people are not dead. And now we see that they are alive somewhere else. Since those appeared to be other Lokis at the end, one assumes there is some dimension outside that particular timeline where they can coexist.
Yeah, that makes a lot of sense and would be the easiest explanation to resolve my earlier queries.

Makes me wonder if and when we catch up with Mobius whether his realm is full of Owen Wilsons or if we'll see some kind of variations...such as a Luke Wilson?

I wonder if the Nexus Event was that for once a Loki actually cared for someone other than himself, something that would inspire him to do something greater instead of playing his predetermined role of a villain.
I like that idea a lot. That adds to Loki's growth as a person, similar to MCU film Loki but getting there by a completely different path.

Could be, but I had the impression Sylvie-Loki started out caring about others. It's interesting to think that "our" Loki may have started out the same way.
The ironic twist being that the TVA's meddling made Sylvie more self-centered and only caring about herself.
 
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Hiddleston IS a figgan demi-god. (Reference to Frigga was a happy coincidence.) His ability to make his character real and deliver lines like that with such force, or say something with just a scoff and a shake of his head that some other actor would need three paragraphs of exposition? I would watch this guy looking in the mirror shaving and it would beat 90% of other actors making a speech.
That's the greatest thing to come out of these Marvel series. These actors are given the breathing room to shine and the writing for the most part has been top notch. They pulled out the boat with the budget but the most memorable parts for me are the quieter moments where we see who the characters really are.
 
Could be, but I had the impression Sylvie-Loki started out caring about others. It's interesting to think that "our" Loki may have started out the same way.
I think that's how Loki would act if given the chance. He's just forced to play the villain. He clearly cares about his family, even when angry at them he would constantly show remorse when he realized he went too far. More so with Odin and Frigga when he just looks like a kid who immediately regrets what he did. The Loki we've been following is basically a kid who has been acting out his whole life, but he's a god so instead of stealing his dad's car he tries to take over Earth. Sylvie seems like she's been in fight or flight mode her entire life, I can't really get a read of who she would without this ongoing trauma.

I like that idea a lot. That adds to Loki's growth as a person, similar to MCU film Loki but getting there by a completely different path.
Loki has never really come off as an actual villain or evil, just a hurt person who ends up hurting other people. Odin could've nipped some problems in the bud by taking the family to therapy.

That's the greatest thing to come out of these Marvel series. These actors are given the breathing room to shine and the writing for the most part has been top notch. They pulled out the boat with the budget but the most memorable parts for me are the quieter moments where we see who the characters really are.
Marvel Studios has done some outstanding casting over the years, it's wonderful that they've finally been able to show the full depth they can bring to the characters.
 
Loki has never really come off as an actual villain or evil, just a hurt person who ends up hurting other people. Odin could've nipped some problems in the bud by taking the family to therapy.
I wonder what would have happened if Loki knew he was a adopted from the start.
 
Loki has never really come off as an actual villain or evil, just a hurt person who ends up hurting other people. Odin could've nipped some problems in the bud by taking the family to therapy.
It's always come across to me as being all about him and Thor, which is not hard to believe.

Going back to the first Thor movie, he wasn't out to kill Odin or conquer Asgard; he wanted out of Thor's shadow. His methods were over the top, but for a being thousands of years old I think his goals were fairly humble.

Fast forward to Thor: Ragnorok, I think he and Thor had a believable relationship, neither of them entirely right or wrong. The Loki we saw on the Asgardian refugee ship when Thanos shows up was certainly not a villain.

ETA: And why did no one tell me about this new MODOK series? Jeese Louis!
 
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