Was TNG less progressive than TOS?

[Nerys Myk]

TOS never did because killing and eating meat isn't barbaric, Kirk obviously found eating a meal that consisted of salad to be out of the ordinary.

Well he was forced into it by McCoy who was concerned about his weight. He prefers a nice chicken sandwich.
Spock, IIRC was the point man for vegetarianism in TOS.

 

[Mudd]

More a social /culture movement term, which can be discussed here without bringing in politics.

This statement is completely in error.

 

[Orphalesion]

Remember from season 1 when the Federation person was telling overtly the Delegate like how killing animals for food is barbarism? How was that not Progressive mindset? TOS never did that.

TOS never did because killing and eating meat isn't barbaric, Kirk obviously found eating a meal that consisted of salad to be out of the ordinary.

Makes you wonder what happened to a lot of domesticated animals like cows, pigs, chicken etc. In Star Trek if they aren't, as Riker puts it, "enslaved" for their meat and other animal products anymore.
I know some people, sometimes keep pigs as pets, but cows? Did all those domestic animal breeds that were raised for food go extinct? Or were they all returned to the wilderness, wrecking havoc on the local ecosystems?
Though on the other hand, in a world were meat, leather, milk, eggs, etc all can be replicated, there is less/no reason to go through all the effort of raising a cow for steaks.

I agree that there's nothing barbaric about eating meat or raising an animal for consumption and other animal products...as long as all of that, including the slaughtering, happens in as humane a manner as possible.

 

[Nakita Akita]

Makes you wonder what happened to a lot of domesticated animals like cows, pigs, chicken etc. In Star Trek if they aren't, as Riker puts it, "enslaved" for their meat and other animal products anymore.
I know some people, sometimes keep pigs as pets, but cows? Did all those domestic animal breeds that were raised for food go extinct? Or were they all returned to the wilderness, wrecking havoc on the local ecosystems?
Though on the other hand, in a world were meat, leather, milk, eggs, etc all can be replicated, there is less/no reason to go through all the effort of raising a cow for steaks.

I agree that there's nothing barbaric about eating meat or raising an animal for consumption and other animal products...as long as all of that, including the slaughtering, happens in as humane a manner as possible.

I'm not sure how you can humanely slaughter animals.
Do you know of any ways?
Are there countries that practice this on a regular basis presently?
Steer currently being lead to slaughter know that they are going to be killed. Some of them try to escape. Yep, it happens, my brother worked briefly in a local slaughter house.
A clean kill on a wild animal is probably the most humane.
It's probably somewhat akin to being struck dead by lightening or killed instantly say in a car crash. Yep, humane

 

[Orphalesion]

I'm not sure how you can humanely slaughter animals.
Do you know of any ways?
Are there countries that practice this on a regular basis presently?
Steer currently being lead to slaughter know that they are going to be killed. Some of them try to escape. Yep, it happens, my brother worked briefly in a local slaughter house.
A clean kill on a wild animal is probably the most humane.
It's probably somewhat akin to being struck dead by lightening or killed instantly say in a car crash. Yep, humane

That's why I wrote "as humane as possible"
As long as there's some effort to be made to make the whole thing as bearable for the animal as possible, it's already worth something. No battery farming, for example, no letting the animal bleed out. Etc.
Of course it's not possible and even the relatively humane way cows are slaughtered in the EU (with an electric bolt to the brain) only instnatly kills the animal in (irrc) 90% of the cases. But it's better than nothing.

And well, an animal that's hunted also experiences stress and fear. It knows that it's being hunted and that it will die if the hunter catches it.
Unless we are talking about an extremely stealthy situation were the hunter managed to stalk the animal completely without its knowledge and killed it like a sniper.
I don't know enough about hunting to tell how frequent such a situation would be.

 

[jaime]

This statement is completely in error.

Nope.

For example, you tie it explicitly to America in your earlier statement, but here in the UK our ‘right leaning’ party is the only one to have managed female leaders, and indeed female Prime Ministers, it also brought in gay marriage. No, it also did things that could swing it the other way, but to pretend that those things alone don’t come under the umbrella of ‘progressive’ would be disingenuous. ‘Progressive’ doesn’t have to be left or right, no matter what some on either wing would have you believe.

 

[Mytran]

Nope.

For example, you tie it explicitly to America in your earlier statement, but here in the UK our ‘right leaning’ party is the only one to have managed female leaders, and indeed female Prime Ministers, it also brought in gay marriage. No, it also did things that could swing it the other way, but to pretend that those things alone don’t come under the umbrella of ‘progressive’ would be disingenuous. ‘Progressive’ doesn’t have to be left or right, no matter what some on either wing would have you believe.

Of course, the American "right" (i.e. the Republican party) is WAY further over on the spectrum than the Conservative party, who I've seen it claimed are more or less on the same level as the USA's Democratic party.
FWIW

 

[Nakita Akita]

That's why I wrote "as humane as possible"
As long as there's some effort to be made to make the whole thing as bearable for the animal as possible, it's already worth something. No battery farming, for example, no letting the animal bleed out. Etc.
Of course it's not possible and even the relatively humane way cows are slaughtered in the EU (with an electric bolt to the brain) only instnatly kills the animal in (irrc) 90% of the cases. But it's better than nothing.

And well, an animal that's hunted also experiences stress and fear. It knows that it's being hunted and that it will die if the hunter catches it.
Unless we are talking about an extremely stealthy situation were the hunter managed to stalk the animal completely without its knowledge and killed it like a sniper.
I don't know enough about hunting to tell how frequent such a situation would be.

If you shoot from a tree stand, the animal is pretty much unaware the hunter is there.
I'm not sure of instances where a person is tracking an animal and the animal is aware of 'being hunted' enough to have fear.
They have general fear of unknown or known smells around them. Dogs, humans, bears,wolves. That is almost all animals.
Tree stand, clean shot, quick kill.
No quick kill, the hunter is an asshole and shouldn't be permitted to hunt any longer.
Some guy following some bleeding deer or elk for two miles should be sterilized after that.

 

[XCV330]

Some guy following some bleeding deer or elk for two miles should be sterilized after that.

That's bullshit. No one makes a clean shot all the time. You've basically just said anyone who bow hunts should be castrated.

 

[Mudd]

Nope.

Yep. See:

For example, you tie it explicitly to America in your earlier statement,.

I did, didn't I? Which obviates your objection.

Next.

 

[JesterFace]

I think all trek with the possible exception of DS9 portray women as eye candy.

DS9 and Kira. Tight pants.
TNG had Troi and her neckline was a little lower than on a standard uniform.
I'd say DS9 had more eyecandy than TNG.
But that's just me? I guess Kira is more my style.

 

[Mutai Sho-Rin]

We're done.