I think when I'm done with everything, I'm going to have like 50+ pages of spoiler spaces to read.
The Stargate Franchise - A First Timer's Watchthrough
- Thread starter tomalak301
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I think when I'm done with everything, I'm going to have like 50+ pages of spoiler spaces to read.
That would have been great. I would have loved to see Weir negotiate something with the Ancients. Heck, I would have loved to see one Ancient stay on Atlantis as a semi-regular character on the show. I think having that perspective of a character who knows how Atlantis works but also gets to interact with these future humans and see what they do with Atlantis would have been cool. "The Return" is a great action two-parter but one aspect of it that really disappointed me that how it treated the Ancients. The cold open is great. A mysterious ship is traversing the space between galaxy and behold, our characters finally meet real living breathing Ancients from the time period when Atlantis was at its prime. And then the episode kills them off screen to focus on a "recapture the base" plot. Seeing our characters defeat the Replicators and recapture Atlantis was great fun but I would have loved to see more done with the Ancients. Plus the episode makes these Ancients pretty dumb and useless which I hated. They don't appreciate everything that our characters have done in saving them and in restoring Atlantis. And they arrogantly assume the Replicators can't hurt them and get wiped out again.
^ That's kind of the reason I don't like Atlantis and got worse as it went on. I hated that too.
But mine are more important. This one is fun. :-P
I think when I'm done with everything, I'm going to have like 50+ pages of spoiler spaces to read.
But mine are more important. This one is fun. :-P
They seemed to realize they'd been giving the Ancients the ol' "Worf Effect" to kick off plots on Atlantis, and seemed to begin leaning into it at the end of the show. I think there was a bit in the last season where McKay started complaining the city was just full of disastrous, ill-thought-out scientific boondoggles. The implication might've been that most of the last generation of Ancients were not the best of the best, and had been arrogantly coasting on the reputation and achievements of their own ancestors, the ancient Ancients, and didn't realize they weren't living up to their own legacy. Born on third base and think they hit a triple, Dunning-Kruger, pick your metaphor, but, you know, maybe after millions upon millions of years of the wisest, most moral Ancients shedding their bodies to become beings of pure energy, the ones that were left on Atlantis were hardly any closer to the gate-builders than the goatherds they'd been scattering around the Pegasus galaxy, they could just make bigger messes.
It's a bit orthogonal to Stargate's action-adventure focus, but I feel like it'd be a great thing to explore in a novel, just what it must've been like to be an Ancient. We're talking tens of millions of years of history, people turning into energy-squids being an everyday thing, but these folks still put on their beige pants on leg at a time just like everyone else. Doctor Who has played with concepts like that with the Time Lords, or the humans of the distant future, and there's also Halo's Forerunners, but the Ancients, as we've seen them, were so much more human, directly, recognizably so, for so long, and that feels like a different nut to crack.
My thoughts on season 7...
I would agree that the whole is better than the parts. Although most of the two-parters were excellent, the amount of them gave the season the impression of being much smaller. Despite the storylines going farther.
I have to disagree with people about the Unas episodes... I've loved each of them. "ENEMY MINE" was particularly great, to me anyway.
"DEATH KNELL" had a LOT happening, and was a great Sam hour.
I will say this... SG-1 and SGA are both great shows, and I loved them from the start.
STARGATE UNIVERSE, though, took me a while to truly enjoy. I was not a fan in the first half of season 1, but I promised myself I would give the full season a chance. And the back half was better, though not greatly. Season 2 was a VAST improvement, and I really became a fan. I was sad when it got the axe.
If you are going to go through the entire SG franchise, you should know that the tone of the first two shows is radically different from SGU... to the point where it almost feels like another franchise.
Season 1 of ATLANTIS is fantastic. I'll reserve my thoughts until you finish it.
I would agree that the whole is better than the parts. Although most of the two-parters were excellent, the amount of them gave the season the impression of being much smaller. Despite the storylines going farther.
I have to disagree with people about the Unas episodes... I've loved each of them. "ENEMY MINE" was particularly great, to me anyway.
"DEATH KNELL" had a LOT happening, and was a great Sam hour.
I will say this... SG-1 and SGA are both great shows, and I loved them from the start.
STARGATE UNIVERSE, though, took me a while to truly enjoy. I was not a fan in the first half of season 1, but I promised myself I would give the full season a chance. And the back half was better, though not greatly. Season 2 was a VAST improvement, and I really became a fan. I was sad when it got the axe.
If you are going to go through the entire SG franchise, you should know that the tone of the first two shows is radically different from SGU... to the point where it almost feels like another franchise.
Season 1 of ATLANTIS is fantastic. I'll reserve my thoughts until you finish it.
I think this is another thing I like about the whole episodic vs arc debate. In episodic storytelling, you have a lot more variety you can put into the overall big picture of the arc. If you don't like a specific thing, the next week is something you might like because it's about another specific thing. With arc storytelling where it's a 10 part story, the audience needs to be on board for that entire story and you don't have time to go on "tangents". If the audience is not on board with that straight story, they will feel the entire season, and series, will suffer because of it.
SG-1 is very underrated in its serialized storytelling approach. Most sci-fi fans only really talk about Babylon 5, BSG, and DS9 when it comes to long-form stories. But I feel SG-1 did a great job of spreading the plot out across many seasons while letting it still be episodic enough that you can pretty easily jump into most seasons, and letting the characters develop naturally.
Well, I don't know whether I'd call DS9 a long-form story. As much as it generally holds up in the end, it definitely wasn't pre-planned. In fact, I hate comparing DS9 to B5 precisely because B5 was, in the broad strokes, planned out from the beginning, and it's a long story well-told, while DS9 did a lot of ''not'' pre-planned storytelling. They're both great in their own ways.
Even Babylon 5 had those episodic episodes that provided a balance. If anything, and maybe it's too long of a season, I do prefer the B5, DS9, and Farscape approach to storytelling. Maybe if you want to have a sweet spot of 13 to 15 episodes in a season, fine, but a lot of the TV I see today does feel rushed or "not organic" because they don't have time to develop characters in a plot focused season.
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I think it all depends on the execution. Farscape was hit and miss for me with the serialized storytelling but when it did it well it did it well. But, DS9 feels like it landed it more consistently. Stargate is much more of a mix that I really like.
I liked Stargate Universe a lot as well. It might look bad when compared to Galatica which of course everyone did back then but I feel like it actually made space travel seem scary and dangerous in away that it's not always done.
Jason
Rising (SG:A)
That was a very very good start to Atlantis. We start at the Antarctic outpost with some nice cameos from Jack and Daniel and it doesn't take long to finally reach the lost city. It only took a season, then a two part episode, then about 20 minutes into the premiere but I have to say it was worth the wait.
I think the first thing I noticed about this series was it's production values feel a lot bigger and grandiose than SG-1. I mean to see Atlantis light up for the first time made me feel like I was in a different world. I think the thing that gave me goosebumps the most was when the city actually rose out of the ocean. I don't know how long that scene was, but it felt like the scene in Star Trek: The Motion Picture when Kirk and Scotty were flying around the Enterprise. It was a grand moment, with some amazing music and then when we first see the city on the surface, it's a great glimpse on how epic that whole thing looks. They really did spare no expense in designing Atlantis and it really looks beautiful.
As for the rest of the episodes, so far I like Sheppard, Weir and Beckett. McKay still sounds annoying (Something I hope happens as I go, maybe allow Dr. Weir to finish some sentence instead of interrupting her a lot), and I'm not entirely sure about Tayla yet. I do appreciate that her people are not going to be enemies and the Atlantis team has a conduit to this new Galaxy though, so I hope they are used well as the season goes along.
The Wraith are already damn scary. I appreciated how alien they looked and it looks like they will be very formidable. Those scenes between the woman Wrath and Sumner were a little scary, especially making him age as rapidly as she did. I also loved that we got a nice space action sequence to end this episode, and the idea of Stargates to space is a pretty cool one especially with the puddle jumpers (I counted at least 4) at Atlantis.
Also, I have a pretty dumb reason for really looking forward to Atlantis when I started this thread. I'm a fan of TV theme songs and title sequences, and I've always loved the Atlantis theme. We're in this new wondrous world, and the theme feels very majestic. I've also seen the Season 1 title sequence and I just love how fantastical everything looks. Based on the first episode, it feels like this show will be a whole lot more fantastical than SG-1, and I find that exciting.
That was a very very good start to Atlantis. We start at the Antarctic outpost with some nice cameos from Jack and Daniel and it doesn't take long to finally reach the lost city. It only took a season, then a two part episode, then about 20 minutes into the premiere but I have to say it was worth the wait.
I think the first thing I noticed about this series was it's production values feel a lot bigger and grandiose than SG-1. I mean to see Atlantis light up for the first time made me feel like I was in a different world. I think the thing that gave me goosebumps the most was when the city actually rose out of the ocean. I don't know how long that scene was, but it felt like the scene in Star Trek: The Motion Picture when Kirk and Scotty were flying around the Enterprise. It was a grand moment, with some amazing music and then when we first see the city on the surface, it's a great glimpse on how epic that whole thing looks. They really did spare no expense in designing Atlantis and it really looks beautiful.
As for the rest of the episodes, so far I like Sheppard, Weir and Beckett. McKay still sounds annoying (Something I hope happens as I go, maybe allow Dr. Weir to finish some sentence instead of interrupting her a lot), and I'm not entirely sure about Tayla yet. I do appreciate that her people are not going to be enemies and the Atlantis team has a conduit to this new Galaxy though, so I hope they are used well as the season goes along.
The Wraith are already damn scary. I appreciated how alien they looked and it looks like they will be very formidable. Those scenes between the woman Wrath and Sumner were a little scary, especially making him age as rapidly as she did. I also loved that we got a nice space action sequence to end this episode, and the idea of Stargates to space is a pretty cool one especially with the puddle jumpers (I counted at least 4) at Atlantis.
Also, I have a pretty dumb reason for really looking forward to Atlantis when I started this thread. I'm a fan of TV theme songs and title sequences, and I've always loved the Atlantis theme. We're in this new wondrous world, and the theme feels very majestic. I've also seen the Season 1 title sequence and I just love how fantastical everything looks. Based on the first episode, it feels like this show will be a whole lot more fantastical than SG-1, and I find that exciting.
A weird thing with the pilot. Only Jack and Daniel are in it because of legal issues.For some reason only the movie peeps could be in it. I find that weird. Legal things on TV shows are insane.
But Atlantis sets are really awesome. I do love how they feel alien even though they are made by humans and look like it in ways.
Oh no, the theme songs are great. Sci-fi Channel tried cutting the openings to fit more commercials. It wasn't taken well.
But Atlantis sets are really awesome. I do love how they feel alien even though they are made by humans and look like it in ways.
Oh no, the theme songs are great. Sci-fi Channel tried cutting the openings to fit more commercials. It wasn't taken well.
As I recall, it's more economic than legal. It's the same reason T'Pol wasn't T'Pau on Enterprise, and Tom Paris wasn't Nick Locarno on Voyager. Reusing a character meant that royalties had to be paid to the writer(s) who originally came up with them. If you have Jack in an episode, you can get Daniel for free (as far as those royalties go). Likewise, since they were both invented for SG-1 and first appeared in "Children of the Gods," Sam and Teal'c (and Hammond and Walter) can appear together for only one set of writer royalties. It's not iron-clad, sometimes they splurged (more often in Universe than Atlantis), but the vast majority of the time, you'll see in Atlantis and Universe that SG-1 cameos usually respect the rule that movie characters and series characters are kept separate.
They finally got their way with SGU. I don't think they've ever let go. The Expanse has a gorgious (and frequently-updated) title sequence, but my understanding is the SyFy airings just used the short title that appears as the "Previously On..." card in the streaming and foreign version of the show. I only ever watched it via streaming, but iTunes (or, rather, the studio sending the files to iTunes) kept accidentally putting the SyFy version up for download and then quietly replacing it with the full version a few days or weeks later.
Oh, did any of the DVD commentaries or conventions reveal the lyrics to the Atlantis theme music? I know they said the first line, but I was curious about the rest.
(The lyrics to the SG-1 theme.)
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When I was watching Expanse on Amazon a couple years ago, I was always confused why some episodes would have the full theme and some episodes would not. Also, I love how they update the Expanse theme. It's part of the story, like how Game of Thrones was constantly updated as their universe was expanding.
Lockdown (SG-1)
Decent story, even though the whole alien essense invades someone has been done so many times before. I guess they wanted to get one more Anubis story in there somewhere. I did keep wondering if Anubis wanted to go through the gate so much, why not keep the Iris closed? Anubis needed a human host so they couldn't get through the Stargate anyway. My favorite stuff actually happened at the beginning of the episode, especially the scene where Daniel was wondering who shot him and Jack is looking around being all guilty and trying to hide it. I'm not sure how I feel about the new Doctor yet. I do miss Frasier.
Decent story, even though the whole alien essense invades someone has been done so many times before. I guess they wanted to get one more Anubis story in there somewhere. I did keep wondering if Anubis wanted to go through the gate so much, why not keep the Iris closed? Anubis needed a human host so they couldn't get through the Stargate anyway. My favorite stuff actually happened at the beginning of the episode, especially the scene where Daniel was wondering who shot him and Jack is looking around being all guilty and trying to hide it. I'm not sure how I feel about the new Doctor yet. I do miss Frasier.
Lockdown (SG-1)
I'm not sure how I feel about the new Doctor yet. I do miss Frasier.
Yep.
You ain't seen nothing yet, it only gets worse from here.
Hide and Seek (SG:A)
Lockdown and Hide and Seek were very similar episodes. Alien entities invading the base and the team must try to get rid of them. I liked the humor of this one, especially at the beginning with McKay enjoying the little alien shield, or Sheppard teaching Tayla the rules of Football (Where did he get all that popcorn). I'm liking the character interactions early on, and I'm starting to see a good side of McKay, at least when he talks to Carson and John. I also like that we are exploring more of Atlantis, like the transporter rooms and the lab where the Alien with kept. Looks like we might be learning more about the ancients in this series, as this one touched on the idea of ascension and the entity was kept as a way to study it to that end.
I will say on a final note that the guy who plays the Athosian Hallings (Father of the two kids, who I am actually kinda liking so far) reminds me of Viggo Mortanson from Lord of the Rings for some reason.
Lockdown and Hide and Seek were very similar episodes. Alien entities invading the base and the team must try to get rid of them. I liked the humor of this one, especially at the beginning with McKay enjoying the little alien shield, or Sheppard teaching Tayla the rules of Football (Where did he get all that popcorn). I'm liking the character interactions early on, and I'm starting to see a good side of McKay, at least when he talks to Carson and John. I also like that we are exploring more of Atlantis, like the transporter rooms and the lab where the Alien with kept. Looks like we might be learning more about the ancients in this series, as this one touched on the idea of ascension and the entity was kept as a way to study it to that end.
I will say on a final note that the guy who plays the Athosian Hallings (Father of the two kids, who I am actually kinda liking so far) reminds me of Viggo Mortanson from Lord of the Rings for some reason.
Something to remember about McKay in Rising compared to the other episodes is that He was originally written to be a character named Dr. Ingram. It was only a few days into filming that they decided to cast David Hewlett and make him McKay. So there are some differences in his behavior. Nothing too noticeable, but they are there.
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