What religion/faith are you?

[Locutus of Bored]

this is a bit off-topic but do we by any chance have any people of the Jewish persuasion posting here? I have two questions about Jewish funeral rites:

1) we have a tiny jewish cemetry here and some people piled stones on top of the tombstones. I am familiar with that custom only from stupas in the Himalayans. Do Jews do that as well or is it something un-Jewish and the stones ought to be removed from the tombstones? While on the one hand the cemetry managers are glad some people apparently mind, on the other hand they are uncertain if that particular practice mightn't be a desecration.

It's not a desecration, it's an ancient tradition.

https://www.chabad.org/library/arti...ish/Why-Do-Jews-Put-Pebbles-on-Tombstones.htm

2) Also, would flowers on the graves ok? Most pics I googled show only lawn, but I have found 2 where there are graves like Christian ones, only with ivy and other evergreens. Is it just a coincidence or are flowers frowned upon?

It's not a Jewish tradition, but if someone meant well it's not like anyone's going to hold it against them.

https://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/1218970/jewish/Flowers-Jews-Gravesites.htm

 

[rhubarbodendron]

thank you! Interesting that two cultures who live several thousand miles apart have developed similar customs - the stone piling, I mean. On the other hand, a tombstone is a sort of stone pile, too, just in one piece. Maybe piling up stones on graves is in human nature.
Which leads us directly back to this thread's topic: do your respective religions have similar customs? Are there any things that are strictly forbidden? For example: on Bavarian katholic cemetries, veggies on graves are forbidden but herbs are ok. I know one that's full of lemon thyme, sage, rosemary and savory. My mom and I are rarely of the same opinion but when we saw that grave we both said in unison: "that's what I want, too!"

 

[Doom Shepherd]

this is a bit off-topic but do we by any chance have any people of the Jewish persuasion posting here? I have two questions about Jewish funeral rites:
1) we have a tiny jewish cemetry here and some people piled stones on top of the tombstones. I am familiar with that custom only from stupas in the Himalayans. Do Jews do that as well or is it something un-Jewish and the stones ought to be removed from the tombstones? While on the one hand the cemetry managers are glad some people apparently mind, on the other hand they are uncertain if that particular practice mightn't be a desecration.

Show them Schindler’s List?

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[rhubarbodendron]

^I'd rather not rely on that one. With movies, particularly hollywood blockbusters, you can never be sure how well-researched they are and whether the information given in them is really precise.
I thought of asking a rabbi but as the next one lives some 80 miles away, I believe, and presumably is rather busy the BBS was the faster and simpler way to gather well-substantiated information.
And as the above posts show it worked

 

[ThankQ]

I'm an atheist, among other reasons, not because of the lack of evidence of something else, but because of the preponderance of evidence of invention across all religions.

 

[think]

yeap these days are the exciting adventures of Buddha at home.. ---

 

[AlanC9]

I'd count agnosticism as an aspect of atheism.


The very same here. The present state of the planet seems to me to prove that point beyond any doubt. No deity could stand by and watch their work getting ruined by morons.

It's a big goddamn universe. If one planet out of uncountable millions is full of idiots......

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Also, would flowers on the graves ok? Most pics I googled show only lawn, but I have found 2 where there are graves like Christian ones, only with ivy and other evergreens. Is it just a coincidence or are flowers frowned upon?

Flowers are not part of Jewish funerary or mourning practices. Unlike other religious systems, the notion of rebirth or transformation or ascension--some form of consciousness beyond death--is really peripheral and esoteric, sometimes having no place in Jewish upbringing. The focus is on separation and the person who is lost, not symbols or theology or anything that might distract from thinking about the deceased.

 

[rhubarbodendron]

ah, thanks for explaining. It just that the graves look so sad and uncared for, without flowers.
Would it be ok to clean the headstones? Some are so grown over with lichens and moss that the inscriptions can't be read anymore.

 

[think]

what is it about the rocks on the headstones I might see now and then?

 

[rhubarbodendron]

If I understood the principle correctly they are a sign that they are remembered. Every friend or family member who visits the grave puts a pebble on top of the headstone.
Interestingly, in India and Tibet there is a similar custom.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

ah, thanks for explaining. It just that the graves look so sad and uncared for, without flowers.
Would it be ok to clean the headstones? Some are so grown over with lichens and moss that the inscriptions can't be read anymore.

There's nothing prohibiting their cleaning, but I would generally leave it to someone who is a professional to do so. I don't know if they are treated the same way as Torah scrolls, but if the Hebrew writing is damaged--if it contains some element of scriptural writing--, it might require an expert to "make it kosher" again. Letting it decay would at least be natural.

 

[DarthTimon]

I find the very idea of an eternal life to be far more frightening than death. I wouldn't mind living for 1000 years, or 10000 years but I don't want an afterlife.

Also I cannot not understand why any sort of God would give a person's life purpose. One can quite easily have purpose without a god being in the picture.

There are loved ones I miss, but with my luck I would probably be reunited with my mother instead.

At the risk of going back very far into this thread, I sympathise with your thought about an eternal afterlife. It sounds weird to be... weirded, by the idea, but yeah, an infinity of existence, stretching out forever? In a way, from a very mortal standpoint, that's scary. I try to temper that thought with the idea that it's an infinity of bliss, happiness and joy, if such an afterlife exists.

On that, I just don't know. I want to believe, but reconciling that desire with the behaviour of God and the attitudes instilled by organised religion is hard for me to do.

 

[rhubarbodendron]

--if it contains some element of scriptural writing--, it might require an expert to "make it kosher" again.

Ah! I had not considered that aspect. Thank you! It's mostly just the names and dates but I'll take no risk. I just pass that part of the cemetry rather often and it always hits me how very sad and neglected those graves look, particularly the ones of children, compared to the rest of the cemetry. But that's propably the spring cleaning instinct getting the better of me

 

[Bad Thoughts]

Ah! I had not considered that aspect. Thank you! It's mostly just the names and dates but I'll take no risk. I just pass that part of the cemetry rather often and it always hits me how very sad and neglected those graves look, particularly the ones of children, compared to the rest of the cemetry. But that's propably the spring cleaning instinct getting the better of me

Here's an article that might interest you ... as well as give you a little insight into how to proceed if you do want to tidy up.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/in-it...es-a-jewish-cemetery-abandoned-for-centuries/

I can't account for all burial customs--maintenance of cemeteries goes into areas too obscure for my interests. Jews are generally more comfortable with the notion of decay: no form of embalming, and caskets are not treated. Conversely, some graves are pilgrimage sites for Hasidim. Context matters a lot as well--the local traditions and the feelings of local Jewish communities, if they still exist.

 

[rhubarbodendron]

there's no comunity to speak of. It's a rural area and the closest synagogue is 30 miles away. We had a camp for "displaced persons" in my town and those graves are the ones for some 20 people who after 1945 died here of the long-term health damage from their incarceration in concentration camps Most were adults but there is a grave for a baby that was born in erly 1946 and died after only few days. It's one of the few with German inscription. Most have Hebrew characters and from the shortness I conclude it's just the names. If you are interested, I can make photos.
Only the grave of a rabbi has a long inscription and an explanatory plaque. This way they all are so anonymous. I'd like to know more about the people behind the names and their individual histories.

 

[maneth]

Secular humanist here. I don't care enough about it to call myself an agnostic (meaning seeker) or atheist.

 

[Bad Thoughts]

there's no comunity to speak of. It's a rural area and the closest synagogue is 30 miles away. We had a camp for "displaced persons" in my town and those graves are the ones for some 20 people who after 1945 died here of the long-term health damage from their incarceration in concentration camps Most were adults but there is a grave for a baby that was born in erly 1946 and died after only few days. It's one of the few with German inscription. Most have Hebrew characters and from the shortness I conclude it's just the names. If you are interested, I can make photos.
Only the grave of a rabbi has a long inscription and an explanatory plaque. This way they all are so anonymous. I'd like to know more about the people behind the names and their individual histories.

No, my ability to read Hebrew is less than rudimentary.

This really sounds like a project for a municipal or regional authority, particularly if there are historical interests involved. There are a number of organizations that do attend to preventing Jewish cemeteries from falling into complete decay, especially if the land might be reclaimed or the gravestones repurposed or subjected to graffiti. Your town might find it to be a site of minor historical interest.

Any chance you would share your general location--not necessarily the town, but the state or province or department, whatever is relevant?

 

[rhubarbodendron]

Bavarian province of Lower Bavaria.
No, I propably mislead you. The town is interested and cares for the graves insofar as they mow the lawn and dig out the weeds. That's more than they do for the Christian graves since those are supposed to be cared for by relatives and if there are none, the graves get let up after about 20 years. The Jewish graves are meant to remain forever.
There is also a list of the people burried there and where they came from (refugees, concentration camp inmates etc) but there is little personal data beyond that usually listed on a passport. I would like to get to know them better, on a personal level. Were they happy persons or the worrying type, how did they deal with their problems, how did they get to my town in the first place, are there any relatives living who remember them?
I can't really explain why it interests me. Maybe it is because those tombstones are so alien. And maybe it's subconsciousely because politically the world seems to be back at 1932/33, what with all the racism and xenophobia resurrecting everywhere, like a weed you didn't pull out properly. People only fear what they don't know. If we get to know more about others, we start to like them and that's the best vaccination against fear and hatred. I imagine that if there was a plaque next to every Jewish grave explaining a bit about the person, then people might read them and understand. With only the Hebrew writing they are debarred from either.

 

[Ocanain]

I'm a Bill-ist. Believing in the awesome power of me, Bill.

I think they call that a narcissist. Haha