Star Trek Picard is not Star Trek

[Jonesy]

Now, now...everyone's entitled to poor taste; saying they're quitting but continuing to hate watch it; and coming on here to tell us about it.

The interesting part of that phenomena is that these people who continue to watch something they dislike will boost the viewership numbers through CBS All Access, (yes, they are for sure monitoring those views) or whatever channel they see it in outside of the US.

 

[Alexander Corrino]

I've been presented this argument pretty much every year since the has internet existed. __________ isn't Star Trek.

This. I came into the fandom when ENT was on and that "wasn't Star Trek" either. Then Abrams Trek "wasn't Star Trek". Then Discovery "wasn't Star Trek". And now Picard "isn't Star Trek". (And, from what I've seen and read and heard as blasts from the past, none of the other shows were ever Star Trek either.)

So... nothing is Star Trek. And if nothing is Star Trek, there is no actual Star Trek. Food for thought?

 

[Captain Killy]

Even if you ignore the aesthetic qualities that are completely at odds with Star Trek such as the camera angles, lighting, 20th/21st century dialogue ("Dude", "Protip", "My ass got fired", "We're shit out of luck"), etc., the plot makes no sense in universe.

Yes, cuz god forbid we should update our filming techniques, set design and FX to match current broadcast standards.

In the first episode we're told that 14 planets threatened to secede from the Federation if they offered humanitarian aid to Romulus. What? An alliance of dozens of species suddenly turned into bloodthirsty xenophobes? None of the various wars the Federation has fought did that to them and the Romulans were actually allies in the Dominion War.

Actually, it was the second episode and one could argue that it was because of those various (and quite recent) wars and conflicts (one of which was rather instigated by the Romulans) that the Federation has taken this more insular turn. I mean, after having lived through a full out enemy occupation (which I really wish we’d seen on screen) you can’t really blame the Betazoids for being a tad bit skittish these days. And the Andorians, well, they certainly have reason to be holding a grudge against the Romulans, I mean with that whole Kumari and Aenar abduction...thing.

There are lines of dialogue that imply that class distinctions exist in the Federation that come out of nowhere.

No we don’t. We do see Raffi living off the grid in the 24th century equivalent of a space trailer, albeit a space trailer with a sonic shower, fully functional replicator, super fast WiFi and free computer access to the entire Federation database. Plus, living in an utterly scenic location with no noisy neighbors to worry about while only a quick (free) flying taxi away from the nearest Transporter Hub. Not to mention all that advanced (and free) Trek quality healthcare and free travel privileges across the entire Federation. Not a bad situation overall if you ask me.

We see people smoking and learned in the most recent episode that one of the characters is a recovering drug addict. I mean, WTF?! I think there's an old TNG episode where Wesley had to have the whole concept of drug addiction explained to him and still couldn't wrap his head around it.

Yet, in that very same episode, Tasha Yar goes on to tell Wesley how on her own planet (a former Federation colony no less) drug addiction was a common place means of escape from the horrific life the residents had to endure there, part of which involved roving rape gangs.

In the latest episode we also had Seven take bloody revenge on like dozens of people. She waited until Picard had left the room because, apparently, she didn't want to disillusion a naive old man with how ugly the real world was. When the hell did this happen?! What happened between the Voyager finale and now to make Seven think this?

Someone murdered her kid...

The Romulans are scrappy underdogs after one of their stars explodes. You can possibly look at a star chart and make sense of them not being a major military power, but we're shown a refugee planet with sword-wielding Romulans that look like elves from LOTR (Come on! We were all thinking it!)

Not really. The Romulans were using swords. Elves OTOH use Bow and Arrows. Which as we all learned in TOS is more a Vulcan thing really...

Remember that plot in DS9 where the Federation was trying to donate some industrial replicators to the Cardassians when the Maquis stole them? Even if we were willing to accept that the Federation government wasn't willing to lift a finger to help a handful of refugees, are we expected to believe that out of countless billions of Federation citizens, Picard can scrap together enough donations so their planet doesn't look like something from the middle ages?

He could have, but as has been pointed out to him, several times now actually, he gave up.

Darkness and grit didn't just fall out of the sky in DS9. In Homefront/Paradise Lost for example Admiral Layton's attempted military coup was instigated by a terrorist attack, the likes of which Earth hadn't seen in over 100 years, carried out by shapeshifters who had infiltrated the government and were the leaders of a powerful military empire, and Sisko still managed to talk him down.

That didn’t happen. Once Sisko convinced Commander Benten that he wasn’t a changeling and that Leyton has been lying to her and Leyton lost most of his support he voluntary resigned before being thrown into prison. Of course this was not before Section 31 managed to infect Odo which a virus that nearly genocided his entire species...

 

[ITDUDE]

Another Bingo! Seriously these posts pop up faster than I can fill out my card

 

[Turtletrekker]

Hello.
I can't be more dissappointed with this new series. I'm 25, i grew up with Star Trek since my parents showed me some VHSs of The Original Series when i was 2. Since then i have loved this incredible world, from The Cage to the last season of Star Trek Enterprise.

The Federation, space exploration idea, the showing of a future in which humans leave in peace, respecting all forms of Life, aspiring to be better persons and know the universe we are surrounded by, surpassing racism, arrogance, hate, war... has always inspired me, i still think that Will happen in the future.

The epic adventure, wether were moral based episodes or spac battles, unforgettable friendships like Kirk-Spock , Bashir-O'Brien or Archer-T'pol are amazing, all is gone in this new "Star Trek".

Since Enterprise ended, the new Star Trek is not real. I didnt like JJ Abrahams movies , i didnt like Disco and i dont like Picard. Picard is one of my favourite characters ever and i was hoping Mr. Stewart would never join a show like this.

Gore violence, the Federation putting self interests above saving an entire race, 24th Century totally opposite to what It was in TNG era, pathetic dialogue, Romulans that speak and look like humans, , just but the ears...characters speaking like teenagers. There is no space exploration, no moral dilema, no feeling, no soul.

I dont know how i could stand first 4 episodes, but the (SPOILER ALERT) Icheb scene in the fifth is the end of this hopeless try.

I see a lot of people that seem to like this show, i respect all opinions, but please, how people that cried with Spock's death, when the Enterprise appeared 10 years later in TMP, when Kirk said:
"Second Star to the right" and the Enterprise A headed to the Star for its last asventure can enjoy this. I dont know that the hell is happening with people, with a lot of Star Trek fans...

I dont know what more to say, i just hope Star Trek one day will make the difference again.

Star Trek 2009 is not Star Trek.
Star Trek Into Darkness is not Star Trek
Star Trek Beyond is not Star Trek
Star Trek Discovery is not Star Trek
Star Trek Picard is not Star Trek

This is just my personal opinion, i dont want to start any discussion or ofend anyone.

I dont care what this Star Trek Picard fans say, is not Star Trek and It wont never be. This series doesnt represent Star Trek, Gene Rodenberry's vision. Until Enterprise ended, It evolved but always inside that vision, just in different ways. And im sorry for you guys, but a lot of people thinks like me and there are millions of Star Trek fans that just wont lose time writting about this garbage.

Long live real Star Trek. Fuck this Picard garbage (and JJ / Discovery as well).

I've been a Star Trek fan ever since Kirk was the only captain. I've seen every single Star Trek movie in the movie theater first run. I've read countless comics and novels. You don't get to tell me what is or isn't Star Trek.

There were people in 1979 who said that TMP wasn't Star Trek because they changed the Klingons. They were wrong.

There were people in 1986 who said The Next Generation wasn't Star Trek because you couldn't have Star Trek without Kirk, Spock and McCoy. They were wrong.

There were people in 1992 who said Deep Space Nine wasn't Star Trek because you couldn't have Star Trek without a starship. They were wrong.

There were people in 1994 who said that Voyager wasn't Star Trek because you couldn't do Star Trek without the Federation. They were wrong.

There were people in 2001 who said that Enterprise wasn't Star Trek because there couldn't be an Enterprise before Kirk's Enterprise. They were wrong.

There were people in 2009 who said the JJ movies weren't Star Trek because you couldn't recast Kirk Spock and McCoy. They were wrong.

Finally, we have the people in 2017 and 2020 saying that Discovery and Picard aren't Star Trek and they, like you, are wrong.

All of this has happened before and all this will happen again.

 

[The Old Mixer]

I've been a Star Trek fan ever since Kirk was the only captain. I've seen every single Star Trek movie in the movie theater first run. I've read countless comics and novels. You don't get to tell me what is or isn't Star Trek.

"Now GET OFF MY LAWN!"

 

[SPCTRE]

i dont want to start any discussion

 

[Jinn]

Star Trek 2009 is not Star Trek.
Star Trek Into Darkness is not Star Trek
Star Trek Beyond is not Star Trek
Star Trek Discovery is not Star Trek
Star Trek Picard is not Star Trek

At least Short Treks is safe!

 

[rahullak]

It is nothing, as it is everything.

 

[Dale Sams]

A thread dedicated to people who somehow expected TNG season 8 and were disappointed because PIC is something different would not be a bad idea. If they can let off steam here, they don't have to let off steam elsewhere. reddit, youtube, the pits of the internet and they don't risk becoming pawns of the culture war the usual hate mongers want to incite.

Funny thing is....feels like season 8 to me!! If season 8 were 14 years after Nemesis.

Everything so far is completely plausible. Now the gore...and cursing. Yeah I can't speak for others. If its a turn-off, then sorry. Hope you can get past it. With Icheb, I feel like it was nessecery to explain the mercy killing and the depth of 9's rage.

As for the cursing. Its in the background when i feel its required and as for Admiral Hubris, I feel it was right on the nose.

 

[Gyakuto]

I think I have to sort of agree. Since Enterprise, the new ST’s have a very tenuous link to Roddenberry’s original concept although even Enterprise began deviating from the idea of a series of vignettes with the Xindi storyline. SciFi has had this type of template for some time...an overarching conspiracy story with hidden enemies with a secret agenda and confusing storylines that have to be viewed from afar to make any sense. I first became aware of this with ‘Buffy...’ when she left for University and it all went to sh*t! The other thing about ST is the first few series (seasons) tend to be very ropey at the very least. TNG was cringe-worthy until about series 3-4 and Enterprise took time to ‘bed-in’. I have no doubt Picard will mature in time, too.

Picard is driven by Patrick Stewart. Without him, his history and acting, Picard would be pretty average, but that’s like saying pizza without any flavour would be pretty average: a meaningless idea.

 

[iamzod]

Star Trek needed to evolve & I think it has. It's interesting to see things from outside of the perspective of the Federation & the wider galaxy has in my opinion always been portrayed as a bit of a darker a place. and Some of those darker episodes where we see some of that tend to be some of the best.

Picard isn't a perfect show in my opinion but it's pretty good & the inconsistencies that crop up in my view are not major or jarring as they have been in the past, if anything I appreciate the attention to detail like Icheb's missing cortical node in the last episode. I'm not a fan of the holographic interfaces but we've seen standard type LCARS too so that I can live with.

They can't just keep doing the same thing over & over, TNG ran it's course. It needs to be different or it'll die.

 

[Tarek71]

How is Admiral Clancy worse than Admiral Cartwright, who participated in a cabal coup to assassinate the Federation President and the Klingon chancellor and end any chance for peace? Or Admiral Leyton who conspired to overthrow the Federation Govt and install a military dictatorship? We've seen organized crime, human trafficking, arms dealers, piracy, fraud, and slavery from TOS thru ENT. Some of it from Earth and other Federation citizens and members of Starfleet. Outside the Federation it was always true that these things were going on.

The vision for a better future is aspirational. That work is never done, even if more progress has been made by their time than in our own.

 

[Agony_Boothb]

Hello.
I can't be more dissappointed with this new series. I'm 25, i grew up with Star Trek since my parents showed me some VHSs of The Original Series when i was 2. Since then i have loved this incredible world, from The Cage to the last season of Star Trek Enterprise.

The Federation, space exploration idea, the showing of a future in which humans leave in peace, respecting all forms of Life, aspiring to be better persons and know the universe we are surrounded by, surpassing racism, arrogance, hate, war... has always inspired me, i still think that Will happen in the future.

The epic adventure, wether were moral based episodes or spac battles, unforgettable friendships like Kirk-Spock , Bashir-O'Brien or Archer-T'pol are amazing, all is gone in this new "Star Trek".

Since Enterprise ended, the new Star Trek is not real. I didnt like JJ Abrahams movies , i didnt like Disco and i dont like Picard. Picard is one of my favourite characters ever and i was hoping Mr. Stewart would never join a show like this.

Gore violence, the Federation putting self interests above saving an entire race, 24th Century totally opposite to what It was in TNG era, pathetic dialogue, Romulans that speak and look like humans, , just but the ears...characters speaking like teenagers. There is no space exploration, no moral dilema, no feeling, no soul.

I dont know how i could stand first 4 episodes, but the (SPOILER ALERT) Icheb scene in the fifth is the end of this hopeless try.

I see a lot of people that seem to like this show, i respect all opinions, but please, how people that cried with Spock's death, when the Enterprise appeared 10 years later in TMP, when Kirk said:
"Second Star to the right" and the Enterprise A headed to the Star for its last asventure can enjoy this. I dont know that the hell is happening with people, with a lot of Star Trek fans...

I dont know what more to say, i just hope Star Trek one day will make the difference again.

Star Trek 2009 is not Star Trek.
Star Trek Into Darkness is not Star Trek
Star Trek Beyond is not Star Trek
Star Trek Discovery is not Star Trek
Star Trek Picard is not Star Trek

This is just my personal opinion, i dont want to start any discussion or ofend anyone.

If you don't want to start a discussion why exactly did you post this diatribe? I've liked Star Trek a hell of a lot longer than you and I think Discovery and Picard are worthy additions to the franchise. Discovery actually made me enjoy Star Trek again. You don't get to decide for me or anyone else what it is and what isn't Star Trek. You're so blatantly ignorant to the history of the franchise, that history being, that every spin off including TNG, wasn't Star Trek at some point or another.
I despise fans with attitudes like yours. You make being a trekkie absolutely fucking miserable.

 

[Nightdiamond]

How is Admiral Clancy worse than Admiral Cartwright, who participated in a cabal coup to assassinate the Federation President and the Klingon chancellor and end any chance for peace?

I think STTUC might have won the award for showing future humans at their filthiest.

Murder, racism from the heroes, conspiracy to frame innocent people, and then more murder and then conspiracy to commit more murder.

Ironically pretty much right in the middle of the "golden era" of TNG.

I think part of the blame to this type of backlash can be placed on TNG itself. It was just so idealistic and perfect, its hard looking this new style of Trek.

 

[SJGardner]

These kinds of threads are reaching the point where I'm actually struggling to write something other than what I've already replied with to other threads, be it "all of this has been a part of Star Trek before", "24th century complacency needed a reality check", "just because utopia wavered it's not a dystopia", and "as long as the heroes stand up for what they believe in and fight to preserve an optimistic future, the message is positive."

Alright, now that I've put all my canned panels out, I will say this: I've been a Star Trek fan for 18 years, ever since cable was first installed on our TV, I stumbled upon a rerun of Our Man Bashir and I've been in love with the franchise ever since. However, TNG, Voyager and Enterprise have always felt clean, sterile and formulaic, and increasingly so as I slowly grew up, never really challenging utopia or our character's convictions. Discovery and Picard are the first Trek productions since the Berman era ended that bring back that same childlike excitement and wonder I felt when I first encountered the franchise, and now, as an adult, I'm actually glad we're getting something continuing what DS9 had started, and get to see a more in-depth examination of how this optimistic future works and how it withstands various challenges to it.

 

[Gov Kodos]

These kinds of threads are reaching the point where I'm actually struggling to write something other than what I've already replied with to other threads, be it "all of this has been a part of Star Trek before", "24th century complacency needed a reality check", "just because utopia wavered it's not a dystopia", and "as long as the heroes stand up for what they believe in and fight to preserve an optimistic future, the message is positive."

Alright, now that I've put all my canned panels out, I will say this: I've been a Star Trek fan for 18 years, ever since cable was first installed on our TV, I stumbled upon a rerun of Our Man Bashir and I've been in love with the franchise ever since. However, TNG, Voyager and Enterprise have always felt clean, sterile and formulaic, and increasingly so as I slowly grew up, never really challenging utopia or our character's convictions. Discovery and Picard are the first Trek productions since the Berman era ended that bring back that same childlike excitement and wonder I felt when I first encountered the franchise, and now, as an adult, I'm actually glad we're getting something continuing what DS9 had started, and get to see a more in-depth examination of how this optimistic future works and how it withstands various challenges to it.

The next series will take the shite baton leaving the show to be discussed without the drama. Patience, Grasshopper.

 

[Grendelsbayne]

The next series will take the shite baton leaving the show to be discussed without the drama. Patience, Grasshopper.

Not as long as they're all made by the same management. This thread is full of 'Picard AND Discovery suck'. Add another show to the franchise, they'll just add that show to their list of complaints. It'll take a few years at least before the 'this isn't Star Trek' factor finally starts to rub off, just as it always has in the past.

 

[TedShatner10]

Plus Roddenberry is decades dead and Berman retired many, many years ago, and television Trek was dormant for a very long time, so of course the tone and style was going change (and be informed by the tone of the solid success of the Kelvin films).

For a franchise about tolerance and change, a subsection of the fandom sure seem curiously reactionary...

 

[F. King Daniel]

I really have to update this...