I expect they won't deal with it unless someone decides to deal with it.
Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x14 - "Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2"
- Thread starter Commander Richard
- Start date
I expect they won't deal with it unless someone decides to deal with it.
i expect a bridge where it ought to be - that's the place that got the most medal wrapped around it aka smack in the center of the saucer sectionI expect the material around the bridge is made of the same material blast doors are made of.
A quarter of the ship WAS vaporised by the torpedo. Entire decks were exposed to space, why aren't all the inner decks made of the same material as that one blast door? The shockwave of the torpedo caused damage to discovery and shook up the crew of Enterprise, but Pike who is standing like 2 feet away doesn't feel a thing? Please enlighten us plato.
I like Discovery, but for christ sakes man, you don't have to defend EVERY FUCKING ASPECT OF IT. Some of it is completely worthy of criticism and that stupid torpedo scene is one definitely worthy of it.
It was a 9 overall for me. There were a couple of minor issues... I agree that the blast door scene is a little silly... But even that scene was dramatic and didn't really impact the plot (the admirals sacrifice is the key to that scene whether Pike is there to watch or not), so I'm willing to roll with it.
I actually liked the resolution regarding why Spock never talks about his sister. I see this as a solid solution even why he wouldn't acknowledge having a sister since admitting such leads to questions like "where is she now?" Not acknowledging her at all avoids having to eventually lie or slipping up about her circumstances.
I actually liked the resolution regarding why Spock never talks about his sister. I see this as a solid solution even why he wouldn't acknowledge having a sister since admitting such leads to questions like "where is she now?" Not acknowledging her at all avoids having to eventually lie or slipping up about her circumstances.
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Gonzo
Guest
Yeah but I tend to take note of the exact terms used, it is indeed neutralised but that is not the same as dead, destroyed or purged.
We are also told that Control has been deleted from the present but nothing about whether or not it is purged from the future as they cant possibly know that.
I have no problem if the probe is not resolved and can accept it as the price of aligning the series up with ToS after all the problems they have had behind the scenes, they went so far to try and tie everything up with a nice bow it seems odd that they forgot about that especially as it is the trigger for most of it, I am not buying it, at least not yet and I want to see if it is perhaps covered in the short treks.
Hence why I talked about a reset happening when its resolved as there would not be a Control int he future to send it back in the first place, that could be held back until season 3 though quite easily if Control has gone forward with the Discovery and would not risk a reset or a paradox.
The potential for a reset still exists until we either see it sent back by the Control from Discovery or are explicitly shown that it is being ignored moving forward, perhaps we will have the answer in one of the short treks.
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Gonzo
Guest
A chain is only as strong as its weakest link.I expect the material around the bridge is made of the same material blast doors are made of.
You have a strong wall or bulkhead but it needs a door, you add the door but then realise the hinges will break which means you then strengthen the hinges.
You end up with a door and hinges that are stronger than the wall or bulkhead is and start all over again.
It never really ends but with each change the whole becomes stronger yet their will always be a weak link.
We've seen damaged ships in Trek before. Where are they damaged? In the outer parts. Again, this is consistent with Trek. And we didn't see how much of that section was vaporized, we only saw later how much of it was gone. We weren't shown an old timey glow and a quarter of the saucer section disappear, we saw a chunk with ragged edges. Much of it was probably just been blown out.
And, for the record, I do not defend EVERY FUCKING ASPECT OF DISCOVERY. But I do DEFEND WHAT I SEE AS MAKING SENSE, which I consider reasonable.
But what matter would that be if I did? There are plenty of people here who only come to only bash the show, whether their arguments make any sense or not.
If, for instance, someone were to point out that there is no way all of the small craft seen streaming out of the Enterprise is more than could possibly fit in the ship you wouldn't hear me defending the fact. And actually I find it odd that I haven't seen anybody point that out.
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Gonzo
Guest
It was pointed out, I think it was @BillJ or @King Daniel Beyond
Cant remember exactly who it was and they may have been talking about the shuttles.
Okay. I'm not defending that, because as I see it, it would not be reasonable to do so.
Have to admit I did properly laugh at the torpedo scene, which was obviously the exact opposite of their intention. Loved the bulkhead that has a window in it that exists just so you can watch people dramatically sacrifice themselves behind it, and then the shot of the Enterprise later with a massive hole blown through it, which Pike was somehow shielded from by standing in a turbolift. Pike's turbolift must just work like Indiana Jones' fridge.
Or like the plexiglass shield in Wrath of Khan.
You're the one highlighting it. I said that I liked it that the ladies accomplished things. I said I thought the episode was fun and exciting. The actual highlight was me not having complaints, and then I proceeded to list elements I approved of as examples; and I do believe I said kickass. Since I didn't get the impression that it was an honest question and instead feel that it was bait (with emphasis on feeling), this is the only explanation I will give: in all of sci-fi/action history, women basically saving the day (and not being either one-off examples or plot devices) are in the clear minority (very much including Star Trek). As a woman, I like seeing my gender represented proportionally within the media that I consume (and examples of ensemble casts and teamwork with women not in the minority are very, very rare in this genre). For me, it makes a difference. Representation matters, as it shapes perceptions of reality among the viewership - a proven psychological fact. People who are not affected by issues of representation can get into debates whether it matters, but it does definitely matter. As someone who is affected, I was happy to see this development in this episode. It made me happy. It may not seem like anything to you, but it is something to me. Picking that one element out of my earlier comment is what seems odd from where I'm sitting. Think of it what you will.
Ok. Here is my take on the Torpedo issue, using real world physics combined with Trek tech.
We know Starfleet ships do have some sort of structural integrity field that can be disabled or shot off.
It makes sense that this field can be disabled section wise, if it‘s completely isolated from the rest of the ship.
Which is actually a great system of last resort in the situation we‘ve seen.
It‘s not an issue of closing a door as such, it‘s about closing the gab in the integrity field.
The section that the torpedo is stuck on becomes basically card board compared to the rest of the ship.
Which means it will give way very easily when you apply force and let‘s all the explosive energy harmlessly dissipate away from the rest of the ship by sacrificing that section.
The analogy I was thinking off was a new year‘s explosive going off in your hand.
It will be an entirely different experience if you close or open your fist.
In one scenario you will likely have some mild superficial burns, in the other you go looking for your hand‘s bits in a ten meter radius.
We know Starfleet ships do have some sort of structural integrity field that can be disabled or shot off.
It makes sense that this field can be disabled section wise, if it‘s completely isolated from the rest of the ship.
Which is actually a great system of last resort in the situation we‘ve seen.
It‘s not an issue of closing a door as such, it‘s about closing the gab in the integrity field.
The section that the torpedo is stuck on becomes basically card board compared to the rest of the ship.
Which means it will give way very easily when you apply force and let‘s all the explosive energy harmlessly dissipate away from the rest of the ship by sacrificing that section.
The analogy I was thinking off was a new year‘s explosive going off in your hand.
It will be an entirely different experience if you close or open your fist.
In one scenario you will likely have some mild superficial burns, in the other you go looking for your hand‘s bits in a ten meter radius.
Jesus Christ.
The Ship looked like someone had come along and taken a bite out of it. You literally see the explosion obliterate entire decks on Discovery's view screen along with the shockwave of the explosion which is severe enough to kick the shit out of Discovery and make sparks fly on the bridge. It throws around the Enterprise crew but Pike is completely unaffected, and apparently there are no other blast doors active to minimise the explosion from reaching other areas of the ship? The scene is stupid and makes no logical sense.
It matters, because blindly defending the show, and seeing absolutely nothing wrong with it is just as dumb as bashing the show and seeing everything wrong with it.
Why didn't YOU point it out?
While I tend to agree, sometimes you just have to give way to dramatic license. To the writers, the cool factor simply outweighed any common sense in the scene.
My assumption had been that the bulkhead was meant to signify them containing the explosion in the section where Cornwell was, but the later shot of the Enterprise near the end of the battle shows a whole chunk of the saucer section just straight-up gone. Putting aside how much damage the explosion should or shouldn't have done, I just found it funny that Pike was at literally ground zero of that blast - so, nowhere near the parts of the ship that seem to have just about escaped the blast - and he just walks back on to the bridge unharmed a few seconds later. Like, the deck he was on was destroyed, along with multiple decks above and below it, the area in front of him and behind him was completely destroyed, and his turbolift still carries him to the bridge.
I wrote it off as a miscommunication between the writers, set designers and special effects team - would be far from the first time in Star Trek - but the shot of the heavily-damaged Enterprise really made me laugh.
Does anyone have a screenshot of it? We can spend our afternoon analysing it as if it were the Zapruder film and drawing annotations on it and such.
I wrote it off as a miscommunication between the writers, set designers and special effects team - would be far from the first time in Star Trek - but the shot of the heavily-damaged Enterprise really made me laugh.
Does anyone have a screenshot of it? We can spend our afternoon analysing it as if it were the Zapruder film and drawing annotations on it and such.
Is it equally bad to know there's something wrong with it and just not caring? That would be me. I'm not being snippy. I'm honestly interested in knowing what you guys who don't share my "yay" mentality think.
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Gonzo
Guest
Oh I was not nit picking I was just saying it had been mentioned earlier in the thread as you must have missed it.
Ultimately there will always be those who are simply so happy to have Star Trek back that they dont want to criticise and will defend the show and even the thread like its territory to be defended, while at the other end of the spectrum will be those who are not feeling the show at all and cant help but use ToS as a measuring stick which makes every difference or change an issue to them.
Both perspectives are allowed along with all the shades of grey in between, I normally lurk in the grey and then jump out every now and then simply because it isnt as big a deal to me as it is to some.
Its all down to perspective.
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