Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x06 - "The Sound of Thunder"

[Mr Awe]

Can we not use forced evolution. Bad enough Star Trek writers don't understand evolution but this is the natural Kelpian life cycle. The Ba'ul were culling them at puberty, essentially. Sure, I expect there will be lots of bad consequences from this but there was no forced evolution. There was no change of the species they just didn't get Logan's Run-ed.

Yes, that's a good point. Not evolution. But, the impact remains the same.

 

[oberth]

Does this humanoid seem to possess feminine physical traits? The higher and wider hips, in particular, definitely implies female to me. And short. Probably not much taller than an even 5 feet.

no way to guess the heigth from that - definately has a female touch

 

[Alan Roi]

Can we not use forced evolution. Bad enough Star Trek writers don't understand evolution but this is the natural Kelpian life cycle. The Ba'ul were culling them at puberty, essentially. Sure, I expect there will be lots of bad consequences from this but there was no forced evolution. There was no change of the species they just didn't get Logan's Run-ed.

Well, it was evolution if you are using the Pokemon definition of the word.

 

[BeatleJWOL]

Some people on Twitter are worried reborn Culber lost his gayness along with his scars. I didn't get that vibe at all from the scene, just the standard sci-fi "back from the dead" existential crisis kicking in.

My dad had the same thought. As others have said though, that would be a way out way to bring the character back. I don't think GLAAD would have approved this story direction if that's the way they're heading, and it was reported that they did so as far back as the original death of Culber.

As far as they know, the Angel has now placed the NuKelpiens under its protection and can/will disable their tech again if they do anything other than use it to stay safe.

the showrunners have said that an existing species from a past series will make its return on DSC

These two things originally made me think the Red Angel could be an Organian, but that went out the window with the "person in a tech suit" reveal.

 

[Ovation]

Well, it was evolution if you are using the Pokemon definition of the word.

Which no one should be allowed to do—ever.



(Except my young son, naturally, as well as his peers.)

 

[Jadeb]

With the galactic history from the sphere, Jet Reno's improvisational engineering, Stamets and the spore drive, Tilly's research on the dark matter, Burnham/Spock/Red Angel intersection, Discovery's crew sure looks like its building up to be the originators of the Red Angel which is out repairing something from their future.

Yeah, good call. I could see the person in the suit being Jett herself. Her debut goes to great length to give her a very particular set of skills -- she's a super engineer who can cobble together the almost impossible out of almost nothing, and now the Red Angel is revealed to be a person, apparently female, in a super suit. On top of that, Tig Notaro is a guest star, suggesting her story is finite, and her weird, intermittent presence this season reminds me of L'Rell in her cell -- like she's in placeholder mode until she can do what the writers need her to do. Jett's been brought on to do something important, I think. If she's not the Red Angel, she'll be instrumental in creating or defeating it.

 

[oberth]

Well, it was evolution if you are using the Pokemon definition of the word.

and the pokemon definition is relevant how exactly?

 

[Jackson_Roykirk]

Just for a bit of fun a friend in the Philippines says that Baul means chest of drawers so the Baul are also really useful bits of furnitture.

 

[Gov Kodos]

These two things originally made me think the Red Angel could be an Organian, but that went out the window with the "person in a tech suit" reveal.

Sticking just to TOS, there are a lot of super advanced species, both the Preservers and Gary 7's people come to mind, and they may be the same advanced race. They do (or did) actively interfere on worlds around the galaxy.

 

[Alan Roi]

and the pokemon definition is relevant how exactly?

Word use changes over time. Egregious, for instance, once meant 'outstanding in one's field'. And if by the 23rd century we are encountering creatures who go through rapid transformative phases unlike any on earth, that additional definition might come into vogue, along with generations of impressionable children being allowed to use that phrase to describe such stages as 'evolution'.

 

[Gov Kodos]

Word use changes over time. Egregious, for instance, once meant 'outstanding in one's field'. And if by the 23rd century we are encountering creatures who go through rapid transformative phases unlike any on earth, that additional definition might come into vogue, along with generations of impressionable children being allowed to use that phrase to describe such stages as 'evolution'.

Evolution is a term with a specific meaning in the sciences. Be coy if you want but don't expect respect.

 

[oberth]

Word use changes over time. Egregious, for instance, once meant 'outstanding in one's field'. And if by the 23rd century we are encountering creatures who go through rapid transformative phases unlike any on earth, that additional definition might come into vogue, along with generations of impressionable children being allowed to use that phrase to describe such stages as 'evolution'.

will stick as much as actual definitions of fake news or intelligent design

 

[Alan Roi]

will stick as much as actual definitions of fake news or intelligent design

Funny you should bring up intelligent design in reference to Star Trek. Here's an early ST promoter of that idea (at least with regards to Star Trek reality) we all remember:

 

[oberth]

Funny you should bring up intelligent design in reference to Star Trek. Here's an early ST promoter of that idea (at least with regards to Star Trek reality) we all remember:

that's panspermia not intelligent design

 

[eschaton]

that's panspermia not intelligent design

Technically it's both, since the episode implied that the ancient humanoids left instructions in DNA which "guided" evolution toward a form like their own.

 

[oberth]

Technically it's both, since the episode implied that the ancient humanoids left instructions in DNA which "guided" evolution toward a form like their own.

doesn't id require some sort of a god?

 

[fireproof78]

doesn't id require some sort of a god?

No, just a superior intelligence to orchestrate life. Star Trek is full of superior intelligences so it really shouldn't be that controversial.

 

[XCV330]

doesn't id require some sort of a god?

No. Only intelligence and original intent.

No, just a superior intelligence to orchestrate life. Star Trek is full of superior intelligences so it really shouldn't be that controversial.

our brains got connected in the mycelial network again. i hate it when that happens

 

[oberth]

No, just a superior intelligence to orchestrate life. Star Trek is full of superior intelligences so it really shouldn't be that controversial.

ever tried to sell that to the guys who came up with id?

 

[eschaton]

No, just a superior intelligence to orchestrate life. Star Trek is full of superior intelligences so it really shouldn't be that controversial.

Yeah. ID has been used as a euphamism by creationists to soft-peddle muddlying the waters regarding evolution. But the way it is typically presented (as a "designer" who "guided" evolution) is entirely in line with what the Ancient Humanoids did. IRL there's even some athiest IDers they have historically trotted out for exactly those reasons.

Similarly, IRL it's considered by some physicists to be plausible that humanity in the future could actually create entirely new "baby universes" which could then develop completely independently of our own (have their own mass, flow of time, etc). Thus it's possible our universe was - literally - created and has a creator without god being involved at all.