Spoilers Star Trek: Discovery 2x04 - "An Obol for Charon"

[Hythlodeus]

I can't believe people are dissing Bowie here. If there is ANY 20th century artist/songwriter that has a chance to be listend to in 200 years, of course it is Bowie

 

[Burning Hearts of Qo'nos]

You are correct. Tie-in works, whether they be novels or comics, are generally done on a work-for-hire basis. Which means the author is a hired contractor who does NOT own the copyright on the finished work. It's like being a carpenter and building a porch for somebody; doesn't mean you own the porch or have any say in what's done with it afterwards.

All STAR TREK books and comics are copyrighted in the name of CBS or Paramount or whomever, NOT in the name of the writer or the publisher, which means the contents belong to STAR TREK, who can do with they as they please. (This is not unique to STAR TREK; it's how pretty much all licensed products work.)

TV writing is different because TV writers are unionized.

So, yes, characters in STAR TREK comics belong to STAR TREK, period. No payments would need to be made to any other entity.

I was actually going to edit my post to tag you to ask, so thank you for being one of my writing heros!

 

[Burning Hearts of Qo'nos]

Would make a funny scene and make sense for the time period, but after that 'lets dance to the 300 year music' scene from Season 1, I doubt the writers can think outside the box when it comes to cultural influences.

But its a party! For all we know, Tilly requested that song and everyone was like, 'Uhhhh... wait... actually? Ok, I totally get it!' and party continues.

 

[Noname Given]

Overall for me this one is a 7

Liked:
- The scene with Pike and Number One. I enjoy that Pike is still very 'by the book' when he asks if the inquiry/info Number One found on Spock was 'sanctioned' by Starfleet Command, and her simple look back that read to me as: "Come on...Are you kidding?";, but again in the end because it's one of his officers and a personal friend, he takes the info.

- That they are making Burnham more human here. I did like the way they had her come around to realizing that yes, Spock is family and she needs to be involved and try to reconnect.

- The (IMO) funny visual continuity that after they had the "Save the ship via a 'lightning bolt discharge' sequence - Tilly's hair went from decently groomed, to utterly frizzed up and out due to the static discharge.

- That the Captain and crew didn't immediately think "Oh, it's a life form just trying to communicate..." right off the bat. Pike's response's to the space spore's initial actions were logical - and I did like that (once again) it shows we're in the 23rd century where a Captain CARES about protecting his ship and his crew first; and Pike isn't a 24th century Picard-type who'll just sacrifice ship and crew and needed because "Hey, it's a new life form, and we somehow got in it's way, so we should be the one's bending over backwards here..." I did work out because once they figured out a possible non-violent intent; Pike was open to giving that a chance, but again, I like that were in an era of "Hey, as a Human mine and multiple human lives DO have value that should be weighed, and the Life form went out of it's way to snag us; so not really our fault here..."

Disliked:
- Jet Reno. Sorry, for everyone complaining about Burnham's attitude and 'Mary Sue'-ness ; the character of Jet Reno as written is just a stuck up -"I know it all..(even when I don't) bitch. I hopped that part of her in her first appearance was due to her being stranded alone for 10 months with the huge responsibility of trying to keep her patients alive; and while I didn't expect it to disappear, I'd hope they'd soften her a bit, but no. Tig Notaro is doing a good job of acting the character; but I just hate that type of 'over the top' character and the way this particular one is written. IMO she's a bigger ass then Connolly was - and we all know what happened to him... (YMMV )

- The 'ritual suicide' stuff with Saru, and aspects of Saru in general. Saru is just another character I've never really warmed up to; and again, previously the ONLY thing holding back his 'Gary Stu'-ness WAS his inbred fear instinct. I really hope the character doesn't evolve into being even more insufferable now that he's a mature and fearless Kelpian. Again, Doug Jones does an amazing bit of acting through all those latex prosthetics; but I dislike the character as written to date. (Again YMMV. )

- The Engineering Technobabble. This is one area where the writers are allowing BAD aspect of the Berman & Braga 24th century era to pollute the 23rd century. Yes TOS did the occassional line of technobable here and there - but the whole dialogue sequence between Jet, Stamets, and Tilly leading up to the lightning discharge to save the ship sequence gave m TNG era technobable flashbacks in a BAD way.

- The whole "If we loose Spock's Warp signature now, we'll never get it back...." bit. WTF? It's a specific Warp signature and Spock is most likely on a direct course to somewhere; AND I would hope one of Starfleet's newest and most advanced (for the time) starships would have access to higher Warp speeds than a shuttlecraft...so yeah, didn't care to see this TIRED trope to ramp up the 'plot complications' involved.

If not for Jet and the Technobable, and the overused trope, I probably would have given this one an 8; but no, it gets a 7 from me.

 

[eschaton]

Was this a 'bottle show'?
I don't recall any new sets and they didn't leave the ship.

I don't think it technically qualifies because a true bottle show also has no guest cast, and there were quite a few guest characters depending upon your definition (Number One, Reno, voice of May, Naan, etc).

 

[Nyotarules]

But its a party! For all we know, Tilly requested that song and everyone was like, 'Uhhhh... wait... actually? Ok, I totally get it!' and party continues.

A beats, a beat right

 

[Kor]

They can have the characters enjoy classical and jazz, and we the viewers complain that it's stuffy and antiquated.
They can make up imaginary pop/rock stuff, and then it's some awful, silly noise like in TNG "Suddenly Human."

Or they can just exercise some "wink-wink" levity and use stuff that we are familiar with on a popular level.

Kor

 

[cooleddie74]

The technobabble is starting to annoy the crap out of me. ENT did it more or less just right and VOY went waaaay overboard with it on a pretty regular basis so I was kind of hoping that being set in an earlier timeframe would mean we'd hear less of the usual fifteen-lines-of-dialogue-to-explain-how-to-press-a-button monologuing going on, but modern Trek seems dialed into sounding as techy and kewl as possible so I think some of it may be completely unavoidable at this point in the franchise.

 

[WarpFactorZ]

In the 23rd century, David Bowie and Prince are considered timeless composers of classical music.

Kor

And Billy Joel is the rage in the 25th century on Union starships... Unfortunately, Discovery went a bit too Orville on that one.

 

[Noname Given]

Stamets has apparently never been intended to be the "proper" Chief Engineer.

A display in "Choose Your Pain" (DSC) did list him by that title:

But according to Ted Sullivan, that was "a flub." (Nevertheless, as it was prominently seen onscreen, we might posit that Stamets did act in that capacity during the time when the ship's primary mission was to get the spore drive working.)

-MMoM

But remember - Stamets has posted his resignation to the U.S.S. Discovery and accepted a permanent teaching position at the Vulcan Science Academy that he will assume once Pike's mission is over - so he may have been the Chief Enginner once; but after said resignation Starfleet gave the position to someone else - and as it's a promotion, Pike doesn't want to rescind the change and possibly negatively affect the work attitude of the new Chief Enigineer.
^^^
And with one run-on sentence this YATI is resolved.

 

[Greg Cox]

Exactly, even music from the ENT era would be way old, over 100 years old and would be her great grand parents music. If I started singing White Cliffs of Dover by Vera Lynn (an English singer who is 101 years old) as my favourite song my peers would find that unusual and I'm over 50.

Citing Prince and Bowie in one episode was pushing it, but let's note that Tilly is supposed to be an oddball misfit, who probably didn't listen to the same music her peers did when she was a teen.

And I'm always glad to see Trek move beyond the idea that future people prefer classical musical, Gilbert & Sullivan, and other "highbrow" art and culture. If Picard can like his old detective novels, and Paris can like old "Captain Proton" serials, and Spock is familiar with the literary work of such masters as Jacqueline Susann and Harold Robbins, I can live with Tilly liking classic rock from the 20th century . . . . .

 

[Kor]

As far as 20th-century music goes, ST09 did it first, anyway.

Kor

 

[Rusty0918]

Well, Noname Given you have a point about the engineering technobabble, but at least they didn't use it to get themselves out of trouble. However I do disagree with you about Jet Reno. But I'm not going to complain, you're entitled to your opinion.

I'd like to see what happens with Saru though. He's experiencing something that to him (emphasis on *TO HIM*) none of his other kind has ever experienced. That will be interesting going forward, although I don't want to see him turning to the annoying.

I think it holds as a 9 for me (though I voted as a 10 initially).

 

[eschaton]

Or they can just exercise some "wink-wink" levity and use stuff that we are familiar with on a popular level.

Kor

It would honestly be fantastic if we found out something which today gets no cred at all gets remembered as one of the classics of the ages in retrospect. You could have the excuse that a lot of digital storage was lost during WW3, meaning their knowledge of late 20th/early 21st century music was actually kinda incomplete.

 

[Burning Hearts of Qo'nos]

A beats, a beat right

I will be the first to agree that a good beat will always be a good beat . I very much would have enjoyed that party. Especially that bonkers impossible version of beer pong they were playing! I tried to get my friends to do it but we couldn't agree on the rules. We were also way too old to be trying to invent new forms of beer pong.

 

[MakeshiftPython]

In the 23rd century, David Bowie and Prince are considered timeless composers of classical music.

Kor

Not out of the realm of possibilities.

But hey, maybe in real life Bowie will be largely forgotten and Nickelback will still be the rage...

I kid.

 

[cooleddie74]

Don't claim to know 23rd century pop music tastes if you can't name this sick-ass power duo.

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[Nyotarules]

Renaissance Fairs.

What are those?

They can have the characters enjoy classical and jazz, and we the viewers complain that it's stuffy and antiquated.
They can make up imaginary pop/rock stuff, and then it's some awful, silly noise like in TNG "Suddenly Human."

Or they can just exercise some "wink-wink" levity and use stuff that we are familiar with on a popular level.

Kor

Or they can have human characters, who enjoy their modern, made alien up music, (its the future its not supposed to be NASA in space), or all types of jazz, classical pop, Bangra beats, Afrobeats etc). Just as youth of the 1950's embraced strange 'negro music' which is now as normal as breathing I suspect youth of the Star Trek universe like a bit of Andorian punk or its equivalent. Something their parents consider too loud and too strange. The Federation is over 100 years in the DISC era by now human tastes should be eclectic.

 

[Amaris]

Or they can have human characters, who enjoy their modern, made alien up music, (its the future its not supposed to be NASA in space), or all types of jazz, classical pop, Bangra beats, Afrobeats etc). Just as youth of the 1950's embraced strange 'negro music' which is now as normal as breathing I suspect youth of the Star Trek universe like a bit of Andorian punk or its equivalent. Something their parents consider too loud and too strange. The Federation is over 100 years in the DISC era by now human tastes should be eclectic.

They are eclectic. Tilly loves her some Bowie.

Just like I loved Metallica's "Master of Puppets" AND Bach's Double Violin Concerto in D Minor.

 

[GhostLoveScore]

Tilly's favorite music, I'd think, would be from the 2230s-2250s. Maybe she likes some of her parents' music.

I don't know, if you think about it, there really wasn't popular music 200 years ago. Today we listen to songs that are 50, 60 years old. I don't see why they will not be listened to some 200 years from now.